Real World Comparison - KTM 500 Vortex ECU, GET ECU and JD Tuner Comparison

[Ultra61]

I talked w Mike about the "GET" .. when it came to ordering, he said order on line ? .. I see on line there reference under 500 EXC-F they will customize I see nowhere a personal preference other then notes about your order I could fill in, no specific question/s.

Mike said Map #1 is ripping .. Map #2 you're lucky to lift the front in any gear ? how is that customizing? (He described 2 maps only) No offense, can someone tell me what I'm not understanding. I did feel rushed on the phone w him and he talked over me.

Edited February 18, 2020 by Ultra61

[cman60]

Thanks for the great comparison. I think after reading this I will go with the Vortex. Again, awesome job, very informative.

[motometal]

Would be great to update for 2020.  

[Hodakaguy]

15 hours ago, Ultra61 said:

Does it matter whether you buy a get from Taco Moto or Slavens?

 

Yes with the GET you are buying a delivery vehicle with whatever MAP that the seller has installed, I've never tested a Slavens GET compared to a Taco Moto unit to see how the two maps compare.  I will say that Mike's Map (Taco Moto) is spot on!  

 

Hodakaguy 

[Hodakaguy]

15 hours ago, Spud786 said:

Since you kept the Get, sounds like you need a touch of adjustment on that surge area mentioned, you are going to adjust that?

I spoke with Mike about this and its tuned to be right at stoichiometric at light throttle settings, this would be the reasoning behind the very slight surge and the reason it gets better MPG as well.  I'll keep riding it the way it is for now as it's a VERY minor issue and MPG on distance trips is super important.   

 

Hodakaguy 

[Hodakaguy]

14 hours ago, Ultra61 said:

I talked w Mike about the "GET" .. when it came to ordering, he said order on line ? .. I see on line there reference under 500 EXC-F they will customize I see nowhere a personal preference other then notes about your order I could fill in, no specific question/s.

Mike said Map #1 is ripping .. Map #2 you're lucky to lift the front in any gear ? how is that customizing? (He described 2 maps only) No offense, can someone tell me what I'm not understanding. I did feel rushed on the phone w him and he talked over me.

Completely the opposite experience that I've had dealing with Mike.   Maybe you caught him on an off day.  

 

Mike runs the FB group "EXC/FE Performance and Tech Talk" and is a huge asset to the our community, he really goes out of his way to help others out.  

 

Hodakaguy 

[Hodakaguy]

14 hours ago, cman60 said:

Thanks for the great comparison. I think after reading this I will go with the Vortex. Again, awesome job, very informative.

Can't go wrong with either...they both really wake the bike up! 

 

Hodakaguy 

[mmjsport]

I would love to hear and update also for a 2020. 

[twp8357]

2 hours ago, mmjsport said:

I would love to hear and update also for a 2020. 

I have a 2020 Six Days and I own both a Vortex and a GET.  The Vortex stock produced more HP than the GET from the factory.  I only know this because my buddy has a Vortex on the same bike sans the larger Throttle Body 44vs42 that I run and I also have the Grunt Exhaust Manifold from BDSB.  Both bikes have same BDSB endcap and EuroBoot intake.  Walt was able to pull up to me at around 95-100mph and he had a couple mph on me with the stock MAP.  I sent my GET to Taco Mike and got his Race Map #1 and Enduro Map #2 and I could not be happier.   I did a lot of testing with both and the GET provided better mileage all the way around.   Once I got the Maps from Mike, the HP difference between the Vortex and the GET was not measurable.  My buddy has the same basic bike and now we are neck and neck around 103-105mph.  On a 147.5 mile loop in the Mojave the Vortex got 44.21mpg and my GET bike got 48.8mpg.   What I like most about the GET is that I am getting better mileage than the Vortex no matter what MAP I am running.   I routinely get 49mpg in very high speed desert terrain and 44.5mpg or so in more difficult terrain running MAP 2.   I am learning about Traction Control because I did get the extra dial and the Vortex will remain on the shelf.  

[Spud786]

5 hours ago, Hodakaguy said:

I spoke with Mike about this and its tuned to be right at stoichiometric at light throttle settings, this would be the reasoning behind the very slight surge and the reason it gets better MPG as well.  I'll keep riding it the way it is for now as it's a VERY minor issue and MPG on distance trips is super important.   

 

Hodakaguy 

That would be a real peeve for me(cause I do run road) and wont tolerate any surge at all, should be able to adjust though with the phone app, even a  jd tuner has just a button push to fix that.

