gripping the bike with knees


87 replies to this topic
  • jqueen

Posted 27 June 2012 - 12:55 PM

#81

tye1138, on 27 June 2012 - 12:29 PM, said:

Yes, nobody ever suggested pinching in tight-technical areas. Pinching is used when moving along at a decent clip when the bike might get out of shape from hitting things like roots, rocks, dirt bumps, etc.



Again, we could argue semantics all day long, but generally speaking, people who are visiting the forums and are wishing to discuss "pinching" are usually riding an off-road motorcycle of some kind. Trials bikes don't belong in the same class as off-road bikes in my opinion, as they not only are totally different in design, but are even ridden totally differently. Its like comparing a down hill mountain bike to an off-road dirt bike. There are similarities, they can both do the same thing in reality, but we don't talk about MTB riding here because they are way smaller and have no motor. Yes, Trials techniques are great for slow situations going through super technical terrain. In fact, Shane Watt's and Kurt Caselli, teach trials techniques in-parallel with off-road/motocross techniques in their training videos. Guys like Taddy Blazusiak, use trials techniques all the time when riding enduro, its critical. However, once the speed increases, he's back to running off-road/motocross riding techniques.

So yes, speed dictates which skills you use. If your doing low-speed technical riding, then pinching isn't as important to learn. However, when one thinks of an off-road motorcycle, one should first think of going at a good clip speed wise. Which is where techniques like pinching belong... :devil:

I'm still amazed that you seem to pigeonhole off-road riding to only the stuff you do.  The original question was specifically directed to woods and trail riding, in Kentucky....  which doesn't sound like first thinking of going at a good clip speed wise.

I rode dirt bikes from the age of 4 to the age of 32 before I got into going fast as a goal.  I've done a couple of hare scrambles now, and I'm still slower in the open sections and fast in the technical sections.  I attribute my slowness in the open sections to not gripping the bike enough.  But "when one thinks of an off-road motorcycle, one should first think of going at a good clip speed wise" is just the way you like to ride, man.  It's not part of the requirements for enjoying a KDX/XR/EXC/KLX, etc.

The main thing that people seemed to be disagreeing with was your attitude of completely disregarding other people's experience and saying that somehow what they do isn't off-road, when for many of us, it is the epitome of off-road.   There are tons and tons of posts regarding trials in the off-road section.

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  • tye1138

Posted 27 June 2012 - 02:20 PM

#82

jqueen, on 27 June 2012 - 12:55 PM, said:

The main thing that people seemed to be disagreeing with was your attitude of completely disregarding other people's experience and saying that somehow what they do isn't off-road, when for many of us, it is the epitome of off-road.   There are tons and tons of posts regarding trials in the off-road section.

To me, trials isn't off-road riding as you don't use an off-road bike (KDX/XR/EXC/KLX). Yes, you can do trials type of riding with off-road bikes, its called enduro... similar concept, but done with a motocross bike. I posted GOBS of stills with the MASTER of enduro, pinching the bike as he "hops" around the enduro track like he was riding a trials bike. Again, trials skills on an off-road bike. Nothing wrong with that, its just another set of skills for an off-road rider to master.

I'm not disagreeing with the trials-only riders, I'm merely saying; trials isn't off-road.

When I paint a picture of off-road, I see mountains, tree's, single track, lil dirt roads, lil streams, grass, mud, dust, sand, rocks and maybe even some snow.

You would use trials skills for the single track section and navigating through the slow speed stuff. You'd use standard off-road skills navigating through everything else.

Trials bikes aren't doing 200 miles a day enduro events... lets face it, they are designed for closed circuit events over varying terrains at slow speeds.

Edited by tye1138, 27 June 2012 - 02:21 PM.


  • jqueen

Posted 27 June 2012 - 04:21 PM

#83

If you think enduro is trials type riding then you either don't know what enduro is or you don't know what trials is.  Your fancy pictures show that legs were touching the bike.  Is that the definition of pinching?  If it is then maybe I've always done it.  I have to make a concious effort to take my legs off of the side of the bike, but there is no gripping involved unless I try to.

You need to get some trail riding done outside your comfort zone.  I think you are missing out on the more gnarly side of off-road (yes on dirt bikes).

Edited by jqueen, 27 June 2012 - 04:22 PM.


  • tye1138

Posted 27 June 2012 - 09:14 PM

#84

jqueen, on 27 June 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

If you think enduro is trials type riding then you either don't know what enduro is or you don't know what trials is.  

When it comes to obstacles, especially in endurocross, they have more similarities then riding pinned on an open plain, riding single track through the woods, traversing up mountains on dirt roads, etc.

jqueen, on 27 June 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

Your fancy pictures show that legs were touching the bike.  Is that the definition of pinching?  If it is then maybe I've always done it.  I have to make a concious effort to take my legs off of the side of the bike, but there is no gripping involved unless I try to.

Yes, when your legs touch the bike, you are basically pinching it. How much force you put on the bike when your legs touch it, is up to you. You've gotta understand something, unless you're a really small person, your legs will NOT touch the bike if your just standing on it. It takes effort to actually bend your legs in to touch the frame. This is why knee braces are so kool, because they take-up the space you'd normally have between your leg and the bike, so you don't have to really put much effort into grappling the bike.

jqueen, on 27 June 2012 - 04:21 PM, said:

You need to get some trail riding done outside your comfort zone.  I think you are missing out on the more gnarly side of off-road (yes on dirt bikes).

I have done some gnarly stop/start trail riding. Its why I'm such a good lane splitter on my street bike. Its all clutch, throttle and body position at low speeds. Trust me, I completely understand where your coming from.

Edited by tye1138, 27 June 2012 - 09:15 PM.


  • Sierra_rider

Posted 01 July 2012 - 01:21 PM

#85

tye1138, on 27 June 2012 - 09:14 PM, said:

Yes, when your legs touch the bike, you are basically pinching it. How much force you put on the bike when your legs touch it, is up to you. You've gotta understand something, unless you're a really small person, your legs will NOT touch the bike if your just standing on it. It takes effort to actually bend your legs in to touch the frame. This is why knee braces are so kool, because they take-up the space you'd normally have between your leg and the bike, so you don't have to really put much effort into grappling the bike.

I practically have to stand bow-legged for my lower legs to not touch the frame. At 6'1" I don't see myself as short either. Just because my legs are touching the frame, doesn't mean that I'm always pinching the bike.

  • ridinredneck

Posted 04 July 2012 - 10:00 PM

#86

WOW!!!! i had no idea that this would turn in to a 5 page debate. there are a lot of good points from both sides. thanks for all the info. after reading all the posts, i believe that i may be doing it correctly after all. sometimes i pinch, sometimes not. depends on the section of trail. just so you folks know, i dont cruise trails, i go as fast as i can and try to get faster by trying different things. i also do a lot of single track, hill climbs and rocky sections. and from all the info in this thread, i think i can do them all better now. thanks to all who posted.

  • Dezert_Man

Posted 06 July 2012 - 01:04 PM

#87

My style of riding is weight over the bars, elbows up, grip the tank with your knees, then adjust body position through turns. Keep in mind this is higher speed desert riding, lots of whoops.

  • whillys

Posted 06 July 2012 - 06:39 PM

#88

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