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elsinoredaze

to much or not enough...

10 posts in this topic

Well... did as the manual said to check oil level... idled the engine for three minutes and checked keeping bike level.No way in hell to check oil level... oil continued to ooz from hole until I screwed down the dip stick.Waited for about 45 seconds tried it again... same thing. :cry:

Checked the dip stick before starting the engine and it was bone dry. :cry:

Figured no way to get accurate reading if oil is perking then returning to the bottom of the engine. :cry:

I'll be the first to admit that I lack mechanical skills but I do understand gravity... I mean if I check before starting and the stick is bone dry... start and check again after 3 minutes and oil is overflowing then all I'm trying to do in the first place is catch the oil on the way back down and measuring the oil level is just a guess at best.

Please tell me if I'm missing something here... the dealer changed the oil so I have no idea if I have to much or to little oil.

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Dealer changed the oil?

I see it's an 05, but is that the first oil change? How long was it ridden before it was changed? Has it been ridden since? Just wondering...

Anyway, the best thing you can do is follow the steps in your manual and change the oil and filter yourself, thus ensuring you have it done properly. It's good to learn how to do that anyway, since the change intervals are frequent.

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Drain all of the oil (frame AND engine), get out a measuring cup or bottle with measuring marks on it and pour in exactly the capacity specified in the manual. Now you should not have an overflowing problem after starting. Sounds to me like someone overfilled it.

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First, fill with oil according to the maual, then screw the dipstick back into the frame. Fire up the bike and let it idle for a couple of minutes. Kill the bike and pull the dipstick, wipe it off and drop it back into the frame but don't screw it down. Pull it out and check the level. Never screw the stick down to check the level. After you kill the bike you have to check the level within a few seconds or the oil will run back down into the frame.

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First, fill with oil according to the maual, then screw the dipstick back into the frame. Fire up the bike and let it idle for a couple of minutes. Kill the bike and pull the dipstick, wipe it off and drop it back into the frame but don't screw it down. Pull it out and check the level. Never screw the stick down to check the level. After you kill the bike you have to check the level within a few seconds or the oil will run back down into the frame.

There are several things wrong here, first of which is that the "05 doesn't fill at the frame. Secondly, the oil will not immediately migrate back to the frame in a few seconds. There is a check valve between the pump and the oil filter to prevent this. Over a period of a week or more, most of the oil in the tank will work its way back down to the sump though, because the are no seals in the pump, and oil slowly seeps past it when standing unused.

You need to understand that your oil system is a "Dry Sump" system. While I happen to believe that dry sumps are a better system, they are also somewhat uncommon these days.

In a wet sump, like your car and most Japanese and many other road bikes, the oil is carried in the engine, drained from the engine, and refilled at the engine. There is one oil pump that picks up oil from a screen in the sump and pumps it through the engine.

In a Dry Sump like yours, the oil supply is carried in a separate reservoir, in this case the frame. There are two oil pumps built in tandem with each other, one a high pressure feed pump, the other a high volume scavenging, or return pump. The feed pump draws oil down from the tank (frame) through an external oil line, and lubes the engine with it. But when it drains back to the sump, it is picked up by the scavenging pump and sent back to the tank. The return pump moves a greater volume than the feed pump does because it's bigger, and it's more or less unrestricted by pressure orifices, so it outruns the feed and keeps the sump pretty much sucked out, thus the name, "dry sump".

What you evidently did was to assume that you drain all the oil at the engine because it fills there. This mistake has been made more than once. As soon as the engine starts, it gets pumped back to the tank. Just remember that it won't start oiling itself until some of it gets upstairs, so don't go crazy with the throttle for the first couple of seconds. Let's say that half the normal amount of oil left in the tank, and half had drained to the engine. If you drained only the engine and then add back the required 1.1 liters of oil, you'll be 50% overfilled!

Re-read the manual and try again. Meantime, drain oil a little at a time from the FRAME until the level is correct. :cry:

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we had that same problem with ours and we actually read the manual and it say to run the bike for a minuet and then let it sit for 5 minuets then check the oil. it worked much better when we did it that way! lol

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I've got an '04 and the manual doesn't say anything about letting it sit for 5 minutes then checking it. Just to warm it up, kill it, then check the level. It works for me.

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we had that same problem with ours and we actually read the manual and it say to run the bike for a minuet and then let it sit for 5 minuets then check the oil. it worked much better when we did it that way! lol

next time...type BEFORE toking.

Anyway... guess I have run the bike for about two hours with to much oil.Service manager where I puchased the bike is telling me that he has looked over the manual discussed the matter with a tech and that there are two drain points on the 05 450.I know that's not right and I guess it helps explain why I have to much oil.

Sucks that the dealer doesn't even know how to change the oil.This was the second oil change... I actually watched as the first was performed by a tech.I remember explicitly him asking another where to add oil... the other more "experienced" tech told him to add it at the dipstick hole.I'm just glad I figured these guys out now instead of later.

I'm taking it back in the morning with a printout of a thread here on TT explaining the correct way to change the oil...

I have not ridden the bike real hard... hopefully the additional pressure hasn't caused any internal problems.

Thanks for the input guys.

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the other more "experienced" tech told him to add it at the dipstick hole.

I would have liked to have seen that. The '05 dipstick goes in a hole that's barely 3/8 inch in diameter. He probably spent hours trying to find a funnel that small. If he drained both the tank and the engine, it would have worked though.

But,

it

would

be

very

slow. :cry:

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