[mmjsport]

Thanks for the info. So if I buy a GET from Taco I should be good to go? I might just do that then. I don't really care about Wifi or adjustments as long as it runs great on the maps it comes with. I've used traction control feature when I switched bikes with a buddy on his 18/19 500 EXC. He had traction control and the map switch. The traction control was okay but nothing I really felt was worth it (to me at least). So I might just get the basic GET without any of the add ons and do the ECU swap only. 

[Hodakaguy]

1 hour ago, mmjsport said:

Thanks for the info. So if I buy a GET from Taco I should be good to go? I might just do that then. I don't really care about Wifi or adjustments as long as it runs great on the maps it comes with. I've used traction control feature when I switched bikes with a buddy on his 18/19 500 EXC. He had traction control and the map switch. The traction control was okay but nothing I really felt was worth it (to me at least). So I might just get the basic GET without any of the add ons and do the ECU swap only. 

Yep if your not interested in the bells and whistles you can buy the basic GET and be good to go...you'll love it! 

 

Hodakaguy 

[Ultra61]

22 hours ago, Ultra61 said:

I talked w Mike about the "GET" .. when it came to ordering, he said order on line ? .. I see on line there reference under 500 EXC-F they will customize I see nowhere a personal preference other then notes about your order I could fill in, no specific question/s.

Mike said Map #1 is ripping .. Map #2 you're lucky to lift the front in any gear ? how is that customizing? (He described 2 maps only) No offense, can someone tell me what I'm not understanding. I did feel rushed on the phone w him and he talked over me.

Mike saw my post .. or at the very least a few of his friends made him aware of my post, and He want to clear up why his anxiousness... I appreciate his response to me and clarification on my questions.. his response came back to me in a text using the # I called him on. Good call Mike  

[2020orion]

On 2/17/2020 at 8:19 PM, Ultra61 said:

I talked w Mike about the "GET" .. when it came to ordering, he said order on line ? .. I see on line there reference under 500 EXC-F they will customize I see nowhere a personal preference other then notes about your order I could fill in, no specific question/s.

Mike said Map #1 is ripping .. Map #2 you're lucky to lift the front in any gear ? how is that customizing? (He described 2 maps only) No offense, can someone tell me what I'm not understanding. I did feel rushed on the phone w him and he talked over me.

Just curious, did you end up getting the GET?  I'm on the fence with a Vortex and the GET and where to buy from.  I see this on the web site but it is not how you described your experience.

"Loaded with 2 CUSTOM maps created specifically for you after a brief interview discussing how you use your bike and how you want it to perform."

Anyone else order and get a custom map?

[HansLanda]

5 extra MPG would be nice, but I'm happy enough with the Vortex (for now?). I like the way it runs, but it can be a bit harsh at low revs. Not a big deal to me.

By the way @Hodakaguy nice hand guards. Never seen a set that big.

[Spud786]

2 hours ago, HansLanda said:

5 extra MPG would be nice, but I'm happy enough with the Vortex (for now?). I like the way it runs, but it can be a bit harsh at low revs. Not a big deal to me.

By the way @Hodakaguy nice hand guards. Never seen a set that big.

There can a 5 mpg difference just between summer and winter riding , not to mention throttle use.

Even a stock unmodified 500 cant get 50 mpg, unless riding very very conservatively, mid 42 to 47 mpg is pretty average in my world, performance modded and use.

[peachmonkey]

for what it's worth I wanted to give my 2 cents on the GET ECU from Tacomoto:

- 2020 exc-f 500
- removed reeds and installed a high flow end cap on the exhaust
- the leaned stock ecu got even more leaner with more air. The quick throttle blips would stall the motor..
- installed the 14/52 gearing (from stock 14/48)
- installed the GET ECU yesterday
- Map 1 is downright scary. So much more power now. I feel like a total noob now, gotta re-learn the throttle control
- Map 2 feels like it is similar to stock, very tame and zero stalls, it just chugs and chugs..

 

[YuriGagarin]

I may very well have gone with the GET, had it been on the scene more when I bought my FE, but the Vortex was in fashion then.   I do call BS on the built in barometric sensor though.   A standard OE ECU and Vortex do compensate for altitude when you turn the ignition on by measuring the barometric pressure on the MAP sensor before the bike is started.   That measurement calibrates the ECU for the pressure at that elevation for the remainder of time the ignition is on.   If you are riding the Pikes Peak Hill Climb, or skydiving with your dirt bike, the GET might be better at adapting the mixture for that time, otherwise the stock ECU does fine.   Good write up though @Hodakaguy.   I think the message about getting an ECU from a source that will support you is massively important!

[Teephud]

On 11/27/2019 at 11:00 AM, Hodakaguy said:

KTM 500 Aftermarket ECU/Tuner Review.

