Thanks Phantom, this build is lowest budget possible. I would kill to build a whole new head with Eddie, but the funds for this project are thinning.

I just bought all my gaskets, but wasn't able to find guide seals only could find parts numbers for the complete guide.

Anyone have any experience buying just a pair of guide seals?

Edit: I'm an idiot. 09289-05011 is the part i was after. I was looking at the cylinder head microfiche and didn't look up in the cam/valve fiche. Noob mistake haha but luckily i found an oem set of 4 for $12 shipped!

Edited by steezin_and_wheezin, 23 April 2012 - 09:41 AM.

What did your mechanic friend surmise might have been the cause of the damage?  I am thinking from the pictures a loss of oil to the top end, or just running low on oil.  The most important thing is that the bottom end is good, and that no contaminants are left anywhere in the motor before you start it up for the fisrt time.  Everythime I have ever had big problems with a motor it was the bottom end so everything had to come apart anyways so I knew that there was no debris left in the motor.  You might want to ask your friend or maybe someone else can chime in on this how to make sure no debris is left anywhere.  My thought would be to fill the bike up with a cheap oil after assembly and drain it out.

I'd suggest a high-detergent oil, like Shell Rotella T.  It's inexpensive and will have a rinse effect on the components.  If you are planning on leaving the oil in for a while, don't use Rotella necessarily (opinions vary radically) only if you run for a few miles and then drain immediately.  Everybody has their favorite oil, but that is a good "use for ten miles and drain to try and get contaminants out" oil.

Didn't even ask him.. I figure low/old oil.

As for oil, I had figured the cheap quick change after a couple miles speal.

When I drained the what left of the oil from the engine, frame, and filter- it was dark/old oil, but there was 0 debris. Caught all three in different containers and inspected it thoroughly. I'm fairly certain that there is no other debris in there.

I will check into Rotella for a flush oil, preciate it!

Seals/gaskets should be in next week. I'll pick up some fluid and hopefully have this thing back together in a few weeks.

Cylinder's done, just dropped off the guide seals last thursday. Should have all the parts back in ~week. Then final inspection and rebuild

I knew it seemed I had seen your username before. Thanks for the headlight got it all polished up, just need to put it on rather than ride.
Did you order a new right side seal/gasket? I never thought of it and had to play the waiting game again before I could finished her up.
Hope it goes well.

Glad ya got the light mang!

Nah i didn't get the right side gasket.. Since there was zero debris in the oil, I didn't plan on removing the side covers. Is there something that I've missed and that should get some attention?

I did the primary drivegear nut loctite fix while I had it all apart, also changed the cam chain. Didn't know how far you had taken it apart.

Sounds good. I was planning on pulling both covers to inspect and loctite everything, but after finding no debris in oil I decided to keep the covers on for now.

Got all the parts back, my friend dropped them off at the house this morning. From a couple quick photos everything looks AWESOME. Definitely going to have to get him a little more extra than he asked for!

I'll get some good photos on lunch. The short- cylinder's spotless, head's together, valves look great, and i'm ready to rebuild!

Finally got some more time to put her together. Still waiting on my shim kit to get in so I can clean my clearances up. Went ahead and cleaned/prepped all the mating surfaces. Installed; rings, cylinder, front chain guide, and head. When I went to drop the cams in there was too much tension on the cam chain to fit both in. My ACCT is removed, but I still couldn't seem to find enough slack to get both cams in.

I think my problem is my chain guide(exhaust/front of engine one) isn't properly seated. When i would install the exhaust cam first there was no clearance between the chain guide->chain->exhaust cam sprocket. Zero clearance meaning I actually had to pressure the guide back to get the cam to seat. I don't think this is correct? I would like to note, I haven't torqued the jug and head down. Could this be causing my the lack of slack in chain?

I'll be researching more until I can find time on a clear day to dig in again. Rain was starting to move it, the moped project's taken over my shop, and the gs500 project has taken over my shed. So I had to put the cover over her.

