W85W58

2012 WR450 Starting woes

506 posts in this topic

Has anyone tried one of these?

http://www.yoshimura-rd.com/t-Engine_Management_PIM.aspx

 

Just orded their rs4 and saw this.

Looks like it does everything (PIM2 and Data Box combo), and it should for that price:

 

Features:

  • Reads Air/Fuel Ratio
  • Works in conjunction with PIM2 Self Mapping Feature
  • Dyno or on track Self Mapping
  • Computes fuel map for air/fuel ratio settings from 11.0 to 15.0
  • Stainless Steel or Titanium bung included
  • Sets fuel adjustments at each Throttle position and RPM Range
  • Plug and Play installation with the PIM2 unit (may require pipe modification to accept sensor)
  • Allows for quick and easy dyno tuning
  • User adjustable target air/fuel ratio for performance and fuel economy

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Looks like it does everything (PIM2 and Data Box combo), and it should for that price:

 

Features:

  • Reads Air/Fuel Ratio
  • Works in conjunction with PIM2 Self Mapping Feature
  • Dyno or on track Self Mapping
  • Computes fuel map for air/fuel ratio settings from 11.0 to 15.0
  • Stainless Steel or Titanium bung included
  • Sets fuel adjustments at each Throttle position and RPM Range
  • Plug and Play installation with the PIM2 unit (may require pipe modification to accept sensor)
  • Allows for quick and easy dyno tuning
  • User adjustable target air/fuel ratio for performance and fuel economy

Does it do ignition and fuel or only fuel ?

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I had a chance to play with both the genuine Yamaha and the Chinese fi tools side by side, it turns out they read the same CO scale, so casanova90's -7 CO was very lean, mine was factory set to 0.

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Looks like it does everything (PIM2 and Data Box combo), and it should for that price:

 

Features:

  • Reads Air/Fuel Ratio
  • Works in conjunction with PIM2 Self Mapping Feature
  • Dyno or on track Self Mapping
  • Computes fuel map for air/fuel ratio settings from 11.0 to 15.0
  • Stainless Steel or Titanium bung included
  • Sets fuel adjustments at each Throttle position and RPM Range
  • Plug and Play installation with the PIM2 unit (may require pipe modification to accept sensor)
  • Allows for quick and easy dyno tuning
  • User adjustable target air/fuel ratio for performance and fuel economy

 

Also can purchasejust the PIM

http://www.yoshimura-rd.com/ps-5004-2056-ems-pim2-unit.aspx

 

Still $339 bucks. But with the choices of maps and adjustability with a laptop thats cool. Not sure how often that would 

be done.Seems buying the FI unit from Yamaha is cheaper. 

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The power commander can adjust timing.  I don't think you need the competition ecu to run one, just a shorter throttle stop screw.  The power tuner maps have 3 throttle positions and 3 rpm ranges.  Power commander has 10 throttle positions and 250 rpm increments.  The maps on the dynojet website kind of suck IMO because the timing maps are all zeroes.  If I was going to dyno tune the bike, the power commander would be my choice.  The autotune could handle the fuel mapping but I think it would be too hard to make a timing map with just a butt dyno.

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I bought a 2013 last week and it's still sitting at the dealers, waiting on ECU, muffler, throttle screw, Power Tuner etc.  I want to have the dealer install the performance parts and then set the air/fuel mixture.  Is there a specific setting (%) that works best or does it vary by bike?  After that, I will set the mapping myself for the FMF with the Power Tuner.

 

Thanks

Edited by Navaho6

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The power commander can adjust timing.  I don't think you need the competition ecu to run one, just a shorter throttle stop screw.  The power tuner maps have 3 throttle positions and 3 rpm ranges.  Power commander has 10 throttle positions and 250 rpm increments.  The maps on the dynojet website kind of suck IMO because the timing maps are all zeroes.  If I was going to dyno tune the bike, the power commander would be my choice.  The autotune could handle the fuel mapping but I think it would be too hard to make a timing map with just a butt dyno.

 

+1

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Brand new bike, put in new ECU (Aussie map) and removed muffler restriction.   2nd time I tried to start it, it flooded.  Opened the throttle all the way, kicked it 10 times to clear, then it started up on first try.  Every time you move the kick starter a little you hear the pump priming.  Is that causing the flooding issue or is it the failed attempt to start? 

 

Anyone having this problem.  ?

 

After it warmed up, the restarting was hit and miss.  Sometimes on the first try, others 2 or 3 tries with e-start.  Always 1st try with the kickstarter but it is a stiff kick.

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The bikes are really tight when new. That's a good thing! They loosen up after about a 1000km's. Then starting is still hit and miss until you reset the CO.

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Just because the fuel pump is running every time the engine rotates some, I doubt it is spraying that much fuel, if any at all. The only time mine is excessively difficult to start, is after stalling under a heavy load. I still haven't gone for a ride since adjusting the idle fueling, so I don't know if general starting has improved or not.

