11 450 Intakes ideas


19 replies to this topic
  • NW450

Posted August 14, 2012 - 07:44 AM

#1

I use my 11 450f mainly for snowbiking in the winter. I keep having issues with filling my air box up with snow. I have the two intakes on the shrouds covered with prefilter mesh, but somehow snow is still getting in. I believe the shrouds flex outward when busting through deep anow and allow snow to come in from the underside of the shrouds. Is there any aftermarket companies making intakes kits beside twin/no toil/ etc? Or does anyone have ideas on how i could build my own custom set up?

Thanks

  • poppa

Posted August 16, 2012 - 02:14 PM

#2

not to be a smart ass but maybe the snowmobile folks would have some insight. we don't have that prob. here in texas.

Edited by poppa, August 16, 2012 - 02:15 PM.


  • NW450

Posted August 17, 2012 - 11:36 AM

#3

i am a snowmobile folk and i can think of much so far besdies a turbo :thumbsup:

there has got to be some aftermarket companies doing an intake, or something i can build myself

  • poppa

Posted August 17, 2012 - 01:35 PM

#4

what happens when the snow gets in, does it drown out the motor? I was concerned with water entering the intake ducting when we bought our bike but it hasn't been an issue. Maybe you could seal the sides of the air box were the side shrouds cover to prevent the flexing open affect your talking about. Or mabe block the sides and front off totally and dont run the cover over the air filter, just let it suck air from below the tank.

  • stroker101

Posted August 18, 2012 - 02:50 PM

#5

maybe block off the shroud intakes totally, then modify the shrouds where the intake is on the side? or, this may not be pretty,...but some 4 wheeler guy's (including myself) build snorkel's on our ATV's so we can submerge them in water. maybe use some flexable hose to run the intakes over and back across the shrouds, mounted somewhere near or past the fuel cap???

this mod would only be for snow riding. just trying to help lol

Edited by stroker101, August 18, 2012 - 02:55 PM.


  • Joe_Jet

Posted August 19, 2012 - 11:36 PM

#6

PC racing makes little filter plugs that go in the intakes in the shrouds

  • NW450

Posted August 20, 2012 - 09:59 AM

#7

what happens when the snow gets in, does it drown out the motor? I was concerned with water entering the intake ducting when we bought our bike but it hasn't been an issue. Maybe you could seal the sides of the air box were the side shrouds cover to prevent the flexing open affect your talking about. Or mabe block the sides and front off totally and dont run the cover over the air filter, just let it suck air from below the tank.


it doesnt completely drown out the motor, just gets lazy, buts still runs. I believe its the shrouds flexing out that causes part of it

maybe block off the shroud intakes totally, then modify the shrouds where the intake is on the side? or, this may not be pretty,...but some 4 wheeler guy's (including myself) build snorkel's on our ATV's so we can submerge them in water. maybe use some flexable hose to run the intakes over and back across the shrouds, mounted somewhere near or past the fuel cap???

this mod would only be for snow riding. just trying to help lol


I would love to make a snorkel of some sort, it doesnt have to be pretty, just functional. I have no concern with it being pretty when we are 50 miles or more out in the mountains in winter. I suppose the best way would be to buy some extra shrouds and cut them and use some sort of carbon fiber/ mesh material to create a round opening that you could attach tubing to. I would think having it routed up right above the gas cap area would work best. I am concerned with how this would affect the bikes ability to breathe, and the tuning, but i suppose i could always install and AFR sensor and tune it with the gytr tuner as needed. I am assuming it wouldnt be hard, Insight on this?

PC racing makes little filter plugs that go in the intakes in the shrouds


I cant seem to find anything...
http://www.pcracingusa.com/

Thanks for the replies, keep em comin!

Edited by NW450, August 20, 2012 - 10:00 AM.


  • wileo

Posted August 20, 2012 - 07:02 PM

#8

Try covering you whole air box in pet proof screen door mesh. We're doing that on sleds to stop snow from coming threw are hood vents

  • NW450

Posted August 22, 2012 - 05:34 PM

#9

Try covering you whole air box in pet proof screen door mesh. We're doing that on sleds to stop snow from coming threw are hood vents


i dont think that will make much difference. it will choke out just like w/o the pet screen. I need a way to seal the intake or midify it to draw air from higher up(snorkel) and be snow proof. Thank you for the suggestion tho

  • stroker101

Posted August 22, 2012 - 08:15 PM

#10

i'm wondering if a heat gun could be used to soften the plastic intake tubing on the inside of the shrouds enough to insert a small diameter pipe (pvc, metal) to help shape the opening to accept the flexable hose/tubing?

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  • NW450

Posted August 23, 2012 - 06:31 AM

#11

i'm wondering if a heat gun could be used to soften the plastic intake tubing on the inside of the shrouds enough to insert a small diameter pipe (pvc, metal) to help shape the opening to accept the flexable hose/tubing?


thats a good idea, i think if i were to build "snorkels", i would completely remove the shrouds and try to make a way for the snorkel to be attached directly to the airbox.

i have 2 main concerns though....
1. tuning, how am i going to know what my state of tune is? i would think it will be mandatory to run an afr sensor in the pipe to watch my ratio and tune as needed.
2. is there some type of plastic forming kit that i could use to build the "adapter" to fit the airbox openings then run into a 3 or 4 inch style intake hose with a filer on it?

  • NW450

Posted August 23, 2012 - 06:35 AM

#12

...or, could a guy get away with completely deleting the airbox and running a tube style intake directly to the throttle body assembly? and pros or cons of doing it that way?

Edited by NW450, August 23, 2012 - 06:36 AM.


