Does anyone else think quads are wrecking trails?

Some peaple just don't see the potential danger that comes with riding an ATV ..These are the ones who need to be fined and taught to respect

land that we share as off road users.

Huskyrider I hope you didn't believe the Quad rider when he said Quads were safer to ride than bikes. You have never driven a Quad. In uneven terrain the more wheels on the ground,the worse the control ,thats why I wheelie over it.

I think the issue is that those that ride quads feel less vulnerable the on a 2 wheel (Thats my own opnion).

Think about it this for a minute, how much safer do you feel in your car compared to a SUV or a Truck. I am not supporting quad riders at all, I personally do not like them, I think they are at times a hazard becouse of the stupidity of those riding them. I also think that some 2 wheelers have the same power of thought as some quad riders.

What I do not understand is why we have to have a street bike licnese and not a dirt bike license. Also for those that are new padwan learners should have a training course on proper trail riding and safty.

Think of the revenue flow to the OHV that would happen if the state mandated this.

Ok so all you that think that legistalting stupidity is not the responcibility of government. Then stop complaining..

the only thing i have a problem with is when the trail is parked 2 wheels only and you are coming up in a steep rocky spot ad a quad is coming down very reclessly. One time i was riding up a trail and i was fairly tough and some young punks were coming down the trail. there was no was they were going to get back up it. Any way i had to slam into the bank. they rode right over my bike when it fell into the trail. Didnt hurt it but it did pop one of their tires. They had to hook up a winch and pull them selves out that way. Not to mention ruining the trail from spinning. I showed them the sign and they just said f off and rode away. Bastards.

Lewichris, same thing happened to me last week. There is now 4 less quad drivers that will be riding in our area. After a nice ass kicking of the one idiot (sure made me feel good) my partner arrested him and his 3 buddies for DUI, had their vehicles impounded (both the quads and the pickups), charged one with cocaine possesion and another with a weapons violation. Nice thing about having a county sheriff as a riding buddy. Last time we were out a drunk 16 year old quad rider hit one of our guys and shattered his leg. Since it was the second person he hit that day he was arrested for assault with a deadly weapon and DUI. The charges stuck and he won't be driving anything for a while.

Most quad riders that we do come across though have been very nice, pull off trails to let us by and offer soft drinks or water on hot days. They have also pulled us out of some serious mud holes and other stupid things we have done.

As much as I HATE government regulation an ATV safety and registration program similiar to many states hunter safety education program might not be a bad idea.

In my area, I don't see many quad riders at all.

But, I must relate a topical story.

I was riding in a sandy, desert-esque area that had whoops, hillclimbs, pits and the such. I was tooling around, and came up to a dude on a KX500. It was a beast of a machine, so I went up to talk to him. He started to say that he has been here for years upon years, and that the "damn 125's" are tearing this place up. They have to wind those things so tight that they are tearing up the place.

Couple of minutes later I run into a guy riding on a CR125, and he is getting after it. We stop next to each other, and he starts bad mouthing the big bores. "Those big 500's just reak havoc out here..."

I think that we all may be a little guilty of finger pointing. It is very easy to blame all the problems on the other users, while holding ourselves accountable is a little more difficult.

Not solving any issues with this post, just sharing a couple of stories that I have heard.

Brandon

I personally don't like the quads screwing up the single tracks for us 2 wheeled folk. I have been cross rutted to many times coming into corners only to have a near hit with a 100 yr old Maple. Why can't we lobby for single track only trails that prohibit 4 wheelers? I can't see how it can be much fun for quads in the woods I ride in anyway as most time they are going 5mph or less and getting caught between trees 90% of the time.

I must say most quad riders have been generous enough to let us through when approached. What is scary is meeting them on a two way trail in a fast section. They weigh considerably more and the consequences of colliding in the backwoods with a quad don't exactly excite me. Always ride with a light on if you got one, I have found that you can usually pick it out through the trees way farther away and that can prepare you for passing by them.

In short, no I don't like quads on single tracks but they have plenty of other areas to ride with the snowmobile system (in michigan anyway)which appears to be more suited to the vehicle.

