K&N or NOT on 2010 450


21 replies to this topic
  • williec

Posted May 18, 2011 - 10:21 AM

#1

i am in the market for the best products. is the K&N benificial for the 10 yz450, or are the foam filters good. and if i get one will i have to tune? what will the new filter increase

  • grayracer513

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:02 AM

#2

I never recommend K&N air filters. They work well enough when they are correctly cleaned and oiled, which happens to be true of foam as well, but because that's much more difficult to accomplish than with a foam element, they tend to fail to filter fine dirt under "real world" conditions.

They also have to be cleaned more often than foam because media is so much thinner than foam and has less capacity to hold dirt while allowing air through.

  • yz450fcranker

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:08 AM

#3

well a k&N filter lasts 50k miles on road before the first clean which should be a good sign and K&N filters increase airflow a little so little you dont need to tune

Edited by yz450fcranker, May 18, 2011 - 11:14 AM.
airflow


  • grayracer513

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:13 AM

#4

"The road" and off road racing are such entirely different conditions that it's ludicrous even to mention them together. Furthermore, I would bet you don't have any actual data to support the idea that the filter was not passing fine dust at 40K miles as it was.

K&N's big advantage is that they breath well. They don't filter well over the long haul unless they are cleaned and re-oiled often and well.

  • usp4u

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:14 AM

#5

well a k&N filter lasts 50k miles on road before the first clean which should be a good sign and K&N filters increase airflow a little so little you dont need to tune


Don't believe the hype.

  • yz450fcranker

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:24 AM

#6

I know new filters are GOOD make sure they are and they will be K&N outlasts foam anyday before it lets any dirt pass if it does then you get a new one maybe 2 years later

  • NSF3537

Posted May 18, 2011 - 11:27 AM

#7

Twin Air or No-Toil. Stay away from K&N.

  • Davey762

Posted May 18, 2011 - 12:17 PM

#8

Don't run it...there is an increase in performance but you can suck sand through much easier and your engine/valves will not like that. Could work if you were riding supercross though, but I'd never use one outdoors again.

BTW, I have not ran one on my 2010 yz, but used one on my previous 07 honda crf450 and like I said... a little performance increase, but I had to change my intake valves when sand got through the filter and it was oiled correctly.

  • Yamaryder29

Posted May 18, 2011 - 01:25 PM

#9

Stay away, theres's a reason it has more airflow, it's called the larger holes, which will alloiw more dirt to pass

  • RiverReaper

Posted May 18, 2011 - 07:58 PM

#10

I've ran K&N for years in lots of applications and never had an issue with them if they are maintained, and I ride the dunes 99% or the time. Yes they're more maintenance but any edge over my buddies is worth it, even a small one.

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  • brentn

Posted May 18, 2011 - 08:09 PM

#11

Ron hamp said that the K&N produced the most power out of the other leading foam filters he tried, not to sure which ones he compared it against... This was for the 2010.

Grey said it best though... I'll use them in my trucks.. not to sure about using it on my bike though.

  • grayracer513

Posted May 19, 2011 - 06:59 AM

#12

No argument there. It's not questionable that the K&N breathes the best. That's a simple fact. Another fact is that for a period of time right after they are thoroughly cleaned AND thoroughly oiled, they actually filter a little better. But that doesn't last in either case. It's simply a matter of the total surface area available.

Both foam and gauze (K&N type) elements depend on there being a coat of sticky oil on every exposed part of the media that air flows past. Without the oil, they are little more than not so fine screens to keep big rocks and large spiders out. If you look at how thick the media in both types are, and you understand that the foam can and will trap and hold a much larger volume of dirt than the gauze can without clogging. Air flows into the filter, encounters a strand of foam, and has to turn around it to get by. The dirt it carried was too heavy to make the corner, hit the oil and got stuck. The very fine stuff can make the first few turns without touching the oil, but after a while, it too runs into something and gets trapped. Some of it does get through, no matter what.

