Wheel chocks and tie down systems tricks?

[pinrov]

I need to tie down 3 play bikes on an open trailer.  Not gonna pony-up for Lock-n-Load footpeg clamps for them.  So I bought the $25 wheel chocks from Rocky.

I can put the front wheel in the chock and then use tie-down straps on each side of the handlebars to keep it from tipping over or backing out of the chock -- same way as I always put a bike in the back of my pickup.

But is there an easier way?

I see some clamping wheel chocks, and some pictures of how people strap the wheel into the chock.  Ok, I know there's some clamping chocks like Motorsport Products or Pit Posse Bike Shoe that come with a claim of not needing straps, but they only fit particular wheel sizes (not necessarily 19" or 17" playbikes).

Is there a trick to strap a wheel into a standard chock?  I don't think strapping the front wheel into a chock alone will keep a bike from flopping over.  What about chocking the rear wheel instead?  Swingarm stands hold the bike pretty steady, so maybe there's something to holding the bike that way rather than by the front wheel.

[DON JUAN]

The easiest and simplest way to tie down mcs in an open trailer is the way you are doing it. I would secure the rear tire to keep from bouncing around on trailer and hitting the other mcs. I have tried to make the footpeg tie down system myself, but did not trust them. I'm cheap, but not very trusting. There is nothing like seeing a mc bouncing off of an open trailer. UGGG!! Nuff said.  

[Sacrifice]

Footpeg tiedowns are easy and secure.

Same style used on the rack-n-ride. Never worried about my bike falling off doing this stuff. Front wheel chock is just for a loading stop pretty much.

[BSAVictor]

Just a note here.  Sometimes people forget or don't know to make sure that front tie down straps are secured either in line with or behind the front forks, ESPECIALLY WHERE THERE ARE NO TIE DOWNS BEING USED TO SECURE THE REAR OF THE BIKE.  Think about it;  the tie downs otherwise are effectively pulling the bike somewhat forward over the front wheel--a factor that comes more significantly into play when you make a hard slow-down or stop with the tow vehicle.  This faulty tie down mounting method of securing the tie downs in a line forward of the forks (and no tie downs on the rear of the bike) is often better gotten-away-with in pick up beds--- that have a higher height than many trailers.  A contributing factor to improper tie down securing is that standard tie down securing points in pick up beds are usually not mounted in the right places for securing motorcycles....

Edited March 2, 2022 by BSAVictor

[Piney Woods]

WOW!

[Sacrifice]

On 3/2/2022 at 12:57 AM, BSAVictor said:

Just a note here.  Sometimes people forget or don't know to make sure that front tie down straps are secured either in line with or behind the front forks, ESPECIALLY WHERE THERE ARE NO TIE DOWNS BEING USED TO SECURE THE REAR OF THE BIKE.  Think about it;  the tie downs otherwise are effectively pulling the bike somewhat forward over the front wheel--a factor that comes more significantly into play when you make a hard slow-down or stop with the tow vehicle.  This faulty tie down mounting method of securing the tie downs in a line forward of the forks (and no tie downs on the rear of the bike) is often better gotten-away-with in pick up beds--- that have a higher height than many trailers.  A contributing factor to improper tie down securing is that standard tie down securing points in pick up beds are usually not mounted in the right places for securing motorcycles....

It doesnt matter if the straps are in line or behind the forks. The fork still gets loaded which is the goal.

Having a loose rear tire ultimately doesnt effect anything if the front is secured enough. Just a matter of making sure the tire cant fall off the trailer if it doesnt have walls. I have never secured a rear wheel in truck or trailer.

Edited March 3, 2022 by Sacrifice

[Debi Johnson]

8 minutes ago, Sacrifice said:

It doesnt matter if the straps are in line or behind the forks. The fork still gets loaded which is the goal.

Having a loose rear tire ultimately doesnt effect anything if the front is secured enough. Just a matter of making sure the tire cant fall off the trailer if it doesnt have walls. I have never secured a rear wheel in truck or trailer.

THIS^^^^^^^^^^^^

[BSAVictor]

27 minutes ago, Sacrifice said:

It doesnt matter if the straps are in line or behind the forks. The fork still gets loaded which is the goal.

Having a loose rear tire ultimately doesnt effect anything if the front is secured enough. Just a matter of making sure the tire cant fall off the trailer if it doesnt have walls. I have never secured a rear wheel in truck or trailer.

And "the fork still gets loaded" when you do a forward wheelie/stoppie, too.  Think about it...

My post above simply follows the instructions provided with good quality tie downs; just because a person gets away with strapping bikes down the wrong way for years doesn't make it the right way.  You get away with it until you don't---like when somebody cuts off your tow vehicle and you stop sharply, etc.

[Sacrifice]

8 minutes ago, BSAVictor said:

And "the fork still gets loaded" when you do a forward wheelie/stoppie, too.  Think about it...

