08 WR450 Eating Batteries


29 replies to this topic
  • ACM

Posted July 03, 2011 - 06:45 AM

#21

So,
1st: Thanks for all your replies! It's really really helpful. :thumbsup:

2nd: I came back from my travels with a new Yuassa battery, new OEM stator and a new OEM reg/rec. Charged battery fully until it gave green light on optimate4 charger.

Fitted battery, regulator and stator.

Results:

Ignition on: 12.5v
During start: 10.8v
Started, revving way above idle: 12.4

On reg/rec connector: red 12.4, white 14.9, yellow 10.4
This is with brand new stator and brand new reg / rec.
Resistance between battery negative terminal and black connector to reg/rec reads 0.9 ohm (touching multi-meter probes together also reads 0.9 ohm)

So, doesn't appear to have been either reg/rec or stator?... very odd.
It's also really hard to start and runs awful...

Any ideas what could be wrong, and give these symptoms???


Thanks!
Al

  • pembell

Posted July 03, 2011 - 07:14 AM

#22

So,
1st: Thanks for all your replies! It's really really helpful. :thumbsup:

2nd: I came back from my travels with a new Yuassa battery, new OEM stator and a new OEM reg/rec. Charged battery fully until it gave green light on optimate4 charger.

Fitted battery, regulator and stator.

Results:

Ignition on: 12.5v
During start: 10.8v
Started, revving way above idle: 12.4

On reg/rec connector: red 12.4, white 14.9, yellow 10.4
This is with brand new stator and brand new reg / rec.
Resistance between battery negative terminal and black connector to reg/rec reads 0.9 ohm (touching multi-meter probes together also reads 0.9 ohm)

So, doesn't appear to have been either reg/rec or stator?... very odd.
It's also really hard to start and runs awful...

Any ideas what could be wrong, and give these symptoms???


Thanks!
Al



It's got to be rider error.....:ride:

Welcome back! When we going out?!?

  • ACM

Posted July 06, 2011 - 08:47 AM

#23

Hi guys,
Load of ramble below, but for the busy reader I'll jump straight to the questions:
1) What's the correct 'no load' (i.e. disconnected) voltages for the rectified DC (red wire), and the lighting coil (yellow stator wire).
2) Is 2A DC current out of reg/rect reasonable (with recently charged battery but just used to start a rough starting bike)?
3) If the ignition system AC looks within spec is the bike expected to run rough just because DC side is out of spec? (Or is it more likely to be coincidence and unconnected to the electric problems on the DC side?)..


Background:

*) I get 10.4 volts AC on the yellow wire out of the reg/rect. Workshop manual says I should get 12.5-13.5 volts AC.
*) I get 12.4 volts DC on the red wire out of the reg/rect. Workshop manual says I should get 14.0-15.0 volts DC. I suspect the 12.4 is being maintained by the battery rather than the reg/rect.
*) Bike clearly sick, hard to start, runs rough...
*) I've already replace both the reg/rect and stator as stated in workshop manual, so now trying other stuff.



What I've done is:
1) Swapped the yellow and white wires on the reg/ rect. When swapped the white reads 10.4 and yellow about 14. As such can probably rule out fault with AC regulator?

2) Unplugged red wire from reg/rect, and measured the no load output. This reads below 10volts DC.

3) Unplugged yellow stator wire from the gray stator connector, and measured the no load stator output, this read 38 volts AC.

4) Measured current draw between reg/rect DC output (red wire) and positive connector into battery (actually red wire on 4 way plug that slots into top of starter relay, but effectively it's the battery terminal (I think!)). Reads about 2 amps with bike running.


If the 38 volts is correct, my first guess would be some kind of short in the lighting circuit consuming all the power, so reg/rect and stator doing their best but unable to provide sufficient to keep the DC or lighting AC in spec....? Seem sensible??

I'll keep posting as I find out more...

Cheers!
Al

  • pembell

Posted July 13, 2011 - 12:33 PM

#24

Any help appreciated at this stage....it's really stinting our riding time....:smirk:

  • jonooffler

Posted July 13, 2011 - 10:07 PM

#25

My battery on my WR450 failed after only 3 months I bought it off ebay as a Lucus battery ( a good make in the UK ) .As it only cost £19.00 I should have have been looking for a fail before too long. My last bike a KTM had a better battery but that failed after around 4 months .I think that they all have build issues at the moment.