NeWRiver (ktm board) created a subtle pastiche of intended Irony, but unfortunately the issue in our immediate area is much more complex. There is an AWESOME atv network in our area, 100-1000 mi. of superb trails. They are multi use, and I have never ever seen or been involved in a user conflict on these trails, period. The issue for us locally (I stress this point!)is that there is also hundreds of miles of SINGLETRACK as well, not suited for (or intended for) ATV use. Our soil type and vertical topography have sustained a trail network for two wheeled vehicles, in great shape, for literally decades. These were hunting, game, hiking trails, etc, prior to Moto use, but were adapted and maintained by all user groups (except atv's) for the past oh, one or two thousand years. As sigletrack. Well, as we all know, new knucklehead on a ranch ATV does not know the meaning of 40% grade loose shale sigletrack. What has happened is that a number of trailheads have been started by ATV'r,s only for them to quickly realize they they or their machines are not physically capable of completing said trail. Turnaronds have created some very ugly scarring, on what for centuries has been sigletrack. OK, local land manager comes along, sees the tremendous damage at the staging areas, and says, "motorized use has destroyed these traditional trails...CLOSED!" Do you possibly see the absolute LACK of irony in this situation? SO, my post was not based on any pure anti atv sentiment (I use one to scout terrain, etc), but based on actual closures due to their operational characteristics. I hope this helps to clarify, and reduce the nonesense flame posts. (please take no offence, this is a VERY real issue in areas with fragile soil).

This is typical of what you will see here in Texas.For every 10 people on ATV's, you might see one wearing a helmet.

IMG_0066sm.JPG

Another example of management by closure. Instead of dealing with the real cause of the problem, some peabrained monotask land managers just declare the area "closed". It's the easy way out for them, because the alternative is to enforce regulations or to educate the public. Both of which require much more planning and time. They don't put it in perspective and try to understand what the closure means to others. It becomes an issue for the legal department to deal with, not their problem anymore. Our tax dollars at work. No wonder I have to work to mid May before Uncle Sam is paid.

Dan

precisely my point, dan, we are in an area without the resources (or user clout) to put up appropriate signage, and as a result of our living in this time of history, quads are closing forest access to not only motor use, but general use as well. There are tons of ATV trails locally that (WE) endorse, and use, and party with the 4-bangers, but it is the high alpine, delicate singletrack that I am attempting to preserve...(or lose completely).

Check this out!

Now this is an area That a few of us ride every month. The trails are awesome.....

However...Look at the advertisements for this place...Red Neck Heaven...Pay close attention to the photos and the lack of helmets ...(Especially the Moron coming off the jump), and the Helmet Requirements posted on the site...

Go Figure :)

http://members.aol.com/_ht_a/rockycreekatv/myhomepage/

Quads and Quad riders have their good and bad points. The good points are,

They make and maintain most of the trails out there.

They can winch you out of the lake when you try to hydroplane through it and dont quite make it :D . Dont ask :D !

They are great cooler holders and you can pack many cold beers in said cooler so you dont have to haul them :D .

Bad points are,

They are Slow.

They kick up TONS of DUST!!!!

They make ruts in muddy trails that bikes get railed into.

The no helmet wife beater wearing squids make a bad name for the rest of us 2 or 4 wheels.

That being said, the key to living with them is to understand three main points about them.

1. Quad riders can often be coraled in what is called a squid pit or sand pit. Its basicly the bigest sand like hill climb in the riding area and it is where the quad riders will gravitate to and spend 80% or more of there time getting drunk and going up and down the hill.

2. Quads HATE water and mud, have you ever seen how much water those thing throw up infront of them????

3. Quads HATE BIG rocks. Big rocks, tip quads, rip the tires off their rims, and bash there low ground clearance frames, suspensions, and drives to a pulp!!!

Once you know these simple facts, avoiding the quads is simple, stay away from the squid pits, and ride the creek beds or the areas furthest from the pitts. Because of the fact that quad riders often spend so much time at the squid areas, they tend to have bad navigation skills and will not venture to far from the safty of the squid schools or breeding grounds.

