Rotella 15w-40?

[atrdrvr7]

I have been running the 15w-40 dino rotella for about 6 months now. I change my oil every other ride also. Last week while riding here in Texas at near 100 degrees the bike got a little hard to shift. Nothing to bad. Just noticed it was different. The bike had fresh oil and clutch pack is only about 4 rides old.

Just wondering what are the heat qualities of Rotella compared to something like Amsoil or Yamalube. Any guys riding in warm climates notice any problems.

[weantright]

I can tell you it’s not the oil. I prefer the synthetic Rotella but have used it in my diesel where the heat is a lot hotter and more shearing is going on. On average synthetic oils will have a better heat range vs. dyno. I will only run synthetic oils in my motors and Rotella dyno on the tranny side if split. Oil is cheap so change it if you feel it’s a problem.

[indy rider]

Personally, I didn't like Rotella. Shifting would get notchy and finding neutral would become more difficult at about the 4-5 hr point. I switched to Yamalube(dino) like two years ago and would never go back. It will easily go 3 hrs longer before noticing any shifting difference and the used Yamalube looks great when it comes out. I now do oil changes at 8hrs unless I raced, then it gets changed immediately.

[SlowDinoDog]

It's not the dino Rotella. The 15W-40 is more than adequate for 100F. I ride slow single track in hotter weather (in AZ) all the time with it.

Since your clutch is new, maybe your lever just needs a little adjustment after a few rides. (Also, IMO the blue bikes don't have the best clutches and trannies, anyway.)

You can believe the hype about synthetic oils, if you wish. If you change your oil regularly, the viscocity of a high quality dino oil like Rotella will not break down before your oil change.

Most people use synthetics because "Oil is cheap" and they are not sure if it makes a difference, but they think if they pay more, it might be better, so "why take a chance.":bonk:

Pretty poor logic from an engineering perspective. You could achieve the same results as synthetics by using a high quality dino oil and lighting a dollar bill on fire every time you change your oil, if that would make you feel better.?

Could I afford to use the most expensive oil on the market? Sure. But I prefer the convenience of buying oil from my local auto store and keep a couple of jugs of 15W-40 Rotella on my garage shelf to use for for all my bikes, including my CRF450X with separate engine and tranny oil.?

Don't know about starting in cold weather though. If it's colder than 50F, I don't ride.?

[SUnruh]

well considering that i did most (about 98%) of my 60+ oil tests here in central texas i can say that it is up to the task.

if it was fresh change then it should have been good to go!

SRT is made for twin turbo diesels that grow all of the food you eat and bring all the goods to the stores you shop at. i doubt it was the oil.

[atrdrvr7]

Thanks guys. I think I will return the Amsoil I bought today.

[SlowDinoDog]

or...do an experiment. Run the Amsoil for a couple of rides and then run the Rotella for a couple of rides and let us know if you can tell the difference:thumbsup:

[nokickstandsallowed]

or...do an experiment. Run the Amsoil for a couple of rides and then run the Rotella for a couple of rides and let us know if you can tell the difference:thumbsup:

Yes, that could isolate the root source - if say there is something else going on. It never hurts to experiment between oils; however, I have found that if I stick with the same oil used during a rebuild, the bikes friction plates tend to react the same unless I go above the four and a half hour mark on Rotella at 106° here in TN. That was not the actual temperature, that was the feel like temperature with the heat index added in. Actual temp was 98°. I have never seen so many record breaking temperatures in odd places all at once like this. Man that was some warm, dry weather compared to like a tropical environment such as Florida. ? Texas is definitely the dry heat.

Edited September 13, 2011 by nokickstandsallowed
Clarification on heat index feel like temperature versus actual temperature.

[weantright]

It's not the dino Rotella. The 15W-40 is more than adequate for 100F. I ride slow single track in hotter weather (in AZ) all the time with it.

Since your clutch is new, maybe your lever just needs a little adjustment after a few rides. (Also, IMO the blue bikes don't have the best clutches and trannies, anyway.)

You can believe the hype about synthetic oils, if you wish. If you change your oil regularly, the viscocity of a high quality dino oil like Rotella will not break down before your oil change.

