Which would you do first, offroad flywheel or Rekluse? (I realize both is the optimal setup)

[grayracer513]

If you are stalling at times when, for instance, you get slowed down in second, then turn up a sandy climb and give it some gas, only to have it do something like "thump, thump, clank", just as if you let the clutch out too fast, that's probably just what happened, and you can get rid of it by loosening up the engagement rate (as opposed to the engagement point).  With the Rekluse, this is accomplished by reducing the weight in the clutch.  Go from 27 balls to 24 on the Z-Start Pro, or use a slightly lighter wedge set (3 lighter 3 heavier, instead of 3 heavies, for instance) on EXP models.

 

If you are OK when you give it gas at low RPM, but it stalls if you suddenly close the throttle, the trouble is more than likely that your idle is set too rich, which causes the engine to "idle down" so rapidly that it drops below idle RPM momentarily and stalls.  A leaner idle makes the engine settle back to idle more slowly. 

[080]

If you are stalling at times when, for instance, you get slowed down in second, then turn up a sandy climb and give it some gas, only to have it do something like "thump, thump, clank", just as if you let the clutch out too fast, that's probably just what happened, and you can get rid of it by loosening up the engagement rate (as opposed to the engagement point).  With the Rekluse, this is accomplished by reducing the weight in the clutch.  Go from 27 balls to 24 on the Z-Start Pro, or use a slightly lighter wedge set (3 lighter 3 heavier, instead of 3 heavies, for instance) on EXP models.

 

If you are OK when you give it gas at low RPM, but it stalls if you suddenly close the throttle, the trouble is more than likely that your idle is set too rich, which causes the engine to "idle down" so rapidly that it drops below idle RPM momentarily and stalls.  A leaner idle makes the engine settle back to idle more slowly.

Its not Auto clutch related (not in my case) as it happens even with a manual clutch. I've always looked at it as just don't crack the throttle open to quick when the RPM's are close to idle (especially the older slower revving Xr type bikes). In all the bikes I've owned over the years its just been a 4strk trait, you just get use to it and adapt. Maybe a finely tuned bike would never have this issue who knows, I've never ridden one yet that didn't "pop stall", "flame out", whatever you want to call it.

[grayracer513]

Yes, and if the Rekluse is configured right, and the engine tuned right, the Rekluse will prevent that kind of stall.

[dirtdude723]

I should have my Z Start Pro by this time next week and plan to install it ASAP and give it a test shortly thereafter so by next weekend I should know what I think about Rekluse and/or have plenty of questions about how to fine tune it.

 

The used one I got is supposed to come with the manual, was in the pics anyway so we will see. I was going to just get the single part one for $390, but figured when I saw the Z Start Pro for $350 I would just take a chance on it get a nicer model for about the same.

 

I fully expect it to take some getting used to, but from everything I've heard and read once you get used to it you really like it, that or hate it, but seems the vast majority like the difference.

 

Guess I will see which lot I fall into in about 10 days.

 

Just for clarification, if setup propertly you can shift up or down without having to use the clutch, but you can always use it if you want.

 

Correct?

Edited March 21, 2014 by dirtdude723

[hostile silence]

I have been riding with a Rekluse Exp, or Core EXP 2.0 since 2011. I currently have a Rekluse Core EXP 2.0 in my 2014 YZ450F. I swear by it. I will probably never own a bike without the Rekluse. Not because it makes the bike "easier" to ride, but because it makes it more enjoyable and the bikes power is more useable. I was primarily a woods rider, but I am now riding motocross and indoors 95% of the time. The benefits on the track and in the woods are huge. I don't ride my bike to prove I wont get arm pump, I like riding my bike and not getting arm pump.

 

 

To anyone who acts like riding with a recluse is cheating, they should go back to stock suspension setup, take the pipe off the bike, return it 100% stock, because in all reality, any modification or personalization is an "attempt" to make the bike more "user-friendly" for the rider.

