2000 YZ426F CLUTCH UPDATE



24 replies to this topic
  • dirtdad

Posted April 05, 2001 - 10:52 AM

#1

Has anyone identified or found the parts (anti judder kit) referenced by BK to update the 00 clutch to the 01 specs? I sent BK an e-mail looking for the part #'s but haven't received an answer. I also called North County Yamaha and they didn't know what I was talking about. These parts are also referenced in the may issue of Dirt Rider in an article reviewing a performance engineering clutch basket for the 426. They mention the price but not the part/kit name or part #'s. Any info would be apreciated.


------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-05-2001).]

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-05-2001).]

  • dirtdad

Posted April 05, 2001 - 03:08 PM

#2

Anyone!????

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • YZ426_Kicks

Posted April 05, 2001 - 04:30 PM

#3

Hey Dirtdad!

If I remember correctly, in one of the previous forums on this site concerning the Hinson Clutch set-up, on of our brother riders put the Performance basket and parts in. I believe he listed everything your looking for. If not, he can definitely help you locate the parts.

I too am fighting Yamaha regarding my clutch. The bike is going into the shop tomorrow, and Yamaha has taken the position that THEY have no obligation to assist in this matter at all. They have taken the position as a courtesy, that they may help.

I am putting a complete Hinson set-up in the bike: Basket, Pressure Plate and Inner Hub. Im not taking any chances. Im also replacing the friction plates, springs and anything else suspect. I just hope nothing has broken off and caused damage to the engine.

Best wishes Dirtdad! If I find it, I'll let you know. :)

God Bless!

Randy
YZ426 Kicks

  • dirtdad

Posted April 05, 2001 - 04:45 PM

#4

Randy, thanks for the reply and sorry to hear that you're still having problems with your bike. I already have a hinson basket and inner hub. The part numbers I need are Yamaha clutch parts that were updated for the 2001 YZ426F. They supposedly consist of
anti-judder spring(?), hardened washer and a thinner bottom friction plate. This is from an earlier post from a member who is Tim Ferry's (team Yamaha) mechanic for his factory 426 race bike, for those of us who would like to upgrade to the 2001 specs. I'm having trouble getting the part numbers.
As I stated earlier, I called North County Yamaha (a very big dealership) and they hadn't heard of it. That's usually the case until they sell one. Anyway, I figured with the many members here that were aware of the previous post maybe one or some had luck in actually obtaining the parts.
Thanks anyway and good luck with your bike. I'm sure you will be infinitely pleased with the Hinson clutch components. They'll probably outlast your bike!

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • F-Pilot

Posted April 05, 2001 - 07:46 PM

#5

dirtdad,
I tried to get the parts at my dealer but they are on backorder, apparently word spread about the fix very fast!
Sorry I don't have the part #s but I can call and get them if you want.
I always deal with the manager at my shop as the counter help leaves a bit to be desired.
I just asked him to look at the fiche for '01 426 clutch and the parts needed are the inner friction plate, spring and washer.
It's not called an "anti-judder" spring but I forget the actual name. I'll call tomorrow and post the part #s.

  • dirtdad

Posted April 05, 2001 - 11:03 PM

#6

F-Pilot, I appreciate the help. The parts guy at NCY had looked at the fiche and could not discern any special or updated parts in comparison to the 2000 model clutch. It's pretty much what I expected. As usual I find more help here than anywhere else. NCY is a VERY large dealership and does alot of mail order and local support in their area. I just figured if any dealer would know what these parts were it would be them. Oh well.
Thanks again.

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • dirtdad

Posted April 06, 2001 - 07:41 AM

#7

For those interested, here are the part #'s,
nomenclature (per the microfiche) and prices (through NCY/(800)225-1629) for the parts needed to update the 00 426 clutch to 01 specs. This is supposed to cure the grabbiness!

5jg163210000 friction plate $16.56
5jg163830000 clutch boss spring $13.07
5jg163840000 seat plate $11.28

Hope this helps.

