mkeeping, on 02 May 2012 - 09:59 AM, said:

thanks for the info.

MELK-MAN, on 02 May 2012 - 07:00 AM, said:

Well said, And after an hour of riding and you make a mistake and hit a root or rock that stops you dead in your tracks on the side of a rock ledge = your bike stays running weather you had your hand on the clutch in time or not = hit the gas to pull yourself out of the hole you were in!

That's where the Rekluse shines!

MELK-MAN, on 02 May 2012 - 07:00 AM, said:

happy seal, on 02 May 2012 - 03:39 PM, said:

I guess it was the way this bike was set up but the clutch was 10x harder to pull than the stock one and when i tired to lug it up a hill the clutch kept engaging and disengaging. did not like it at all. I don't race just ride fast trail and after I upgraded to a heavier flywheel I have yet to stall it even once. When I crash or high side off a berm the bike stalls out because of the carb not because the tire stopped the engine. The only reason I was even thinking about using the rekluse was because I got the timbersled  mountain horse track kit, But after talking with some guys that have run it with and with out the rekluse they say no also. Also while we have some single track here, most of our trails wide open trails 40"+ trails with small sections of technical parts. I just can't justify spending the money on the clutch. And from what I hear the 2.0 is not worth the money, every one I've talked to say if your going to go rekluse go for the full 800$ version.  I ride a CRF450R and the bike i tested was an 09 CRF450X it just didn't have the snap to pull the front end up and keep it light through the whoops like my bike does. It really felt like I was riding a snowmobile and not a dirt bike.

Edited by MrDieselTwitch, 02 May 2012 - 05:13 PM.

MrDieselTwitch, on 02 May 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

Wasn't set up right, clutch pack was probably not adjusted and was actually slipping.

The core EXP is the 800.00 dollar model and does not add to stock clutch pull at all. At least for my Beta.
As far as starts go, if your bike has torque on the low side and will rev up properly that added traction from a start will propel you more consistently to give you faster start times. The vids are on their website proving that. I don't care about start times though. Just got it to prevent stalling in the rock cliffs we ride and falling over causing injuries! I use the clutch like normal - advantage is if I'm late w/ a clutch pull I don't stall and fall over!

MrDieselTwitch, on 02 May 2012 - 04:33 PM, said:

LOTS of fail in this post.. and holy crap, can we stay on topic for a change? the guy was asking about STARTS. There are PLENTY of I LOVE AUTO CLUTCH/ I HATE AUTO CLUTCH threads out there, do we really need another?

.. A- a 450x is NOT a 450r. what the heck did you expect?? IT IS TAME for a reason!
   B - while a exp2.0 is not "ideal" it does just fine if you don't abuse it, like riding in 3rd-4th gear ALL the time even in slow stuff. That will kill the clutch. Yes, if you are gonna abuse it, go the CORE way but you can simply UPGRADE from teh 2.0 to the CORE as the 2.0 ring is PART of the core clutch kit. Get it? You can start off with just the exp2.0 for $400 then if you find you NEED the full kit, spend the diff and get the rest. THEY OFFER MONEY BACK TOO. so how can you loose?
   C - your not gonna get used to a rekluse in a 15 minute ride. My first experience a couple years back, i hated it. But now? i wouldn't care to ride trails and single trac without an auto clutch if i had the choice. For the 10th time, there are sections i don't care for it, but overall in a long race/ride im very happy to have it.
   D- clutch pull ?? Holy cow, yea, the springs with the kit are a bit stronger than stock (and you need to use them) but you WON'T USE THE LEVER AS NEAR AS MUCH.. so what is the problem?

A - When I say tame i mean Ive ridden TTR-125s that Pulled harder and Ive ridden plenty of other 450X's and it had no problem popping the front end up.

B - Ive been screwed by "Money backs" before, Not looking for a repeat

C - True, and a very good point - But First impressions are every thing and after 20 years of clutching I've come to enjoying it and not having it would cause me to concentrate more on the clutch and not my riding. I have to deal with not clutching every snowmobile season. I even find my self pulling in the nonexistent clutch leaver on the sleds lol.

D - When I say hard clutch I MEAN ROCK HARD!!! It felt like one of those hand exercise things you use for training for rock climbing, and The black HARD one not the light one!! There are many time I need/want tire spin so Ill pull in the clutch and feather.

auto clutch or not that thing was not right.

I bought the Rekluse for my 12 yo daughter that races it on the ice (and possibly some flattrack).  Her problem was, her small hands had a hard time letting the clutch out smooth with her gloves on (ice racing = COLD and winter gloves), which made for some pretty poor starts.  Also, IF she stalled it in staging the bike, she struggled to start it on the ice (poor footing makes everything harder), so I had to run out and fire it up (only happened once, but it bugged me and her).

So, I thought the rekluse would be perfect.  Those vids on youtube by Rekluse are deciving.......yes they say "more consistant starts", but the times they state are quicker with the rekluse then without (not by much, but the times ARE quicker).