  • grayracer513

Posted August 23, 2012 - 07:05 AM

#13

1. tuning, how am i going to know what my state of tune is? i would think it will be mandatory to run an afr sensor in the pipe to watch my ratio and tune as needed.


I have no idea what you're concerned with here. The path the air takes into the air box is not an element of intake tuning, and the only thing you need to worry about is limiting the airflow to a level less that that required by the engine. Specifically, if you restrict the flow too much, you'll create a depression (low air pressure) within the air box at full throttle that will impact performance. With a carb, this would of course "choke" the engine and make it rich, but with EFI, it won't change the AF ratio because the unit will compensate for it (except in extreme cases) as if it were an altitude increase.

The tuning of the intake tract for power begins at the duct in the air boot that runs from the filter to the throttle body, not before. Simply design the smallest cross sectional area (or the sum of two) to be at least 140 percent of the throttle body bore and things will be fine. The key is to maintain a large air volume around the filter on both sides to give the intake a volume of relatively still air to draw from.

What you need to do in reality is find out where the snow is coming from; what path it takes to invade the air box. A video camera will help with this. Then just put some plastic panels in the way to block it.

  • NW450

Posted August 23, 2012 - 08:17 AM

#14

I have no idea what you're concerned with here. The path the air takes into the air box is not an element of intake tuning, and the only thing you need to worry about is limiting the airflow to a level less that that required by the engine. Specifically, if you restrict the flow too much, you'll create a depression (low air pressure) within the air box at full throttle that will impact performance. With a carb, this would of course "choke" the engine and make it rich, but with EFI, it won't change the AF ratio because the unit will compensate for it (except in extreme cases) as if it were an altitude increase.

The tuning of the intake tract for power begins at the duct in the air boot that runs from the filter to the throttle body, not before. Simply design the smallest cross sectional area (or the sum of two) to be at least 140 percent of the throttle body bore and things will be fine. The key is to maintain a large air volume around the filter on both sides to give the intake a volume of relatively still air to draw from.

[color=#ff0000]So you could delete the airbox and go with a tube directly the hose on the bottom of the airbox as long as its the same size or bigger?[/color]
[color=#ff0000]Posted Image[/color]

What you need to do in reality is find out where the snow is coming from; what path it takes to invade the air box. A video camera will help with this. Then just put some plastic panels in the way to block it.

[color=#ff0000]that would certainly be easier, but im kind of tired of dealing with the stock intake system in the snow environment, if it does plug up, its a real pain to access and clean out in a snowstorm(ask me how i know haha).[/color] [color=#ff0000]It would be nice to have a simple snorkel style intake that is easy to service in the shop or on the mountain.[/color]



  • grayracer513

Posted August 23, 2012 - 08:32 AM

#15

You can't delete the air box, no. There has to be a plenum surrounding the mouth of the air intake tunnel and/or air filter that allows the air velocity to drop to as near zero as possible for two reasons: to allow dirt to fall out of the air stream without impacting the filter, and to simulate the open atmosphere. This second element is important because large air chamber, or plenum is where the intake tunnel in the air boot "plugs in" to the air flow, and the more it looks to the engine as if that's just out in the open someplace, the better the intake tuning will be.

Any duct work would either need to be attached to the existing air box where the shrouds connect, or be run from a remotely mounted filter to a cover placed over the lower section of the box (item 10 in your drawing) where the filter would have normally been.

One solution might be to modify a pair of shrouds so as to block off the normal air path completely, then add external ducting at their top corners. These could be shaped to rise higher and face rearward.

  • NW450

Posted August 23, 2012 - 09:10 AM

#16

You can't delete the air box, no. There has to be a plenum surrounding the mouth of the air intake tunnel and/or air filter that allows the air velocity to drop to as near zero as possible for two reasons: to allow dirt to fall out of the air stream without impacting the filter, and to simulate the open atmosphere. This second element is important because large air chamber, or plenum is where the intake tunnel in the air boot "plugs in" to the air flow, and the more it looks to the engine as if that's just out in the open someplace, the better the intake tuning will be.

Any duct work would either need to be attached to the existing air box where the shrouds connect, or be run from a remotely mounted filter to a cover placed over the lower section of the box (item 10 in your drawing) where the filter would have normally been.

One solution might be to modify a pair of shrouds so as to block off the normal air path completely, then add external ducting at their top corners. These could be shaped to rise higher and face rearward.


that sounds like the ticket right there. so basically if the intake system still has the "airbox"(number 10 in the picture) it shouldnt change the tuning of the bike to a point that the stock system cant self correct. I will be in the garage tonight!

Thank you for your help sir!

  • Mick17

Posted August 25, 2012 - 05:23 AM

#17

Water proof outerwear.............http://www.outerwear...?cat=12348&pg=2.

  • Darvo

Posted October 25, 2012 - 02:51 PM

#18

Water proof outerwear.............http://www.outerwear...?cat=12348&pg=2.


The problem that I've seen with the yamaha's is that snow gets into the airbox and sits on top of the outerwear prefilter and ultimately chokes the engine down.

Have you come up with anything NW450? I have a couple of friends with mountain horses on these bikes, I get sick of stopping and waiting while they clean out the airbox.

  • dfinn

Posted October 25, 2012 - 03:10 PM

#19

http://www.frogzskin.com/

how about some of that? it covers all the vents on my sled and keeps snow out but air flowing in.

  • NW450

Posted October 29, 2012 - 06:18 AM

#20

i havent done much with the intake yet. its hunting season and i am out of town 3-4 days a week. i will keep you posted as soon as i come up with a solution. Thanks





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