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  • ACM

Posted July 14, 2011 - 03:02 AM

#26

Hi Guys
Still progressing with this, but no joy so far.
It would sure be swell if anyone can answer below from theory or practice...

*) If I unplug the red wire from the reg/rect connector (two AC wires remain connected) what voltage should I read at the reg/rect output?

*) Setup as above (i.e. reg/rect DC disconnected, AC remains connected, bike running above idle) what current draw should I read from the battery (I get 0.7A, seems quite high given it's not doing much...).

Many many thanks for any info you can give... Once I get the bike working I'm going to measure everything and write it all down!... :smirk:
- In fact does Yamaha list the specifications anywhere (beyond the tests in the workshop manual)? Maybe it would be a useful thread for reference, let me know if anyone else is interested...

Thanks!
Al

  • redhurricane

Posted July 16, 2011 - 08:19 AM

#27

I keep seeing measured voltage in your issue lower than it should be at the battery-

I have an 06, not sure on configuration on the 08 but have you tested (TESTED, not looked at) the fuses next to the battery/starter relay? I had a partially blown fuse that passed visual inspection but had significant resistance that was causing low charging voltage at the battery. I too was losing batteries and after testing stator/rectifier could not isolate the issue until I checked the fuse. Stator and rectifier tested good, 14v at high rpm.

as of recently, I replaced stator/rectifier/pick up coil with a high output unit from Ricky Stator, and converted the stock H4 bulb to a HID unit also supplied by ricky stator. LOVE the amount of light, all for about $210.

  • William1

Posted July 16, 2011 - 08:38 AM

#28

Hi Guys
Still progressing with this, but no joy so far.
It would sure be swell if anyone can answer below from theory or practice...

*) If I unplug the red wire from the reg/rect connector (two AC wires remain connected) what voltage should I read at the reg/rect output?

Can't test it like this. The RR needs a battery on it to provide load.


*) Setup as above (i.e. reg/rect DC disconnected, AC remains connected, bike running above idle) what current draw should I read from the battery (I get 0.7A, seems quite high given it's not doing much...).

No, that is about right. CDI draws a fair amount.

Many many thanks for any info you can give... Once I get the bike working I'm going to measure everything and write it all down!... :smirk:
- In fact does Yamaha list the specifications anywhere (beyond the tests in the workshop manual)? Maybe it would be a useful thread for reference, let me know if anyone else is interested...

Thanks!
Al

No, the manual is pretty much it. Best method is to follow the steps in the book, culminating in various battery voltage tests. Before these tests can be done, the battery must be fully charged, should a voltage of 12.8 volts after being off the charger for a miniimum for 1/2 hour. Key on, engine off, lights off, voltage should still be at 12.8 volts. At idle, 13.5 then at part throttle, 14.5.
If you went through the manual and everything checks out, it is probably a bad connection or bad wire. You can run connections directly from the RR with new wire to the battery. Many guys do this anyways and use a heavier gage wire (12~14 Ga) to ensure getting all the juice.

  • ACM

Posted September 09, 2011 - 02:44 AM

#29

1st thanks for all the replies.. Touch wood, now seems to be fixed!
I'll note down what seemed to work, in case anyone else has similar symptoms...

Having done everything by the book, inlcluding inserting and removing each connector 3 times, I took william1's post to heart. Inserting and removing every connector 10 times and using a sharp flat screw-driver to deburnish and tighten every possible spade connector.

This fixed the charging problem!
So lesson 1 for me, especially if on a budget, do the free things first!

However what was left, possibly masked by the general poor running before due to a bad connector, was a sudden random cut out when hot (about every 5-10 minutes, seemed to be especially under load).
Cleaned carb (removed an alarming amount of sand!), but it made no difference.

Changed coil, and its now done 50k in the desert without a hicup...

So thanks again for all your advice... only downside is whilst my bike was out of action I rode my wife's, and chewed a valve!... In the dog house now, but that's for another thread...

Cheers guys

Al

  • toscaredtofly

Posted October 27, 2011 - 07:35 PM

#30

check for a pinched wire in the harness it may be grounding out




 
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