An ohh duhh moment worth discussing

14 replies to this topic
  • tye1138

Posted 20 January 2012 - 07:11 PM

#1


Do you ever re-think routines that you do during your motocross riding? Like, I always lubricate my chain, check tension, check sprockets and get my air pressures set the night before I ride. I also religiously fill my tank up to the top before every ride because why not?

Well, I'll tell you why not! :bonk:

So I've been struggling, really badly struggling. Few months ago I almost gave up riding I was so frustrated. Life was treating me badly, had no money to ride, no medical insurance either. When your on such a negative tone, its hard to think positive and really try to get better. When I got back on the bike again in November, I was blaming the bike for everything that was wrong because honestly, just a few short months earlier, I had ridden a lot better. My friends were over 10 seconds a lap quicker then I was, which in the past was never the case, so something was wrong. Yes they probably got better, but I should have as well.

My new years resolution this year was to figure out what was wrong no matter what and fix it.

The first thing I did was get a base-line. I rode a few weeks, got back up to speed and then set some base laps. I got a laptime number and started writing detailed logs. When reading the log's, I noticed most of my complaints were related to understeer, the front always wanted to wash out on me, the rear always wanted to slide out on me. Knowing my suspension is in tip-top shape, I started by putting on some new rubber. I changed brands so that would help get rid of the stigmatism associated with the Bridgestones. I went with Pirelli MX32's, which are a medium/soft compound. Nice tall knobs and a very linear feel to them. My first day on those tires, I dropped 4 seconds in my laptime. I felt substantially more comfortable/confident in the front end and of corse the rear, but I was still 6 seconds off the pace.

Still frustrated, I just pushed harder and harder, but that just led to more mistakes being made and slower laptimes, I still wasn't falling into the groove. Then, as if destiny set in, all of a sudden the bike became easier to ride. I mean literally, few sessions earlier it was hard, then it was easy all of a sudden. I didn't know what to make of it, it caught me off guard entirely and all of a sudden I was clearly turning way quicker laptimes without using the quickest line on the track! As the day went on, I got quicker and quicker until I thought to myself, holy $^!% I haven't put gas in the bike all day!

I pulled off the track, took my helmet off and nearly cried!!! All this time, I had been filling up the bike every session. Full tank putting weight on the front end, an extra 15lb or so. I had been doing this religiously since I first started riding because as a true beginner, it was nice to have the extra weight over the front end. But now that I know how to put my balls in the tank, I didn't need that extra weight anymore, it was simply bulk. With the lighter tank, the bike was much easier to ride, everything from the understeer problem to rut management was pretty much all remedied.

Of course, I figured this out at the end of the day, I was tired, put in a few more laps and went home. But holy $^!% what a discovery, I am flabbergasted it was that simple and I honestly can't wait until next thursday. I'm gonna start using those quicker inside lines more, now that the understeer issue is gone and see if I can drop even more time. Still got 3 seconds to kill... but by looking at the video's and analyzing, its clear those 3 seconds are clearly lost from simple line choice and NOT clearing the biggest jump on the track (because it was messed up that day).

Here is my latest episode of MX The Beginning where I go over the new Pirelli's and discuss some of the speed increase.



Thanks for reading, enjoy!

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  • Die_trying

Posted 21 January 2012 - 10:29 AM

#2

my 450 never handled as good as it did right before it ran out of gas, it was noticeably better. Did you run the same time all year or the same tire brand/model? I need to make a trip out to milestone when i can walk again.

  • mikerides33

Posted 21 January 2012 - 11:05 AM

#3

Tye. Great post! I had the same exact findings. I went through a huge "riding depression" this year. Got the new 350 and thought it was my year to shine. Struggled just like you. At the end of the season switched to Pirell MT32s and BANG. Man these tires are so much more confidence inspiring. Next up is the Phase 4 kit I just got back. This spring should be fun.

Bottom line: A fresh set of MT 32s was a game changer for me....especialy the front!

  • Mr. Neutron

Posted 21 January 2012 - 04:45 PM

#4

Neat Post, Tye!!! :bonk:

BTW, that was a VERY GOOD, very well made & edited video, also!!! Double Props to ya for that! :lol: :smirk:

Hmmm, I wonder if those Pirelli tires would work well in a lot of mud? I've considered going to an Exorcist to get my YZ to turn for me..... :lol: :lol:

From as early as the 70s, I've always been taught to use only as much gas as you need to get you through a moto. I think that's one of the "basics" kinda deals, and I'm bettin' you, and most folks here, knew that already. That has come back to bite me in the butt a couple times during practices (had to push the bike back to the truck a few times.... :lol: ), but so far (knock on wood), I've always had a few drops sloshin' around after a moto.....