I have installed heavier springs twice (forget the colors, but Im two stages up from stock).  I am 200lbs, and I promise you, I'd start faster without the clutch then with.  BUT, with her 90lbs on it, it may be differnt story.  We are practicing with the clutch this weekend at the track, so I'll know more then.

Thanks for the imput......maybe its time for a pipe and cam.....lol (oh Ron Hamp.......LOL).

Hanna on the 250 this winter......rode well, started poor!

MrDieselTwitch, on 02 May 2012 - 07:01 PM, said:

well the rekluse money back thing is the real deal..
There was something WRONG with that bike you rode, the rock hard clutch was NOT something to do with the rekluse.. im telling you. Have you seen all the threads posted with "MY CLUTCH IS STIFF".. they usually can be traced back to cable issues or some other issue, but im TELLING ya, it aint' an issue the EXP2.0 or CORE will cause, and if you get teh Z-start PRO rekluse, you can operate that thing with your PINKIE finger.

Trying to stay on topic here (starts), but I will say, my clutch pull is as soft and buttery as stock!

cdaniels, on 02 May 2012 - 08:10 PM, said:

agreed. i would have to say something is wrong with the bike Diesel rode.. BOth my crf450's don't feel THAT much harder than stock. I did try to use the stock springs when i first got my exp2.0.. but the bike accelerated like it was held back by a rubber band. Rekluse said "dude, ya gotta use the stiffer springs we send or it WON'T work right", so in they went I pay lots of attention, as you obviously do, to cable routing and such. I also have works connection perch/levers that have ball bearing pivots. VERY nice compared to stock lever/perch, but $160 new.

the rekluse does not take away any snap at all unless there's something wrong with it and it's slipping when it shouldnt be

I have 3 bikes with autoclutches, all 3 different designs, I have the new 800 $ one in my gasgas I like the pro the best but I cant get that one for my gasgas

MrBlahh, on 03 May 2012 - 02:13 AM, said:

with the newer exp2.0 or expCORE it does change the "hit" or snap of how it engages. I have two bikes myself.. riding 20hrs a month. If one of my bikes has the slightest change i feel it being on them 3x a week. Even Rekluse will not dispute the fact that it doesn't "engage" quite as fast.. That is why they make DIFFERENT weight engagement wedges ! The wedges that come stock are a medium engagement wedge. There is a heavier wedge that you can BUY for $90 or so if you want a snappier engagement, harder hit. If you get the expCORE you get the heavier weights (for $800 ya ought to right? LOL )
For woods racing i stuck with the stock/medium ones as i feel it gives me a little more control, with less chance of whiskey throttle late in a race or if i get on some wet roots or other stuff i wasnt' expecting.

Edited by MELK-MAN, 03 May 2012 - 06:28 AM.

Yep, would agree with that too.  No Core here, but I briefly ran a Z-start Rekluse.  It is on the shelf right now, but when it was on the bike, CRF450, yes indeed it helped on mx starts.  Simply at the minor expense of replacing plates ~25% more often (with Tusk plates at that), and using ATF, I could launch hard in 3rd off the line by merely yanking open the throttle, no finesse whatsoever.  If starts were my only criteria for running one, it would be a no-brainer.

MELK-MAN, on 03 May 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

I think we are talking about 2 different things, above engagement rpm there is no change in "hit" or throttle response

below clutch engagement rpm obviously it's slipping that' swhat it's supposed to do, but that's only at very low rpm

I was not talking about how smooth or hard the autoclutch engages,  I assumed he was not either

Edited by MrBlahh, 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM.

TXKAWBOY,

So maybe my CRF250 needs some motor work to give it more grunt?

MrBlahh, on 03 May 2012 - 01:38 PM, said:

no, we are not talking about 2 different things..   there are 3 color springs that change the rpm engagement.. red/blue/gold.
YOU obviously don't know there are different WEIGHT WEDGES that can be changed to alter the actual RATE of engagment, not the rpm that it begins to "drag". The springs are for idle only. THe "soft" wedges are lighter in weight than the "medium" weights that come in the EXP ring, or the 3rd option is a heavy weight wedge. The weights SPIN OUT faster the heavier they are.. heavier weight, faster engagement and "hit" as the clutch engages..

Edited by MELK-MAN, 03 May 2012 - 02:43 PM.

I thought I was clear, I must not have been clear enough,  I'm not nor was I ever talking about below full engagement rpm

cdaniels,
I am the wrong guy to ask about hopping up 250f's; I think that they are already on a short lifespan stock, given from what I have seen so far...if it was me, re an auot or not, I would merely observe how many local pro's/sponsored fast guys are running auto's on their 250f's at the tracks you ride at...they can run one for free, so DO they?  For MY locales, the auto was FUN, but NOT the fastest way, for me personally.  Now if they ever come out with something that prevents me from having to SHIFT, then I am on it!  LoL  That is the part I hate; you cannot slip the clutch on a 4T w/o smoking something, so now I need a CV tranny!  Or win the lotto and get/build a CRF/CR500 hybrid...sigh.  A 300cc 2T is c l o s e, but no closer than a 450F, for me, and just not worth the premix mess, etc...