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After I spent $88 on a Chinese FI tool that didn't work I was finally able to borrow a Yamaha FI tool from my local dealer and it only took a couple of minutes to make the change.  I just took a guess on where to set it based on other people on this post.  Wont be able to try it out for a while since I have a broken thumb.

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My '13 was difficult to start when stock.  I put the FMF, comp. ECU and remapped with FMF map and rode it 3 hours today.  Easy to start with E-start.  Fires up immediately.

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The GYTR ECU DOES change the entire map, both fuel and ignition.....but the TUNER does not affect the new ECU below 4000rpm.

Without the GYTR ECU, it will NEVER RUN CORRECTLY.

The stock ECU has a clock in it. Until it sees 5 hours, it WILL NOT RUN OR START CORRECTLY because the ignition is retarded -4 until it passes 5 hours. This is SOP on all FI bikes now, so new owners won't seize the motor in the first few hours of riding.......

On the first batch of KTM EXC's, the clock was 10 hours, and it drove everyone nuts.....

Remember, when you start the bike, let it warm up to get to full temp, for a few minutes.......and then.....

Then kill the motor for 3 min, restart the bike WITHOUT ANY THROTTLE OR THROTTLE BLIPS, and let it idle for at least one minute.

Kill the motor, and then re-start and ride as desired.

This will allow the ECU to re-map to the info from the Mass Air Pressure and Temp sensors, correcting the F/I and Ignition map for your riding area.

The ECU mapping CANNOT / WILL NOT CHANGE WHILE YOU ARE RIDING.

So if you go up in attitude you have to repeat the last two steps, if you notice the bike running rich or lean.

 

 

I read thru the entire thread before asking this question.

 

I did not read whether or not the need for this series of steps ever goes away?

 

That is, is there some point in the cycle's life (ie: after 5 hours / after breakin / after Comp ECU installation / etc) where this series of steps no longer applies / is no longer needed to be performed?

 

Thanks,

Bob

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when my 2012 wr450 was new it was hard starting for its first few times out. around 15 hours in it started and ran perfect. I added the comp ecu and fmf powercore and my stalling and hard starting woes began. It was simply to low of an idle! I hooked up my GYTR tuner which I also purchased, set my idle to 2100 and the bike starts runs and idles perfect. I now own this bike for 1 year and it is awesome. The ecu upgrade allows me to regulate my power delivery which is beneficial but it does not make the bike any faster(not complaining). I raced head to head with another 2012 wr450 before and after the upgrades and the results were exactly the same. Does sound better though and variable power delivery for different conditions has been nice. also I have never kickstarted this bike yet, the electric start has been flawless. Can,t say enough about this bike, I love it, suspension to me is its #1 quality.

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Try the motocross map!  Definitely faster.  Cant say the same about the other maps I've tried.  I don't care about drag racing or top speed, but th mx map resolves the issues I have lugging 3rd gear in the woods.  The tuner was well worth the $.

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Try the motocross map! Definitely faster. Cant say the same about the other maps I've tried. I don't care about drag racing or top speed, but th mx map resolves the issues I have lugging 3rd gear in the woods. The tuner was well worth the $.

I second that!

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when my 2012 wr450 was new it was hard starting for its first few times out. around 15 hours in it started and ran perfect. I added the comp ecu and fmf powercore and my stalling and hard starting woes began. It was simply to low of an idle! I hooked up my GYTR tuner which I also purchased, set my idle to 2100 and the bike starts runs and idles perfect. I now own this bike for 1 year and it is awesome. The ecu upgrade allows me to regulate my power delivery which is beneficial but it does not make the bike any faster(not complaining). I raced head to head with another 2012 wr450 before and after the upgrades and the results were exactly the same. Does sound better though and variable power delivery for different conditions has been nice. also I have never kickstarted this bike yet, the electric start has been flawless. Can,t say enough about this bike, I love it, suspension to me is its #1 quality.

 

I think I've read this before, as well. Re-adjusting the idle speed (to higher) was the solution for hard starting after the ECU change-out.

 

Where are you getting your maps?

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I think I've read this before, as well. Re-adjusting the idle speed (to higher) was the solution for hard starting after the ECU change-out.

 

Where are you getting your maps?

1. FMF

2. mapping that came with the gytr tuner

3. thumpertalk WR forum

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1. FMF

2. mapping that came with the gytr tuner

3. thumpertalk WR forum

 

OK, thanks.

 

I've been thru dozens of threads in here (the TT WR forum).

 

So far, I've found only one thread where an individual posted an actual mapping: "My Map vlxjim".

 

Otherwise, lots of folks write about them, but few (one, so far) give actual data.

 

Am I missing something?  ...as in, this data is not pinned at the top, in an FAQ?

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