Easy water pump and countershaft seal replacement!

You imagine that you'll be able to hold the shaft with a screw driver?

While I admire your optimism, let me assure you that it won't work. My apologies for naysaying.

I've just done 2000km with the seal only replacement and no leaks. Its a lucky dip.

I tightened the impeller just enough and used Loctite threadlocker, tried undoing it before fitting and it seems to work, screwdriver is no good but a wrench with flat socket does it fine

You are free to disagree, but removing the impeller from outside is the wrong approach, for reasons already stated.

My question here is why does that shaft get grooved so easily? Whats the best way to prevent this from happening? Mine is leaking when cold, so its time to fix. Compared to some of the stories here I got a lot of mileage outta mine, but it seems they shouldnt wear out so quiuckly.

Hi Story,

Did my countershaft seal last week. I used vice-grps on the old collar as I knew I was replacing it with a new one. bit of a wiggle and out it came.

Kevin

Well I just changed mine out today and the collar was a bitch to grab with the vise grips.

I found the trick is to first remove the seal than the collar just pops out if you hook a screwdriver behind it :worthy:

right, fixed mine today, new seals, shaft, bearing and side gasket,

PICT7111.jpg

I tried a little mod with the shaft, it went surprisingly easy, 10 second hacksaw action and next time (it will surely come) I can safely fix the leak "lazy way" without stressing the shaft key, highly recommended

PICT7115.jpgPICT7119.jpg

Since I'm doing exactly the same routine right now it

Would have been nice if you have som picture showing the difference between the new and the old shaft. One thing that no one mentions is the freeplay between the impellershaft and the balancer shaft. Opinion on another forum was that it should be a tight fit. In that case the end of the impellershaft would have square edges or am I missing something.

/Thomas

Hi, haven't got one picture of two shafts at close up, if you have a look at the pics posted than, you'll see close up of the grooved one and another closeup of the new one, just to give an idea, I might still have the old one in the garge so could measure the wear. I confirm there was a freeplay in the balancer shaft and new impeller shaft, if I remember it was roughly 10 degrees turn, mind you my balancer shaft has some wear as I was able to turn the old imp. shaft 360 degrees there with some force aplied, I doubt it's a tight fit by design as it's not that crucial

Got the parts from my dealer today. Looked in my manual which says that the markings on the oil seals should be facing inwards. I understand the orientation of the outer seal which I got confirmed by the pictures in the beginning of this thread. But what about the inner seal (the one on the "oil side" of the block). I took several pictures when i dissasembled the engine but missed the orientation of the oil seal because it popped out when i pulled the bearing. DAMN.....inwards assumes that you know towards what....

Somebody either please explain or show me a picture or better yet...give me a lesson regarding the function on these seals. I bet there is a reason why they are designed the way they are.

Thomas

Thomas, fit the seals spring side to the liquid

The markings on both of these two seals face inward, meaning into the socket the seal is installed into. The sealing lip of both seals must face up out of their socket and toward the fluids they seal. So the coolant seal lips must face up toward the impeller, and the oil seal must face toward the bearing.

SealsLabeledsm.jpg

Just got back from the garage....when you say fit the spring side to the liquid do you mean that the spring on the coolantside should face the water and the spring side on the oil side should face the oil. Or should both springs face the coolant side? If I look in the manual I get the impression that both springs should be facing the coolant side...but would that make sense? Do I need 2 seals doing the same job. Wouldn't one of them face the oil and block it from escaping out the "weephole" just like the seal on the kickshaft? There the spring faces the engine oil.

Still a little confused

Just got back from the garage....when you say fit the spring side to the liquid do you mean that the spring on the coolantside should face the water and the spring side on the oil side should face the oil.

Yes :thumbsup:

....when you say fit the spring side to the liquid do you mean that the spring on the coolantside should face the water and the spring side on the oil side should face the oil.

Yes.
Or should both springs face the coolant side?
No.
If I look in the manual I get the impression that both springs should be facing the coolant side...but would that make sense?
No, it wouldn't, and it doesn't say that.
Do I need 2 seals doing the same job.
No. They do two different jobs
Wouldn't one of them face the oil and block it from escaping out the "weephole" just like the seal on the kickshaft?

Yes.

Thanks a lot guys....nice to know that you always can get help here.

/Thomas

Can someone post a close up pic of the outter seal? I tried to put mine in with the spring in the seal facing towards me and it sucked in coolant into the oil, and the direction of the barrel roll peices on the inside of the seal confirmed this, when I took mine apart the flat part of the seal faced towards me while taking it apart, and that was stock...... I posted in another thread also, but IM still a bit confused on the outter seal, like the book says, words face inwards, but dont' say inwards towards what? coolant? oil? both, neither?

My countershaft seal just went after 8000+ ks. Glad to find this thread. Thanks for those who've contributed.

One question, and it could be a stupid one seeing as no-one else has asked it, will I lose all my oil once the seal is out? If that's the case, I'll drop the oil first - less mess.

You won`t lose much oil unless you take off the whole side cover, which you don`t need to do unless your shaft is grooved and it too needs to be replaced.Wouldn`t hurt to change your oil the same time though,

The counter shaft, or output shaft, oil seal is a whole different subject. This thread is concerned with the water pump seals.

You will lose little or no oil by removing the output shaft seal as long as you don't start the engine while it's out. Be sure:

  • To check the condition of the steel collar the seal runs on, and replace it if it's grooved.
  • To replace the O-ring under the collar.
  • Not to drive the seal in too deeply. It should be just flush with the seal bore and no deeper.
  • To insert the seal squarely.

The counter shaft, or output shaft, oil seal is a whole different subject. This thread is concerned with the water pump seals.

You will lose little or no oil by removing the output shaft seal as long as you don't start the engine while it's out. Be sure:

  • To check the condition of the steel collar the seal runs on, and replace it if it's grooved.
  • To replace the O-ring under the collar.
  • Not to drive the seal in too deeply. It should be just flush with the seal bore and no deeper.
  • To insert the seal squarely.

ok so how do i remove the collar? mine seems to be stuck and i cant get any bite on it at all. oh my bike is an 08 wr 450 with maby 40 hours on it. is their a speciall tool to catch this thing from the inside edge or something?

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