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • holeshot

Posted April 06, 2001 - 10:28 AM

#8

I've read in recent article (Dirt Rider?) that replacing the final friction plate on the '00 with final friction plate from the '01 (larger I.D.) and the two large spring-type washers that fit in the larger ID of the final friction plate, will cure the grabby clutch. I checked the prices of the three items when the '01 models came out, and the price came to around 50$. At that time, Yamaha wouldn't commit to saying that the parts are interchangeable, but I guess they finally have their ducks in a row.

I think these may be the parts Dirtdad is quoting.

If anyone tries this, let us Thumpertalkers know how it works out.

------------------
Holeshot's Page

[This message has been edited by holeshot (edited 04-06-2001).]

  • dirtdad

Posted April 06, 2001 - 04:13 PM

#9

holeshot, yes these are the parts that were referenced. I have them on order and should have them in about a week. Once I get them installed along with my Hinson basket and inner hub, I'll post the results. I'm expecting this will make my clutch "smooth as butter"! Well, I hope so anyway...

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • F-Pilot

Posted April 06, 2001 - 06:40 PM

#10

Look's like you got all the #,s. Same as the ones I got. I can't wait till they get here, with the clutch fixed and BK's pump mod this bike will be awsome, not that it was bad before.
Still pisses me off that Yamaha had a fix for the clutch and did not recall the '00 or at least post an update about it! Greedy Bastards!!!

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • dirtdad

Posted April 07, 2001 - 03:41 AM

#11

F-Pilot,I agree that Yamaha could at least put out bulletins on upgrades or improvements. Most car manufacturers do although don't always make it public. Yamaha sure doesn't hesitate sending me junk mail such as consumer surveys! Anyway, it just shows how valuable this forum is! By the way, I appreciate the effort trying to get me the part #'s. I just beat you to it. :)

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

  • YZ426_Kicks

Posted April 07, 2001 - 08:09 PM

#12

Now I understand what y'all are talkin' about!

How would you feel if you opened up your post office box and found within it your newest issue of Dirt Rider magazine ( May 2001 ) and on page 152 you found the following?

<marquee>THIS IS UNBELIEVABLE :D</marquee>

PERFORMANCE ENGINEERING YZ426F Clutch Basket

I Quote:

" We also discovered that there has been an update to the '01 models. So if you have an '00 model, you should go to a dealer and order the parts from the '01 model. The new parts consist of a special clutch plate that replaces one of the stock plates, a washer and a spring washer. These three items take the place of the first fiber clutch plate on the inside of the basket and help improve the clutch's engagement. "

Furthermore,

" The updated '01 clutch plate and washers run approximately $50.00 at a local Yamaha dealer. "

End Quote


So if I should have a '00 model, I should go to the dealer and shell out $50.00 to profit Yamaha for their faulty production, and be happy to place their correction into my bike, at my expense? :)

THAT'S IT! I'VE HAD IT! :D

NOT only has Yamaha showed no customer support.
NOT only has Yamaha and my dealer not shown any coordination for resolution.
NOT only has Yamaha refused to stand behind the problem when I have in writing that they would not only replace all damaged parts free of charge but supply the labor.
NOT only has my dealership refused to open my bike's clutch housing before me.

NOW I HAVE TO PAY THEM $50.00 HARD EARNED DOLLARS TO FIX WHAT THEY SCREWED UP????

I'VE HAD IT!

I WILL DO THE CLUTCH REPLACEMENT MYSELF!
I WILL VIDEO TAPE THE ENTIRE PROCEDURE!
I WILL DOCUMENT ALL STEPS AND MEASURES!
I WILL SAVE ALL RECEIPTS!

I WILL PURSUE THIS TO THE FULLEST EXTENT OF THE LAW!

I should have paid the magazines and Thumpertalk $5000.00! At least here people are honest!