Mike Spurgin at Tacomoto.co hooked me up and sent me both a Vortex and Athena GET ECU to test on my 19 KTM 500EXC.  I already had a JD tuner on the bike so I was excited to try out the full replacement ECU's and see how they compare to the JD. On the 17 and up KTM's the factory ECU's are locked and cannot be re-mapped, this leaves you looking at aftermarket options to get your bike running correctly and realizing it's potential.

I Wanted to share my thoughts on the different tuners with others who may be looking to pick up a ECU or Tuner themselves.

One box of badassness that just arrived from Mike.

My bike is set up with the following:
*2019 KTM 500EXC
*Fully De-smogged with reed valves removed.
*FMF 4.1 Canister
*14-52 Gearing
*MT-21 front tire and MT-43 rear with Tubliss in each.

I will preface this with the statement that I'm tuning by riding the bike (Seat of the pants) and I'm not monitoring the AF ratio.  I'm not a professional rider or engine tuner but do have a LOT of time on bikes over the years.   These are my thoughts and my results on how the tuners felt on my bike.  I'm hoping to be able to get the 3 units on a Dyno to compare as well.

First up the JD Tuner:  The JD tuner is a piggy back tuner that modifies the signal coming from the stock ECU going to the injector to either add or remove fuel as needed.  It's worthy of note that the JD tuner modifies the fuel signal only and can not modify the ignition timing as well like the GET and Vortex tuners, this presents some built in limitations as the JD will never be able to fully correct the side effects from the factory set ECU programming.  The tuner allows you to change your fueling (manually) in real time to accommodate for riding conditions such as altitude, temperature or equipment changes to the bike.  It can take some time to get used to the controls of the tuner but depending on where you mount the unit changes are performed quickly.  Install of the tuner is pretty straight forward and includes power wires and OEM connectors to place the unit inline between the ECU and the Injector.  The JD tuner is also the most cost effective fueling solution.

Here's where the dealer installed the JD tuner on my bike...not the best spot for access.  In this case you have to remove the right side plastics to get to the tuner.  They could have easily mounted it on top of the battery to allow faster access.

When I purchased the bike with 10hrs on the clock it already had the JD tuner installed and had been "Tuned" by the dealer where the original owner purchased it.  The bike already had the 4.1 exhaust installed but had not been De-smogged.   After the Desmog process it was time to test.  The bike started hard at times and would stumble under throttle right after start up.  This usually happened when cold but did happen a couple times when warm as well, the rest of the time the bike would fire right up and run normally.   The bike would also flame out on occasion and popped during decel.   I checked the settings and the tuner was set to lean for an open pipe, it was set for a stock exhaust (Green 4, Yellow 5/6, Red 6, Green/Blue 5, Yellow/Blue 4 and Red/Blue 4).  I reset the tuner to the "factory" set point for a de-smogged bike with an open exhaust (Green 5, Yellow 6, Red 6/7, Green/Blue 6, Yellow/Blue 5 and Red/Blue 4).  After the reset I took the bike out again and it did run better, seemed to pull harder off the bottom end and seemed to have quite a bit of snap on top.  The starting issue persisted at times although less frequent and the popping on Decel was about the same.  On the next few rides I played with the tuning, dialing in some more fuel on the "accelerator" pump setting and added a little to the bottom end as well chasing the decel popping.

After numerous outings playing with the tuner the bike pulled hard and made a lot of power.  The power seemed slightly abrupt off the bottom end (can be tamed somewhat by playing with the "accelerator pump" setting) but built good power through out the RPM range.  The power never seemed completely linear to me and had spots that felt "Boggy" as you transitioned through the 1/4 throttle up to half settings.  I was never able to completely eliminate the decel popping (I did check and no leaks at the exhaust were found contributing to the popping).   In summary the JD tuner does an amazing job for the money, it transforms a stock bike into a power house compared to the stock ECU and with some more playing I think I could have dialed it in slightly better.  If you travel with the bike or ride in drastically different climates or elevations you may have to re-visit the tuning to keep the bike spot on.

Next up is the Athena GET RX1 Pro ECU (Green).