 

But, the EXP vs the Core EXP 2,0  --- I will always buy the Core EXP 2.0 because I can still use my clutch as stock and have stock feel, the EXP does not offer the same feel... the Z-Start pro feels so limp to me that I would never even be able to give it a shot

Edited March 21, 2014 by hostile silence

[RMBurrr]

I have been riding with a Rekluse Exp, or Core EXP 2.0 since 2011. I currently have a Rekluse Core EXP 2.0 in my 2014 YZ450F. I swear by it. I will probably never own a bike without the Rekluse. Not because it makes the bike "easier" to ride, but because it makes it more enjoyable and the bikes power is more useable. I was primarily a woods rider, but I am now riding motocross and indoors 95% of the time. The benefits on the track and in the woods are huge. I don't ride my bike to prove I wont get arm pump, I like riding my bike and not getting arm pump.

 

 

To anyone who acts like riding with a recluse is cheating, they should go back to stock suspension setup, take the pipe off the bike, return it 100% stock, because in all reality, any modification or personalization is an "attempt" to make the bike more "user-friendly" for the rider.

 

But, the EXP vs the Core EXP 2,0  --- I will always buy the Core EXP 2.0 because I can still use my clutch as stock and have stock feel, the EXP does not offer the same feel... the Z-Start pro feels so limp to me that I would never even be able to give it a shot

 

On the EXP vs. Core EXP comparison, is it just the clutch feel that is different? do they both perform well when not trying to use the clutch lever? Can you elaborate on how the Z start feels limp?

[hostile silence]

On the EXP vs. Core EXP comparison, is it just the clutch feel that is different? do they both perform well when not trying to use the clutch lever? Can you elaborate on how the Z start feels limp?The

Core EXP feels exactly like stock, except you can sit idling in gear and hit the throttle and move.

 

EXP feels stiff, and would definitely give you arm pump if you work the clutch.

 

The Core Exp is much more "tunable" and seems to perform a little better due to the "tunability". If you were able to dial in the EXP, it would perform as well as the Core EXP

 

Z-Start Pro, I have limited experience with this. A buddy of mine had one in his CRF, and if you weren't in the RPM's, it felt as if the clutch lever just dropped to the grip. Im not sure how to tune the Z-Start pro, and don't understand it. But, "Limp" is the best word I can describe it, and I would not like riding it...

 

Not sure if that helps, but if you have more questions, I could try to answer....

[RMBurrr]

Core EXP feels exactly like stock, except you can sit idling in gear and hit the throttle and move.

 

EXP feels stiff, and would definitely give you arm pump if you work the clutch.

 

The Core Exp is much more "tunable" and seems to perform a little better due to the "tunability". If you were able to dial in the EXP, it would perform as well as the Core EXP

 

Z-Start Pro, I have limited experience with this. A buddy of mine had one in his CRF, and if you weren't in the RPM's, it felt as if the clutch lever just dropped to the grip. Im not sure how to tune the Z-Start pro, and don't understand it. But, "Limp" is the best word I can describe it, and I would not like riding it...

 

Not sure if that helps, but if you have more questions, I could try to answer....

 

Thanks for the info, I'm on the fence between the core exp and the $400 Exp. I'm a pretty mellow rider and can probably do well with the cheaper clutch.

[RMBurrr]

The core EXP looks just like the cheaper EXP, but with the full stack of friction plates and a taller clutch cover. Are they actually more "tuneable"?

[grayracer513]

The "limp" comment is more than likely a reference to the extremely light clutch pull the Z-Start Pro has compared with either of the EXP models.  In fact, "disconnected" is more like how it feels at idle or with the engine off.  Even at speed, one finger is all that's required to override the clutch.  The other thing that bugs some people, mostly those who try to manually modulate the clutch, is that it's awkward and difficult to do while the clutch is busy modulating itself (at speeds between idle and fully engaged), and the results are usually what an observer would see as sloppy clutch work. 

 

What must be understood is that it isn't ever necessary for the rider to take over the job of controlling clutch engagement at those speeds, for one thing, and one should realize that he isn't ever going to be able to do a better job of it than the clutch does on its own.  The Z-Start in particular is incredibly smooth and predictable in engagement, and once dialed in, the rider basically never needs to mess with the lever much at all.  Most off-roaders who have tried both seem to prefer the Z over the Core EXP in the very technical stuff, but the Core clutch is improving all the time. 