My post above simply follows the instructions provided with good quality tie downs; just because a person gets away with strapping bikes down the wrong way for years doesn't make it the right way.  You get away with it until you don't---like when somebody cuts off your tow vehicle and you stop sharply, etc.

what does having the forks/straps in-line change anything about that? you arent going to flip the bike slamming on your brakes either.

Edited March 3, 2022 by Sacrifice

[BSAVictor]

3 minutes ago, Sacrifice said:

what does having the forks/straps in-line change anything about that? you arent going to flip the bike slamming on your brakes either.

If you REALLY want the answer to your question, THINK about the physics of the tie down securing the bike in-line with or behind the fork line--that strap positioning pulls the bike down toward the tow surface, whereas having the straps forward of the fork line tends to pull the bike up from the tow surface.  Why do you think a tie down manufacturer would have the instructions that I'm referring to?

I'm not an engineer, but I've had two of them explain/confirm to me the sound principles behind those instructions and once I actually took awhile to think about it--it made sense to me.

[BSAVictor]

29 minutes ago, BSAVictor said:

If you REALLY want the answer to your question, THINK about the physics of the tie down securing the bike in-line with or behind the fork line--that strap positioning pulls the bike down toward the tow surface, whereas having the straps forward of the fork line tends to pull the bike up from the tow surface.  Why do you think a tie down manufacturer would have the instructions that I'm referring to?

I'm not an engineer, but I've had two of them explain/confirm to me the sound principles behind those instructions and once I actually took awhile to think about it--it made sense to me.

The two engineers who 'splained the tie down physics to me were my brothers.  Some examples of their work: one of them worked with designing the TOW anti-tank missile, and the other with designing the Minuteman II ICBM guidance system.  They knew something about physics in the real world.  We rode off road motorcycles together for more than 50 years.

Edited March 3, 2022 by BSAVictor

[Sacrifice]

1 hour ago, BSAVictor said:

The two engineers who 'splained the tie down physics to me were my brothers.  Some examples of their work: one of them worked with designing the TOW anti-tank missile, and the other with designing the Minuteman II ICBM guidance system.  They knew something about physics in the real world.  We rode off road motorcycles together for more than 50 years.

Whatever you need to justify it. 

For the same tension on the strap yes there will be less force into the floor of the bed when pulling forward of the forks. But it isnt going to be significantly different to cause any less stability at the low loads/angles we use. Theres no force "pulling up" the bike as you state.

Edited March 3, 2022 by Sacrifice

[BSAVictor]

50 minutes ago, Sacrifice said:

Whatever you need to justify it. 

For the same tension on the strap yes there will be less force into the floor of the bed when pulling forward of the forks. But it isnt going to be significantly different to cause any less stability at the low loads/angles we use. Theres no force "pulling up" the bike as you state.

I'm interested in loading my bikes according to sound principles, similar to how I ride--not to get out of an online blustering corner I painted myself into. I'm not the pioneer or "inventor" of this principle, I'm just passing it along.  And I appreciate it when countless TTers have passed along tips they have gathered along their ways, and I get to thereby have a better motorcycling experience--along with people around me.

If you just take a moment longer, you'd notice, e.g., how your peg-securing tie downs on the hitch hauler in the photo you posted above illustrate the principle I'm simply pointing out. The peg-securing tie-downs are behind the fork line.

You have not addressed the question as to why tie down manufacturers provide the same advice I'm just passing along.

Again, just slow down enough thought-wise to picture how the forces work with tie downs forward of the forks, tending to pull the bike forward around the axis formed with the front wheel/axle, particularly with no tie downs on the rear of the bike.  And yes, as long as you don't exceed a certain physics property forward, your loaded bike will not come loose (assuming all securing components are sound); but if you encounter a sudden, heavy slowing or stopping, all bets are off.  It's physics, and you can ignore it all you want, but at some point it can catch up to you and to people in traffic around your tow vehicle.

Edited March 3, 2022 by BSAVictor

[Sacrifice]

25 minutes ago, BSAVictor said:

I'm interested in loading my bikes according to sound principles, similar to how I ride--not to get out of an online blustering corner I painted myself into. I'm not the pioneer or "inventor" of this principle, I'm just passing it along.  And I appreciate it when countless TTers have passed along tips they have gathered along their ways, and I get to thereby have a better motorcycling experience--along with people around me.

If you just take a moment longer, you'd notice, e.g., how your peg-securing tie downs on the hitch hauler in the photo you posted above illustrate the principle I'm simply pointing out. The peg-securing tie-downs are behind the fork line.

You have not addressed the question as to why tie down manufacturers provide the same advice I'm just passing along.

Again, just slow down enough thought-wise to picture how the forces work with tie downs forward of the forks, tending to pull the bike forward around the axis formed with the front wheel/axle, particularly with no tie downs on the rear of the bike.  And yes, as long as you don't exceed a certain physics property forward, your loaded bike will not come loose (assuming all securing components are sound); but if you encounter a sudden, heavy slowing or stopping, all bets are off.  It's physics, and you can ignore it all you want, but at some point it can catch up to you and to people in traffic around your tow vehicle.

