upon finding a 120 acre plot for sale perfect for an mx track permission from the township to build it was denied, apparently the illegaly run mx track in that town gets noise complaints so even though it would be completely secluded even the mention of a track is shot down. Every other track i have ever been to is closer to homes and businesses than this location. The plan is to approach them again with an enforced decibel rating, what else can you do to entice a township to allow a track? I can see why i have to drive so far to ride when this sport is viewed as such a nuisance.

Let them know how many thousands of dollars a year this will bring to the community, also how much you will be paying on taxes once you improve the property. But even with the right zoning you could be in for a long road of court battles with the neighbors if they dont want it there. There are many more issues than noise, like liability, dust, hours of operation ect...

its a damn shame, center of the property has clearings for parking, the woods around the clearings has been thinned by logging, clay in the ground. I have access to all equipment free of charge and nowhere to build

.
You have to provide a solid business plan to the town that shows they will make a lot of money from the track and have ZERO expenses.  Offer to name the place after the mayor of the head of the city council. You have to do a lot of schmoozing before you submit a request for a rezoning and a enterprise as you are thinking.

Tell them it's either a swingers/nudist campground or an MX track, their choice.


What was their reasoning for disallowing the MX track?

Chickenhauler, on 19 May 2012 - 05:07 PM, said:

the noise of the illegally run track is the reason, its being shut down in a week or two. What we've come up with so far is creating a sound efficient track design with straight aways in low spots etc, manditory decibel rating, some noise barriers with tree row on top, working with the neighbors on hours of operation, a seperation of motos so its not 7 straight hours of rumble, and in general keeping the loudest parts of the track in the woods to deaden as much as possible. Possibly a discount to quieter bikes, discount or free riding for family of track neighbors. We're doing a demonstration to the township of quieter exhaust systems compared to what theyre used to hearing, decibel meter on the way. A family tie has been found to the leader of township so hopefully we can persuade them.

Ah, you have already rubbed the neighbors the wrong way by running an illegal track. You are going to find you have a uphill battle. They already have 'facts' and may well feel the only reason you want to 'go legal' is because you must. Certainly not getting off on the right foot. Stage a cookout/block party for the neighbors. Show them you are good people. Win their hearts first, their minds will soon follow. You need them to be in support of what you want to do prior to speaking to the town about it.

William1, on 21 May 2012 - 02:21 PM, said:

no i have nothing to do with the illegal track, ive ridden there, the layout of the track lets sound carry pretty far and a few of the board members can hear the track. They have wide open hours of operation and no desibel limit so it kinda gives motocross a bad name in that aspect, cookout is a good idea, we were even thinking maybe a riding club that does some volunteer work in the town

Edited by jjhubbard15, 21 May 2012 - 02:37 PM.

hire or consult an architect that is knowledgeable in local codes and ordinances and has experience developing commercial properties. You are going to need one anyways to submit parking plans and zoning studies and drawings for any occupiable structures guests will be using.

The plus side is the arch will probably know people who can help get things done or the very least know how to play the game (ie paper work required) that will force nay sayers to back up their No with citable law that gives them the power to say what can and can't be done on a property.

rharr, on 21 May 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

This is the best advice given yet, I've seen people battle for years with their township for permits for one thing or another and it didn't come through for them in till they hired an architect or engineer that knows the ropes.

I defiantly agree with rharr %100. Besides that though are you outside of the city limits? One of our local tracks was outside of the city limits but just barley and they had the track open as a business and they citizens raised enough crap about noise and dust that the track was shut down. Now 2 years later they finally got the track open by calling it a "private track" and you make donations and sign a waiver.

What I'm trying to say is that if the city wouldn't approve it you might have a hard time getting them to change their mind.

Best of luck though!

jjhubbard15, on 21 May 2012 - 02:25 PM, said:

I apologize for my poor choice of words before. I should of said "Those that have possession of/own the land". I assumed it was your property. Thanks for not misreading my comment.

William1, on 21 May 2012 - 03:59 PM, said:

ur fine, i see how you read it that way, i am just as guilty as the owners for having ridden there myself, i didnt really care if their neighbors were pissed.....but now....

is there anything in the code that says you cant have an MX track? or is it them just saying no you cant? We had an old guy in my town that loved to piss people off. He sat a double wide trailer house ontop of bails of old car tires then skirted it in. When the city got word of it they sent the zoning commissioner down there to tell him to take it apart. He got a lawyer and took it to court. The judge said the city just cant make up rules as they go just cause they dont like something or someone.  He said if it wasnt in the books at the time he built the house there was nothing the city could do.

slyderHD, on 21 May 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

there isnt anything about an mx track, but from what we've dug up theres something about the right to enjoy your land including the peace and quiet that came with it, which ultimately leaves it up to the township to interprate that as they please, we may just buy the land and destroy it by turning it into a gravel pit, and logging it off, which will be way louder than a noise conscoius mx track. Maybe throw a gun range in just to ice the cake for them. I really hope it doesnt come to that though

jjhubbard15, on 21 May 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

Sounds like you finally got the idea! haha

looks like its possible to simulate the amount of noise that would be generated http://journalstar.c...48743bf750.html

Would you not even be able to open it as a private track?

Did you mention to them that it would give the people somewhere to ride that isn't right by their houses where they can hear it? Relocating their current problem to a rural area where no one will care.

rharr, on 21 May 2012 - 02:48 PM, said:

Good advice but you really need a Civil Engineering. The Architect will be needed if your going to put up a building or structure.  

This is no different then any projects I have done over the last 20+ years. The key understand is your jurisdictions criteria.  Look up the items below first in bold.  The other items are things to think about that your city may require.

ZONING: Has the City already classified the property in the zoning map or long range plan?  120 acres with homes around, may have a SF rating (Single Family) or a component for SF an MU-C1 (Mixed Use or Commercial rating)   If it is not classified yet by the City that is one huge steep forward.

LOCATION:  See if it really is in the City limits?  It may not be in the City but in a county which can change the aspect totally.

Understand if you go through the process the CIty engineering department more than likely require CIVIL documents for the following items at minimum:

Road Access
Keep it private, you can use Ingress/Egress easements to cover yourself for the public and not pay fees for the public roads. If you allow the public you have to have a clear access that allows life safety (Police, ambulance, fire, etc) to access cleanly.

GESC (Grading-Erosion Control Plans)
Your moving a lot of dirt and the EPA has regulations that all jurisdications are to follow!!  It mainly deals with water quality for tributary water in streams and creeks.  **Note about 75% of all water is WATERS OF THE U.S. that is how the EPA applies it!  EDIT: The EPA can fine up to $10,000 violations, trust me I did a Walmart project and they paid 140K  in fines over two weeks plus clean up cost just get the project open as the revenue was greater if they opened on time!!

Actually there are alot of things you may need but those two are always issues IF you get the zoning approved for a track.

I will say, if you do your presentation right, ask for a "Temporary" permit.  The other track set a precedent you have to overcome. Tell them you want to PROVE it to them with only a temporary permit, say 5-10 years.  If they say to long, tell them it will take that long to make changes and adjustments required to appease the concerns as the site progresses.

There is to much honestly to list, if you want some input shoot me a message and I will help you anyway I can.

Edited by Bkew, 22 May 2012 - 09:25 AM.