2T synthetic oil as CRF engine oil, or 4T synthetic as a premix?


13 replies to this topic
  • txkawboy

Posted 21 December 2012 - 10:47 AM

#1

...the job that the engine oil does in a CRF seems to me to be closer to that of a 2T engine oil, except for the shear-factor involved in the CRF top-end's gears.
So why wouldn't a quality full-ester 2T oil be a better choice for the CRF' engine? (B/c it def ain't CHEAPER...).

Or, what would happen if I mixed up premix, using the 4T Rotella syn "engine oil" that I get so cheaply thru work??
It cannot be that bad of a choice, b/c I had an old big-bore RM250 that kept eating RH crank seals, so I started using 2T oil in its gearbox instead of gear oil; the thing was used as a ratbike anyway. It never caused a problem that I could tell, and bikes are usually junk way before the gearbox lets go anyway, so...??

The msds for certain quality ester 2T oil lists the oil as *completely* non-toxic---meaning the base oil is so darn good to begin with that no additive-package/toxic is even added...wow. So unless the few gears in the CRF top-end truly need the additive added to a full ester synthetic, then wouldn't a "dedicated" top-end 2T oil be best?

***Please do not contribute any hypothetical rhetoric; there are some knowledgable dudes on here, and it is to them that this post is aimed...but I appreciate your interest, nontheless. LoL***

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • shrubitup

Posted 21 December 2012 - 12:07 PM

#2

uh, "good" smoker oil is 50-60$ per gallon. That's $14 a quart. How much is "good" four stroke oil? Rotella/SuperTech/Chevron Delo is $3.25 a quart if purchased as a gallon.

Lucas semi-synthetic two cycle oil is $27 a gallon though ($6.75/qt.).

  • txkawboy

Posted 21 December 2012 - 01:25 PM

#3

...re-read; was not trying to save $$$, was wondering if it would make for better top-end protection...esp considering how little oil the CRF has there.
U r lucky, Rot T here is $17 unless on sale, and that is only at Wallyworld...tho I use wet-clutch GEAR oil in wet clutch GEAR boxes... LoL

  • shrubitup

Posted 21 December 2012 - 01:48 PM

#4

...re-read; was not trying to save $$$, was wondering if it would make for better top-end protection...esp considering how little oil the CRF has there.
U r lucky, Rot T here is $17 unless on sale, and that is only at Wallyworld...tho I use wet-clutch GEAR oil in wet clutch GEAR boxes... LoL


The fact that the oil is not churned up by the gears and clutch actually makes for some good lubrication/oil longevity in your motor vice those that have the shared duty bikes (other than Honda mostly).

  • vlad7890

Posted 21 December 2012 - 02:14 PM

#5

...the job that the engine oil does in a CRF seems to me to be closer to that of a 2T engine oil, except for the shear-factor involved in the CRF top-end's gears.
So why wouldn't a quality full-ester 2T oil be a better choice for the CRF' engine?


Why do you say so, is it because this oil isn't used to run through transmission and clutch? If so you could argue that all automotive engine oils should be premix type. Apparently there are some rather big differences in operating demands on premix and motor oil types and that's why they were developed to begin with.

  • txkawboy

Posted 21 December 2012 - 03:04 PM

#6

Apparently...


"Apparently" you say?! No apparently to it, shear is a factor---as I stated---but that still does not answer my QUESTION, comrad Vladimir.
" ***Please do not contribute any hypothetical rhetoric; there are some knowledgable dudes on here, and it is to them that this post is aimed...but I appreciate your interest, nontheless. LoL*** "
Puh-leeze---if you do not KNOW, then shutup. Else this thread will wind up thirty pages long filled with anecdotes. Thanks.

...sigh...

  • Guest Lurker214

Posted 23 December 2012 - 08:25 AM

#7

Yes it would work.....dick.

  • highmarker

Posted 23 December 2012 - 08:38 AM

#8

without the hypothetical's? not a good idea, 2 completely different formulations

  • Guest Lurker214

Posted 23 December 2012 - 11:07 AM

#9

.....but it would work. Bad idea yes

  • TheKoolAidMadeMeSick

Posted 23 December 2012 - 01:00 PM

#10

What is the point.
The oils we have now and use now work extremely well.

Two stroke oil is NOT meant for high temperatures, and is designed to burn and leave as little residue behind as possible.


Four stroke MB oil is long-chain polymers, and two-stroke oil is super short-chain polymers.

MA oil is even longer chain polymers.

  • Lead Head

Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:20 AM

#11

Those shear forces you brush off are extremely important. These modern direct-bucket valve-trains are extremely hard on oil, and the small wrist pin probably isn't much easier on the oil either.

Four stroke oils are specifically designed with many additives to enhance high-temperature protection, be shear-resistant, and resist the damage and formation of acids from combustion byproducts.

Two-stroke oils don't need any of that. The crankcase temperatures are low, no valve-train or journal bearings that need special care. The oil is constantly burned and replenished, so it doesn't really need to resist breaking down from shear forces.

  • C R Fever

Posted 24 December 2012 - 06:55 PM

#12

"Apparently" you say?! No apparently to it, shear is a factor---as I stated---but that still does not answer my QUESTION, comrad Vladimir.
" ***Please do not contribute any hypothetical rhetoric; there are some knowledgable dudes on here, and it is to them that this post is aimed...but I appreciate your interest, nontheless. LoL*** "
Puh-leeze---if you do not KNOW, then shutup. Else this thread will wind up thirty pages long filled with anecdotes. Thanks.

...sigh...


I did over 4 hours of research on oil for our two new CRF 450's. I'd share but I'm toooo scared to post in this thread. good luck finding answers.

Edited by C R Fever, 24 December 2012 - 06:56 PM.


  • txkawboy

Posted 28 December 2012 - 09:50 AM

#13

Thanks Krannie and Lead...I knew if I held out that someone would actually know...

  • vlad7890

Posted 28 December 2012 - 12:20 PM

#14

...the job that the engine oil does in a CRF seems to me to be closer to that of a 2T engine oil...


Well I was mostly interested in how you came to this assumption because I couldn't see any reasoning behind it. Have a good day.





Related Content

Forums
Photo

Identifying showa shock springs? by sandy450


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   Honda 2-Stroke
  • 3 replies
Forums
Photo

2014 Honda crf450r problems by Tjcrf450r


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   CRF450R
  • 16 replies
Forums
Photo

Best clutch for my needs by x2fanatic


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   CRF450R
  • Hot  67 replies
Forums
Photo

2006 Rebuild Cost by tw191


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   CRF450R
  • Hot  34 replies
Forums
Photo

2003 crf450r by bain33


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   CRF450R
  • Hot  29 replies
 
x

Join Our Community!

Even if you don't want to post, registered members get access to tools that make finding & following the good stuff easier.

Register Close
If you enjoyed reading about "" here in the ThumperTalk archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join ThumperTalk today!

The views and opinions expressed on this page are strictly those of the author, and have not been reviewed or approved by ThumperTalk.