Anyone have any suggestions? I'll get some photos tonight if it'll help

Make sure the cam chain isn't wadded up around the primary drive gear

Chain guide could be out of place but you can't really see it from the top.  Remove the primary cover for visual access.  Properly installed the chain does ride against the guide, but you do not have to force anything. Sounds like something is wrong.

Yes, the lack of torque on the head bolts can make a difference. I assume you are doing a trial assembly as the cams have to be out to torque the head.

10-4 preciate it guys.

Yes, this was just a trial fit, to be sure i didn't have any glaring problems. With a quick search i didn't find much info on chain guides(other than kids trying to shove them down the cylinder head) so I decided a test fit of everything would ease my worried mind.

I didn't have to put a lot of force on the guide to get the ex cam seated, but it seemed like more pressure than i would like to see.

I was installing all this solo, might get a friend to help hold the head/cylinder while I inspect the chain/guides this next time.

More updates will come as I get more free time. Shims will be here this week hopefully that will spur me on a bit more.

Erm, just looking at your pics of the piston, and if you notice there appears to be a ring on the crown in the area of where the plug would be. I believe I've heard Eddie refer to this as the 'ring of death' as it can sometimes indicate that the conrod bearing is bad. Just a heads up.

Probably not in your case as you say you have a mechanic friend who's building it who i am sure has most likely check the rod for play. Just thought i would mention it though as i see no-one else has.

Hopefully this is not the case but if it is i'm sure you would rather find out now that 200 miles down the line when a bad rod bearing destroys all of your new parts.

Good luck and keep up the good work.

Many thanks dr-zed! Hadn't stumbled onto the "Ring of Death" situation, and actually my friend isn't building her as much as just doing the tasks that are too big for my skills and tollbox. He's only had the vavle head and cylinder in(flex honing and fixing bad valve). I've been the main wrencher, and will be attempting to finish that way.

Looking back over my photos i didn't take a good shot of the entire piston head. Just from messing with it this weekend i don't remember the head having drastic signs of the ring of death. Though I wasn't familiar with it so I may have easily overlooked it.

I was worried about any kind of moisture, and was lucky the rain didn't hit us last night. On lunch I went ahead and rolled her past the moped in the shop and into the laundry room to wait for more attention. I will pull the head off and get a good look and photo of the piston head tonight.

No problem. Hopefully it's not what it looks like but an optical illusion of some sort? But do be very thorough when checking the rod for play. Any movement upwards and downwards on the rod is  bad. There should be no play at all.

I've always found that when your checking a rod for play it is very useful to get a second opinion as well as your own. Being that it is your bike it's too easy to feel something and brush it off thinking your doing it wrong because you don't want there to be play. An unbiased opinion (especially someone who is a mechanic by trade...) can be very handy indeed.

Hope it all works out for you, you seem to want to do it right and have been so far. From my experience it's not worth overlooking even the slightest thing.

Looks like a half ring on the intake side?



I rechecked rod play, same as last time. Zero vertical movement, but slight side shift. Had my roommate take a look this time and he said the same, couldn't feel any vertical shift.

There anything on the stock head that could clue me into the lack of carbon on the intake side?

Got my shims in as well.. Goingto read up more on the half ring of death before buttoning her up now

I don't know what you are talking about as far as "RING OF DEATH".  What that piston shows is there was a lot of oil in the combustion chamber.  Either rings or guides were bad in that motor.  You have taken care of that with rebuild, right?.  The circle in the center of the piston is a casting mark.

Good to know on the rings/guides and casting mark in center. New rings are on and the head has been replaced. Should be good on that front. When i was taking the head off today i noticed the chain was off track on the rear guide. It was actually resting on the side of the guide, so I think that is another culprit in the tight chain

From what i read the Ring of Death is when the con rod bearing goes bad and allows the piston to contact/get too close to the head and causes a ring looking shape photo from another thread

So ring of death is the piston bouncing off the head, yes that would be bad. That would be contact around the perimeter of the piston and would also show on the head.  The referenced picture is a burn pattern not ring of death.