[hostile silence]

The core EXP looks just like the cheaper EXP, but with the full stack of friction plates and a taller clutch cover. Are they actually more "tuneable"?

"tuneable" in the sense you can adjust it to engage stronger (but with less clutch life) or softer (with a little more clutch life)

 

I guess you can tune the regular EXP also, but it doesn't seem to be as functional... I'm honestly not real sure how to explain it better!!!

 

As far as riding with the Core or EXP or Z-Start in technical stuff, they all are friendly, require less thought than stock clutch, and add to the pleasure of not having to kick the bike because of stalling it...

Edited March 21, 2014 by hostile silence

[ScottYo]

I got a zstart pro (Hi / Hard) and GYTR flywheel, great combo!

 

However... what made the biggest difference for me with stalling and ride-ability in the tight stuff was an injectioneering modified throttle body, I have not stalled it after putting on and it really smoothed out the lower rpm power.

[grayracer513]

"tuneable" in the sense you can adjust it to engage stronger (but with less clutch life) or softer (with a little more clutch life)

 

 

This part is backward.  The harder and quicker the clutch engages, the longer it will last.

 

Both the EXP 3.0 and the Core EXP are tunable in the same sense that the Z-Start Pro is.  Spring tension can be changed to adjust the engagement point (the speed at which the clutch begins to engage) and the weight of the wedges can be changed to adjust the engagement rate (how quickly it goes from starting to engage to completely engaged).  The two clutches operate on the same principal, but the Core has a built in adjustment for the plate clearance on the disengaged clutch, whereas the EXP 3.0 depends on the adjustment of the cable to hold the clutch open at idle (a feature called "free play gain").  The operation of the Core is a bit smoother and more predictable, and the clutch lever feel is more "normal".

[hostile silence]

This part is backward.  The harder and quicker the clutch engages, the longer it will last.

 

Both the EXP 3.0 and the Core EXP are tunable in the same sense that the Z-Start Pro is.  Spring tension can be changed to adjust the engagement point (the speed at which the clutch begins to engage) and the weight of the wedges can be changed to adjust the engagement rate (how quickly it goes from starting to engage to completely engaged).  The two clutches operate on the same principal, but the Core has a built in adjustment for the plate clearance on the disengaged clutch, whereas the EXP 3.0 depends on the adjustment of the cable to hold the clutch open at idle (a feature called "free play gain").  The operation of the Core is a bit smoother and more predictable, and the clutch lever feel is more "normal".

the Core, and the Core EXP both have "free play gain"... but yes, the Core EXP is smoother, less strenuous on the arms to pull the clutch, and much nicer in my opinion...

[grayracer513]

the Core, and the Core EXP both have "free play gain"...

 

The difference is that the Core has free play at an idle, the EXP does not.

[hostile silence]

The difference is that the Core has free play at an idle, the EXP does not

 

The Free Play at idle doesn't really make much of a difference.

The real difference is the Core EXP feels stock, rides stock, but can also be used as auto, whereas the EXP doesn't feel stock, doesn't really even ride like stock, but can be used as an auto...

 

Rekluse Replaced 3 EXP's for me, basically because the EXP is not as good, and is not nearly as "fine-tuneable"... from the second I installed the Core EXP 2.0, the thing worked properly, didn't burn up...

Edited March 21, 2014 by hostile silence

[grayracer513]

The Free Play at idle doesn't really make much of a difference.

 

Not in terms of "feel", perhaps, but the Core clutch needs to have it, or the lack of it will have the same effect as on any manual clutch: burnt plates.  The EXP series has to rely on cable tension to hold the clutch released, so it can't have any slack at idle.

[hostile silence]

That good sir, is correct indeed

[dirtdude723]

 injectioneering modified throttle body

 

WHAT???

[grayracer513]

 injectioneering modified throttle body

 

WHAT???

 

For the EFI bikes.  Doesn't apply to your '09.