The GET is a full replacement ECU and has quite a few options available over the JD unit.   The GET comes with two maps pre loaded (Mike worked with Derek Harris of HP Racing Development to build the maps) and comes with a map switch so you can select between the maps while on the trail.  Mike loaded mine with Map 1 set to Full On Honey Badger and Map 2 set to "Enduro" with a slightly softer bottom end.   The GET also comes with an onboard WIFI unit that allows you to use your phone to tweak fuel and ignition changes in real time, check the bikes diagnostics and calibrate the TPS.  You can change fueling +30% and -10% and ignition timing -30 Deg and +5 Deg.  The GET has a barometric pressure sensor built in and will automatically compensate for altitude changes...nice!  The GET also allows you to add their GPA Traction Control knob for use during slick condition. The GPA switch uses software to compare throttle settings with RPM and works to eliminate wheel spin by controlling the throttle faster than the rider can respond to wheel spin situations with their hand.  There are 10 levels of traction control available at the touch of a dial.  This unit is also fully water proof.

Installation of the GET is really straight forward.  You remove the OEM ecu then pull the ecu out of the factory rubber sleeve.  Install the GET into the sleeve then re-install the GET just like the factory unit.

Removing the Stock ECU.

With the stock ECU removed the GET is installed in the factory rubber sleeve.  The GET has a Barometric pressure sensor on the top of the ECU and the rubber sleeve covers it, the sleeve probably wouldn't have caused any issues but I cut a hole in the sleeve to ensure the sensor can function properly.

Using a punch and a piece of wood to cut a breather hole for the pressure sensor.

Back in the bike.  You can see the WIFI module mounted over the battery with Velcro.

Installed the GET Map switch.  The switch is very robust and has a quality feel to it.

Mounted the GPA Traction control knob to the bottom of the throttle assembly.  This location is out of the way and allows quick access for adjustment.

With the GET installed it's time to download the app and set up the WIFI.  Setup went quickly following the included instructions.  Once connected you can set up the profile for your bike.

My bike set up in the app.

Next up calibration of the TPS.  The app makes this a quick and trouble free process.

Here's the diagnostics tab...green means your good to go and no errors.

Here's what the interface looks like for setting the fuel and ignition offsets.  I'll leave everything at Zero or Factory settings for the first test.

On the trail with the GET ECU.  I have about 100 miles of both single and dual track on the ECU so far.  The bike starts and idles spot on every time and I've yet to have to use the cold start knob (With outside temps down to 35 deg F).  The popping on decel is completely gone, no popping while on long down hills or when abruptly chopping the throttle.....Nice!   I experienced zero flame outs with the GET.

Map 1 - Dialed is the word I'd use to describe this map.  The power feels sooooo linear and smooth, there are no feelings of flat spots anywhere through out the throttle range.  Power is Everywhere!  Lofting the front end with throttle is super easy in 1st - 5th and requires little effort at the bars to loft in 6th as well.  The power is predictable and I felt very connected to the bike.   It may be just a tad lean at very light throttle settings when cruising at a steady speed around 35-40mph on pavement.  I felt a very slight surge a couple times when cruising down black top to the trail, again it was very slight and I only felt it a couple times.  Switching to Map 2 you can notice a slight ease in bottom end snap which could translate to control-ability in muddy or slick conditions.  I ran several trips through a very rocky canyon we like to play in and tried both map 1 & 2 while in the canyon.  Both maps worked really well and in the end I just left the bike in Map 1 for most of the trail.  I haven't had the chance to try the map switch out yet in muddy or slick conditions which is where I feel the Map 2 setting would show it's benefit.

GPA Traction control knob:  I really like the theory behind the traction control unit and the "on the fly" adjust-ability the bar mounted knob provides.  With my limited time on the bike I haven't had a chance to ride in muddy or slick conditions where the GPA would shine.  I turned on the traction control and spun the tire in loose dirt and you could feel the engine cut out and the GET take control (Like it's hitting a rev limiter) telling me that the traction control is functioning.   I can't wait to get some time on a muddy trail and see how the traction control behaves.

The GET ECU....A Green Box of Magical Wizardry!   I'm VERY impressed with the GET ECU.  The mapping that Mike provided is SPOT ON, I haven't put any offsets into his mapping as of yet.   On the trail I like the ability to use the phone to check diagnostics and I like that the ECU compensates for altitude changes automatically.  On our long distance desert trips we routinely see 3000' to 10,000' elevation changes in the matter of a few hrs so the compensation feature is welcome.  The GET gives you the bike that you really wanted when you purchased your 500, it turns the corked up factory bike into a flat out awesome machine!

Vortex ECU:  I'll be testing the Vortex next and will edit this post to include the results once I get some time on the unit.

More to come....

Hodakaguy

Did you ever test the Vortex?

[Spud786]

38 minutes ago, Teephud said:

Did you ever test the Vortex?

He didnt really test any of them, more an out of the box comparison plugged into the bike.

He mentioned the Vortex felt more abrupt, he did purchased the Get ecu.

 

Not really seen him back here, more of a create a verified marketing comparison thread, to get a discount.