Most people use synthetics because "Oil is cheap" and they are not sure if it makes a difference, but they think if they pay more, it might be better, so "why take a chance.":bonk:

Pretty poor logic from an engineering perspective. You could achieve the same results as synthetics by using a high quality dino oil and lighting a dollar bill on fire every time you change your oil, if that would make you feel better.?

Could I afford to use the most expensive oil on the market? Sure. But I prefer the convenience of buying oil from my local auto store and keep a couple of jugs of 15W-40 Rotella on my garage shelf to use for for all my bikes, including my CRF450X with separate engine and tranny oil.?

Don't know about starting in cold weather though. If it's colder than 50F, I don't ride.?

In a bike your correct, most change before needed, but elsewhere you are far off. My oil analysis proved in my diesel truck Rotella dyno would last 8-9,000 miles before the shear forces destroyed the oil. Synthetic Rotella still had protecting properties after 15,000 miles however the higher metals from normal wear was too high. I now use Rotella synthetic and change it at 12,000 miles with a filter in between. My bike has 200 hrs all on Amsoil ($8.50 qt.) with no issues or replaced parts. The valves, cam and chain are like new and I know it is the oil I used. I believe in synthetic oils and the old saying “pay now or pay later”. At $13 for oil (1.5 qts.) changed every 500 miles is cheap and adds up to $100 for 3500 miles. So the savings would maybe $60 over 3500 miles and I bet something would need to be replaced.

[oldnbold]

I disagree with these guys on the 15/40 not being up to the task. It's been waaaaayyyyyyyy hot here in TX this summer. 15/40 works ok in this heat as long as your not overdoing the clutch, which I do. If you're trail riding and slipping the clutch a bunch, the 15/40 gets notchy. Not bad, but noticeable.

When it gets over 95, I switch to valvoline vr1 in straight 40W or 50w. The problem goes away.

[nokickstandsallowed]

If you're trail riding and slipping the clutch a bunch, the 15/40 gets notchy. Not bad, but noticeable.

I couldn't agree more. The Rotella is definitely up to the task for the style of short track MX endurance riding I do. If I were on a very long type of all day trail riding and it was 106 degrees, I would probably switch up myself. I would have to re-gear the final drive ratio and other things before I would be comfortable with that style of riding. Depending on the persons riding technique and how hard they push the bike, I think that would ultimately have an immediate bearing on the type of oil used. As mentioned before, heat would not bother this Rotella as much as some would think or anticipate.

[Goofball1205]

I had notchy shifting issues and really hard to find neutral for awhile. I feel the stock clutch is pretty crappy. Burned mine up in less then 10 hours on my 08 I've heard of several others doing the same as well. I think there is an oil flow issue in the design of the clutch pack. I ended up buying a clutch pack from tusk racing. The steel plates are dimpled so they retain oil a little better. I didn't use the fiber plates from the tusk kit because I thought the OEM's looked better so I left them in. Haven't had notchy shifting or slipping issues since. Now at 75 hours. I've always used Rotella 15-40 dyno oil in it as well changed at 5 hours. Most of my racing is Motocross 15-20 minute motos on practice days in Michigan. Had some unusually hot days I rode in this summer up around 98.

[nokickstandsallowed]

I had notchy shifting issues and really hard to find neutral for awhile. I feel the stock clutch is pretty crappy. Burned mine up in less then 10 hours on my 08 I've heard of several others doing the same as well. I think there is an oil flow issue in the design of the clutch pack. I ended up buying a clutch pack from tusk racing. The steel plates are dimpled so they retain oil a little better. I didn't use the fiber plates from the tusk kit because I thought the OEM's looked better so I left them in. Haven't had notchy shifting or slipping issues since. Now at 75 hours. I've always used Rotella 15-40 dyno oil in it as well changed at 5 hours. Most of my racing is Motocross 15-20 minute motos on practice days in Michigan. Had some unusually hot days I rode in this summer up around 98.

Yes, that dimpled design on the steels helped a lot of guys with the scenario you describe in the '08 design flow issue, from what I read anyways. I was having an analytical debate with myself on whether or not to keep the stock fibers in my '07 when I switched to the Tusk pack; but, figured I bought the pack all new, why not use it all? ?.