Jimmie

  • mxkid12

Posted 21 January 2012 - 05:04 PM

#5

 tye1138, on 20 January 2012 - 07:11 PM, said:

Do you ever re-think routines that you do during your motocross riding? Like, I always lubricate my chain, check tension, check sprockets and get my air pressures set the night before I ride. I also religiously fill my tank up to the top before every ride because why not?

Well, I'll tell you why not! :bonk:

So I've been struggling, really badly struggling. Few months ago I almost gave up riding I was so frustrated. Life was treating me badly, had no money to ride, no medical insurance either. When your on such a negative tone, its hard to think positive and really try to get better. When I got back on the bike again in November, I was blaming the bike for everything that was wrong because honestly, just a few short months earlier, I had ridden a lot better. My friends were over 10 seconds a lap quicker then I was, which in the past was never the case, so something was wrong. Yes they probably got better, but I should have as well.

My new years resolution this year was to figure out what was wrong no matter what and fix it.

The first thing I did was get a base-line. I rode a few weeks, got back up to speed and then set some base laps. I got a laptime number and started writing detailed logs. When reading the log's, I noticed most of my complaints were related to understeer, the front always wanted to wash out on me, the rear always wanted to slide out on me. Knowing my suspension is in tip-top shape, I started by putting on some new rubber. I changed brands so that would help get rid of the stigmatism associated with the Bridgestones. I went with Pirelli MX32's, which are a medium/soft compound. Nice tall knobs and a very linear feel to them. My first day on those tires, I dropped 4 seconds in my laptime. I felt substantially more comfortable/confident in the front end and of corse the rear, but I was still 6 seconds off the pace.

Still frustrated, I just pushed harder and harder, but that just led to more mistakes being made and slower laptimes, I still wasn't falling into the groove. Then, as if destiny set in, all of a sudden the bike became easier to ride. I mean literally, few sessions earlier it was hard, then it was easy all of a sudden. I didn't know what to make of it, it caught me off guard entirely and all of a sudden I was clearly turning way quicker laptimes without using the quickest line on the track! As the day went on, I got quicker and quicker until I thought to myself, holy $^!% I haven't put gas in the bike all day!

I pulled off the track, took my helmet off and nearly cried!!! All this time, I had been filling up the bike every session. Full tank putting weight on the front end, an extra 15lb or so. I had been doing this religiously since I first started riding because as a true beginner, it was nice to have the extra weight over the front end. But now that I know how to put my balls in the tank, I didn't need that extra weight anymore, it was simply bulk. With the lighter tank, the bike was much easier to ride, everything from the understeer problem to rut management was pretty much all remedied.

Of course, I figured this out at the end of the day, I was tired, put in a few more laps and went home. But holy $^!% what a discovery, I am flabbergasted it was that simple and I honestly can't wait until next thursday. I'm gonna start using those quicker inside lines more, now that the understeer issue is gone and see if I can drop even more time. Still got 3 seconds to kill... but by looking at the video's and analyzing, its clear those 3 seconds are clearly lost from simple line choice and NOT clearing the biggest jump on the track (because it was messed up that day).

Here is my latest episode of MX The Beginning where I go over the new Pirelli's and discuss some of the speed increase.



Thanks for reading, enjoy!
Are you sure you aren't advertising for Pirelli!? haha I am running the Bridgestone tires so this has made me question them. I really enjoyed the topic and the video and I am glad you didn't give up.

  • tye1138

Posted 21 January 2012 - 08:03 PM

#6

 Die_trying, on 21 January 2012 - 10:29 AM, said:

Did you run the same time all year or the same tire brand/model?

I started 2011 with a set of Bridgestone 203/204 and then moved to the 403/404. Then back again to the 203/204 towards the end of the season. I would have done another set, had I ridden in September and October.

 Mr. Neutron, on 21 January 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

BTW, that was a VERY GOOD, very well made & edited video, also!!! Double Props to ya for that!

Thanks, its my business to make videos, so I better be good at it! LOL :bonk:

 Mr. Neutron, on 21 January 2012 - 04:45 PM, said:

I've always been taught to use only as much gas as you need to get you through a moto.