I know exactly how it works and i just explained it to you. Feel free to tie it down how you like but its not making a difference

[BSAVictor]

5 minutes ago, Sacrifice said:

I know exactly how it works and i just explained it to you. Feel free to tie it down how you like but its not making a difference

And why do tie down manufacturers provide the same advice I'm passing along, and contrary to yours?

[Leaving Reno]

On 2/10/2022 at 3:13 PM, pinrov said:

I need to tie down 3 play bikes on an open trailer.  Not gonna pony-up for Lock-n-Load footpeg clamps for them.  So I bought the $25 wheel chocks from Rocky.

I can put the front wheel in the chock and then use tie-down straps on each side of the handlebars to keep it from tipping over or backing out of the chock -- same way as I always put a bike in the back of my pickup.

But is there an easier way?

I see some clamping wheel chocks, and some pictures of how people strap the wheel into the chock.  Ok, I know there's some clamping chocks like Motorsport Products or Pit Posse Bike Shoe that come with a claim of not needing straps, but they only fit particular wheel sizes (not necessarily 19" or 17" playbikes).

Is there a trick to strap a wheel into a standard chock?  I don't think strapping the front wheel into a chock alone will keep a bike from flopping over.  What about chocking the rear wheel instead?  Swingarm stands hold the bike pretty steady, so maybe there's something to holding the bike that way rather than by the front wheel.

Post a picture of your trailer and the wheel chocks, might be able to give better advice and it will also help with the physics calculations. ?

[BSAVictor]

13 hours ago, BSAVictor said:

I'm interested in loading my bikes according to sound principles, similar to how I ride--not to get out of an online blustering corner I painted myself into. I'm not the pioneer or "inventor" of this principle, I'm just passing it along.  And I appreciate it when countless TTers have passed along tips they have gathered along their ways, and I get to thereby have a better motorcycling experience--along with people around me.

If you just take a moment longer, you'd notice, e.g., how your peg-securing tie downs on the hitch hauler in the photo you posted above illustrate the principle I'm simply pointing out. The peg-securing tie-downs are behind the fork line.

You have not addressed the question as to why tie down manufacturers provide the same advice I'm just passing along.

Again, just slow down enough thought-wise to picture how the forces work with tie downs forward of the forks, tending to pull the bike forward around the axis formed with the front wheel/axle, particularly with no tie downs on the rear of the bike.  And yes, as long as you don't exceed a certain physics property forward, your loaded bike will not come loose (assuming all securing components are sound); but if you encounter a sudden, heavy slowing or stopping, all bets are off.  It's physics, and you can ignore it all you want, but at some point it can catch up to you and to people in traffic around your tow vehicle.

In over 50 years of riding, I never really needed a helmet---except twice.

[SMarquez]

On 3/3/2022 at 10:18 AM, BSAVictor said:

I'm interested in loading my bikes according to sound principles, similar to how I ride--not to get out of an online blustering corner I painted myself into. I'm not the pioneer or "inventor" of this principle, I'm just passing it along.  And I appreciate it when countless TTers have passed along tips they have gathered along their ways, and I get to thereby have a better motorcycling experience--along with people around me.

If you just take a moment longer, you'd notice, e.g., how your peg-securing tie downs on the hitch hauler in the photo you posted above illustrate the principle I'm simply pointing out. The peg-securing tie-downs are behind the fork line.

You have not addressed the question as to why tie down manufacturers provide the same advice I'm just passing along.

Again, just slow down enough thought-wise to picture how the forces work with tie downs forward of the forks, tending to pull the bike forward around the axis formed with the front wheel/axle, particularly with no tie downs on the rear of the bike.  And yes, as long as you don't exceed a certain physics property forward, your loaded bike will not come loose (assuming all securing components are sound); but if you encounter a sudden, heavy slowing or stopping, all bets are off.  It's physics, and you can ignore it all you want, but at some point it can catch up to you and to people in traffic around your tow vehicle.

I've been tying down bikes like this for 50 years. I've never tied down a rear wheel. Never had a need to make my bike look like it was caught in a spider web.

[Debi Johnson]

Been loading bikes for 50+ years and only ever use two tie downs. Just two on the bars or even use a cheater strap around fork tubes.

 

 

[Nigel18]

Do it the way you doing it now.
don’t overload your forks you can cause seal leaks over time. Get a plastic gadget to go between the wheel and wheel fender to stop you over tightening and prevent motion while traveling. Or make your own with 2x4 wood ? And if you do strap the rear wheels down you don’t have to have to strap the front nearly as tight. I also found using clamp/cleat style straps vrs ratchet in the front is a must so that you can control the rate of release otherwise you will picking up bikes ? as for the rear wheel I like to use a ratchet it allows you to fine tune the tension, “just firm” no need to crank it to death. 

With cleat straps I also tie one loose knot close to the cleat so even if it cleat were to slip it can not let go. I have never had it slip but a friend has had his give way. I then roll the excess strap back on itself and tuck it into the cleat, this makes for a neat set up, less wind flap and it’s impossible for the cleat to open with the strap tucked like this.