The oil has its limit as to how much dirt it can hold onto, and after the oil near the outside gets totally covered over, the next particles to come by bounce off and go deeper into the element. Unfortunately, with the gauze type, there is very soon no longer any deeper part of the element, and dirt flows through unmolested. Also, as dirt piles up in the airways of the element, it begins to choke off the air, which obviously impacts performance, but it also increases the vacuum across the filter and starts pulling out some of the trapped dirt. Guess where that goes. The small size of the 2010+ filter makes this happen sooner than most, too.

If you are in a low dust environment, like a track that is loamy and well watered, and/or you run fairly short races and can put a fresh element in the bike between each one, K&N's are fine, and may be the best choice. But most of us don't, and you need to be aware of their limitations.

  • EARL1995HONDA

Posted May 19, 2011 - 08:50 AM

#13

do people no realize it breaths better for a reason, bigger holes=more dirt

  • grayracer513

Posted May 19, 2011 - 10:19 AM

#14

do people no realize it breaths better for a reason, bigger holes=more dirt

Did you realize that I pointed out that they filter better (briefly), too?

They're a great idea where they are practical. They just aren't practical for most MX or off-road applications, IMO.

  • RiderX

Posted May 19, 2011 - 11:01 AM

#15

Why even risk it? You're not going to get any sizable performance gain from any air filter over another so you might as well opt for the one you know will protect your engine. Oiled foam filters offer proven protection.

  • motoxpsych

Posted May 19, 2011 - 05:28 PM

#16

As many of my fellow riders and racers have already commented, K& N doesnt seem to be the best way to go (at least for dirt bike conditions- duh!). You might want to check out Motocross Action's review of the DT-1 filter system ($110) and their stand alone air filter (about 32 bucks). I ordered two from DT-1 and they sent me a free third filter. MXA says that the stand alone filter has 80% more surface area (BUT it might be touching the airfilter plastic lid that would reduce some of that efficiency airflow wise). I installed it (you have to clip the 4 plastic 1/4 inch plastic tabs off of the stock cage-- the cage is still usable with the stock filter even after the tabs are cut) and it felt like the bike was slightly stronger. I know, seat of the pants and placebo effects, but at least it didn't feel worse and I personally like to have 2 or 3 filters in a cleaning rotation. Also, DT-1 gave me an additional filter and that is a real plus to me.

  • Polar_Bus

Posted May 20, 2011 - 02:02 AM

#17

well a k&N filter lasts 50k miles on road before the first clean which should be a good sign and K&N filters increase airflow a little so little you dont need to tune


Do not use K&N's in off road applications ! The main reason is water ingestion. Yes K&N's flow excellent, until they are exposed to water. Water clings to the outside of the filter surface and literally chokes off all airflow. I experienced this first hand with my buddies Banshee quad. Brand new K&N, the quad ran perfect until he would go through a large puddle, then the engine would not even rev. We had to remove the filter to get the engine to run clean. You could see all the water ingested into the filter surface.

  • mikewrf18

Posted May 20, 2011 - 02:30 AM

#18

I agree with the majority, K and N's are great for street applications but not so well for really dusty, muddy, or sandy conditions.

  • mikewrf18

Posted May 20, 2011 - 02:32 AM

#19

I've ran K&N for years in lots of applications and never had an issue with them if they are maintained, and I ride the dunes 99% or the time. Yes they're more maintenance but any edge over my buddies is worth it, even a small one.

I hope you are running a filter skin with that or you are asking for a disaster at some point. I did run a K and N when I first started riding on my 250F. I ran an outerwears reusable filter cover that seemed to work pretty well. The more protection the better in my humble opinion. I run only foam filters now and I'll never go back.

Edited by mikewrf18, May 20, 2011 - 03:01 AM.


  • yz450fcranker

Posted May 21, 2011 - 06:35 AM

#20

I have never had a problem with a new K&N filter they work and then i get a new one and they dont work if they are damaged





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