Yep, I whole-heartedly agree. When I was roadracing, I would literally pour just enough for an 8 lap race. But per my original posting, I was running a full tank because as a beginner, wasn't weighting the front enough. But I never changed my routine when I figured out how to ride, so its been hindering me for all this time, even though I clearly know its not a smart idea! It was literally a brain-fart related to "routine" instead of thinking about WHY I do a certain routine before doing it. Oh well!

 mxkid12, on 21 January 2012 - 05:04 PM, said:

Are you sure you aren't advertising for Pirelli!? haha I am running the Bridgestone tires so this has made me question them. I really enjoyed the topic and the video and I am glad you didn't give up.

Yea, the Bridgestones have been good to me for sure. But I never really liked how they steered. It was like they messed up the profile on the tire somehow and it always drove me crazy. Plus, the way they wear totally sucks, the knobs will look good, no worn edges and no degrading in the knob height, yet the tire stops working! I mean literally, the thing will have no grip. I spent sometime talking with some professional tuners about tires and they explained to me the difference in the carcass between the Bridgestone/Dunlop and Pirelli and why the Dunlop's are so good. I have already tried the MX51 and didn't like the front at all, so I decided to take the leap and grab the Pirelli's, which are "supposedly" the best tire on the market. Why they are the best relates to how Pirelli does their R&D, which in Europe is on the track. The same tires Pirelli run in the World Motocross Championship, are the same tires that are available to the public here in the states, unlike Dunlop.

Never give up, never surrender! :lol:

  • mikerides33

Posted 22 January 2012 - 09:33 AM

#7

Honestly the Pirellis were a revelation to me. I used to sware by the Dunlop 756 and went to the MX51 after that went away. I felt like I couldn't ride with the 51. seriously. On to Bridgestones and decent but no big deal. The Pirellis are amazing in front. Its weird.

  • Mr. Neutron

Posted 22 January 2012 - 04:32 PM

#8

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Fellas,[/size][/font]

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Are the Pirelli tires you're speaking of called the Scorpion MX Mid Soft 32s?? :bonk:[/size][/font]

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Pirelli's tire names/nomendclature is sorta confusing to me. In the past I've used their MT-16 knobby & MT-43 trials tire for off road stuff, and they've worked really well. I can't figure out if they even make the MT-16s any more.....[/size][/font]

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Jimmie[/size][/font]

  • tye1138

Posted 22 January 2012 - 08:22 PM

#9

 Mr. Neutron, on 22 January 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Are the Pirelli tires you're speaking of called the Scorpion MX Mid Soft 32s?? :bonk:[/size][/font]

Yep, the 32's. :lol:

  • Mr. Neutron

Posted 23 January 2012 - 09:06 AM

#10

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Thanks, Sir!!! :bonk: [/size][/font]

[font=comic sans ms, cursive][size=5]Jimmie[/size][/font]

  • silentZ

Posted 23 January 2012 - 11:30 AM

#11

AH Comic Sans! Made popular by Dan Gilbert, owner of the Cleveland Cavaliers! That was really interesting about the fuel thing. I always notice that I ride better with an emptier tank.

  • mikerides33

Posted 24 January 2012 - 06:17 AM

#12

Man I always fill my tank to the top. I feel dumb!! Does it really make a big difference. I guess as the tank gets lighter I get more tired and don't realize it. I am going to start putting in only what I need! Be fun to test this at he beginning of the day.

  • tye1138

Posted 24 January 2012 - 08:50 AM

#13

 mikerides33, on 24 January 2012 - 06:17 AM, said:

Man I always fill my tank to the top. I feel dumb!! Does it really make a big difference.

On a 197lb bike with a 150lb rider, yea its a huge difference. On a 240lb bike with a 220lb rider, eh... maybe not so much? Sadly thats something I can't test... LOL :bonk:

  • vlad7890

Posted 24 January 2012 - 03:46 PM

#14

On a related note which is equally obvious once it happens: don't go overboard with the "less fuel is better" philosophy. If you run out of gas on the last lap over a big jump it's gonna hurt. Leave yourself some extra fuel - you might get the lap count wrong or use more than you thought you needed.

  • tye1138

Posted 25 January 2012 - 01:08 AM

#15

 vlad7890, on 24 January 2012 - 03:46 PM, said:

On a related note which is equally obvious once it happens: don't go overboard with the "less fuel is better" philosophy. If you run out of gas on the last lap over a big jump it's gonna hurt. Leave yourself some extra fuel - you might get the lap count wrong or use more than you thought you needed.

Fo-Sho, 2 strokes arn't as prone to that issue as 4 strokes, but yes you've gotta be a master at fuel management. Luckily, I'm pretty good at it having done it before in roadracing, its old hat for me. :lol:

Thanks for the reminder though! :bonk:



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