I do see alot of quad riders with no helmet, no shirt, and wearing sandles. It dose not bother me. I avoid them when I want to go fast and ride with them when I want to putt around and go site seeing.

Bike riders are outnumbered in my riding area about 25 to 1 or more.

The state (Pa) and riding area I ride in is cracking down on the squids. Quands must be registered, and insured. Bikes dont have to be. The one area I ride has simple rules, You must have helmet, pants, boots, and long sleeve shirt, Only 1 rider per ATV, cell phone, and the quads have to get a big gay flag bolted to the tail bar :D:) . Me, I just get a tag on my brake line :D . That right there and the strict enforcement keeps the squids at bay, but the fact that that area also has very rockey 4X4 trails makes it a very nice bike ridng area, however, they also require you ride in groups of no less than 2, but they have not given me a hard time about ripping around out there by myself. The land owners also seem to treat me with great respect because I am on a bike, even the Quad guys seem to, but maybe its just cause I look like I know what Im doing because I were correct protective gear or that I sit about 4 feet higher than they do :D .

In the end I feel the awnser is not to ban them, they are in fact the new majority, we must try to welcome them and organize them into a useful responsible lobby like the AMA. I feel it is up to the land owners, public and private, to establish and enforce the rules. As for the way the Quads rut the trails,,, its just part of learning to ride the terain, the WR has such sweet suspension compared to my older bikes I can move in and out of the ruts at will and even ride between them :D !!!

That web-site is so blatantly contradictory about the helmet rule I think I am going to call these hill-billies and ask em' why they posted all of the pictures of people with no helmet but they have a rule that states "helmets required".

What I dont understand about quad riders is

<ul type="square">[*]Why do the parents of these kids let them ride around the camp sites like its there own race track

[*]Why do parents stand there like they just ate a Poop sandwhich, with their kids are raising heck through the camp sites

[*]And why do the parents of these kids argue with you when you ask for them to stop their kids from doing the above

[ September 04, 2002, 02:38 PM: Message edited by: E.G.O.**** ]

I tried calling but the number is disconnected. Maybe they are defunct but haven't taken the web-site down yet? I'll try e-mail.

fastmonstr :

Wow! Not a good sight.

I know it’s probably hot where those people are riding, but still…

The dad needs a good kick in the a$$.

They are definately still in business...Just rode there last Sunday....These guys charge $15.00 a head and have about 500 - 1000 riders per weekend.

Bonzai :)

rideit,

I don't think anyone took your post as anti ATV'rs and if you believe we're flaming your post I'd say you need to take a chill pill.

Different topographies offer varied results with 2 vs 4 wheeled off road vehicles.

Where I live the quad crew has opened up a bunch of new riding areas by bushwacking the thick riverbottom forest with their ATV's.

They've made trails where nobody would of ever gone on bikes before. We've got alot of sandy creek/riverbottom and side trails and those machines are in their element there. When we get our next good rain they will fill with water. After a week or so without rain we can ride the trails. They have become almost virgin trails again.

I'm sorry to hear that they've caused permanent damage to your riding areas trails.

Educating them will definately be a tough task.

It looks to me like they love MUD, BEER, and NO GEAR all over the country.

This is a crowd who probably doesn't care about whats happening to your favorite trail, no matter how long you've ridden it.

Sometimes equal rights for all, comes at more of a cost for others.

Good Luck with your saving your favorite trails.

Ok, I sent an e-mail and asking why they have a rule that states people wear helmets but they obviously promote the contrary by showing pics of guys hot dogging with no helmet. Well, here is the response I recieved.

"PRE>FOR SOME PEOPLE, THEY CARRY THEIR OWN SIGN (I'M STUPID!). THAT IS WHO YOU

SEE

PICTURED. WE CAN TELL THEM IT'S THE SAFEST WAY TO LIVE TO RIDE AGAIN, SPREAD

THE WORD ABOUT SAFETY IN A POSITIVE WAY AND SAY A PRAYER FOR THEM. THANKS FOR

YOUR COMMENTS."

UMM, ok, but it's his web-site right? :)

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