[off_road_4_me]

I used rotella t for one oil change and one only in my wr. I didn't like the feel (I do long desert races in the heat) for that matter, I didn't find a single 10/15w40 that I liked. I presently use a 20w50 and the clutch feels great, it shifts smoother and imo just feels better all around, and the manual says its good for down to 50(?) degrees. So, IMO, the chart should be read that 10w40 is "safe" for up to 100* heat, but a heavier weight oil is prefered.

just note that this is personal opinion and I have not run oil tests.

[nokickstandsallowed]

I used rotella t for one oil change and one only in my wr. I didn't like the feel (I do long desert races in the heat) for that matter, I didn't find a single 10/15w40 that I liked. I presently use a 20w50 and the clutch feels great, it shifts smoother and imo just feels better all around, and the manual says its good for down to 50(?) degrees. So, IMO, the chart should be read that 10w40 is "safe" for up to 100* heat, but a heavier weight oil is prefered.

just note that this is personal opinion and I have not run oil tests.

That is exactly why I was so specifically adamant about when I had rebuilt my bike, that I used the same oil (brand) I soaked the clutch pack in. I just simply only have a little time to read about, not specifically run tests. I intend to use the same brand for the life of this bottom end, and have no intentions of changing the type of riding style I do until maybe the next hot snap.

I wish that I had more time to compare the oils today from my analytical data obtained while I was active military. You know, stuff like: reports on viscosity and all that great stuff that comes along with some of the bottled lies sold today ?

In all fairness, my respect goes out to SUnruh for taking the time to share his experiences and helping the fellow TT community to make better decisions on their oil choices.

[SlowDinoDog]

In a bike your correct, most change before needed, but elsewhere you are far off. My oil analysis proved in my diesel truck Rotella dyno would last 8-9,000 miles before the shear forces destroyed the oil. Synthetic Rotella still had protecting properties after 15,000 miles however the higher metals from normal wear was too high. I now use Rotella synthetic and change it at 12,000 miles with a filter in between. My bike has 200 hrs all on Amsoil ($8.50 qt.) with no issues or replaced parts. The valves, cam and chain are like new and I know it is the oil I used. I believe in synthetic oils and the old saying “pay now or pay later”. At $13 for oil (1.5 qts.) changed every 500 miles is cheap and adds up to $100 for 3500 miles. So the savings would maybe $60 over 3500 miles and I bet something would need to be replaced.

I change my oil well before 8,000 miles, well before the shear forces reduce the viscocity of the dino Rotella 15W-40 oil. So, is there any reason to pay more money for an oil that lasts longer? Just asking...

[SUnruh]

if you dont think 15w40 is up to the task, then by all means go to the 20w50 or sae50.

just understand what ambient temps you are starting at when cold.

as chris (oldnbold) pointed out Valvoline VR1 20w50 or SAE50 are pretty darn awesome oils and i have tested both. in my top 5 list! a tad cheaper would be exxon superflo 20w50. if you want super spendy and top of my list -> maxima 4 extra 15w50 or motul 5100 10w50, but you are getting a very thin wallet for it too!

steve

[weantright]

I change my oil well before 8,000 miles, well before the shear forces reduce the viscocity of the dino Rotella 15W-40 oil. So, is there any reason to pay more money for an oil that lasts longer? Just asking...

For me it cost the same and synthetics can sit longer as my truck doesn't get used much. I also feel the synthetics will adhere to the surfaces better than dyno giving another barrier for wear. Look past the extra $$ and do the math with extended miles vs. dyno.

[Goofball1205]

I also feel the synthetics will adhere to the surfaces better than dyno giving another barrier for wear.

Not trying to bag on you but what data do you have to support this claim? You feel it adheres better? SUnruh has hard data to back up his claims. If you have some data to back this up great but otherwise it seems to clutter up these threads.

[SlowDinoDog]

Here's the logic I'm struggling with.?

The viscocity of all oils, synth and dino, begins to degrade immediately with use (shearing forces change the molecular structure of the oil.)

We consider a "good" oil an oil that maintains it's viscocity longer.

Now, let's say the viscocity of brand X dino decreases by 10% after 1000 mi of use, and brand Y synth decreases 10% after 2000 mi. (I'm making these numbers up)

Let's also say that I change my oil after 250 miles. Neither oil has lost an amount of viscocity necessary to cause a measurable difference in wear.

So, why buy the synth?? Just asking.?