YES, IM MAD! :D :D :D

Randy
YZ426 Kicks

[This message has been edited by YZ426 Kicks (edited 04-07-2001).]

  • Boomer

Posted April 08, 2001 - 01:22 AM

#13

YZKICKS - Hey Randy - I take it you received my fax on the public announcement that Yamaha will replace problematic clutches????

I am with you a thousand percent on this - I keep telling you guys, that there IS a way to get Yamaha to own up the the clutch and carb defects on this bike (2000 M.Y. especially). When everyone finally decides band together, then we can get something done - not before. Yamaha and the Dealers are going to sit back and wait for us to grow tired of complaining - because there are aftermarket fixes, they fully expect we will fix problems ourselves. I'm here to tell you they are laughing at us. Like several have mentioned already - if the auto manufacturers tried this, they would be in deep doo, doo - same consumer protection laws apply here.

How did the fax come out? The back-ground was black - so it was a slow transmit.

take care....

Boomer

  • dirtdad

Posted April 08, 2001 - 06:02 AM

#14

Boomer, I agree that Yamaha should take on some responsibility for problems with their bikes, but I think it's absurd to expect a manufacturer to retrofit every bike they sell with updated parts free of charge! As a consumer though, I would like to at least be notified if/when a particular part has been upgraded and parts availability. NO BIKE comes off the assembly line as perfect. I can't believe that anyone would expect that. If they routinely did, there would not be an aftermarket. Some bikes do come close and often can be ridden/raced without modification; however, not many were new model years like the 2000 426. Most car manufacturers DO conduct recalls or put out bulletins only after someone has filed a class action suit or enough people have been injured due to a defect that it draws attention. Just look at the fiasco over the firestone tires/ford motor co.! All parties involed in that were certainly less than honorable. Auto makers also DO NOT routinely upgrade past models when they make changes for new model years! A good example is GM with their TH700R4. A VERY weak transmission when it first came out! They made changes/upgrades to that just about every model year. They certainly did not offer to retrofit past models with the new parts. They were available to the consumer though if you knew about them and wanted to buy them over the counter! I DO believe in fighting for your rights. Is it clear though just what our rights are when it comes to buying/owning one of these things. It only comes with a 30 day guarantee! If it's an issue concerning a defect that can/will cause injury, then I agree that Yamaha(or any manufacturer) needs to be made
aware by enough voices that they will listen and act to take responsibility. If it's just a problem like a grabby clutch they need to be made aware to make the next model better. This is why models change from year to year. You have to agree that purchasing one of these bikes is basically a crap shoot!
Unless you wait a year or two after a bike is introduced, you really can't expect it to be without flaws. Do you really believe that Yamaha purposely left the clutch parts I referenced out of the 2000 model so that we would have to purchase them later? I have a hard time believing that one. I started this post with the intention to provide those with the 2000 426 and grabby clutch a solution to a problem. Not a rally cry to fight the Yamaha Corporation! And Randy, did I read correctly that you're refusing to let the dealer open up your bike to check it out!? What's the purpose? How are you supposed to get a clue as to what's wrong with it? How do you expect them to take responsibility if you won't let them even verify what's wrong with it? It's nothing new that Yamaha said they would fix the defective clutch baskets from the 2000 426. They NEVER stated that they would retrofit upgraded parts from follow-on models.
I've rambled on long enough. My apologies to everyone for the lengthy reply.

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-08-2001).]

  • YZ426_Kicks

Posted April 08, 2001 - 06:36 AM

#15

And Randy, did I read correctly that you're refusing to let the dealer open up your bike to check it out!? What's the purpose? How are you supposed to get a clue as to what's wrong with it? How do you expect them to take responsibility if you won't let them even verify what's wrong with it? It's nothing new that Yamaha said they would fix the defective clutch baskets from the 2000 426. They NEVER stated that they would retrofit upgraded parts from follow-on models.


Hey Dirtdad!

Thank you for replying to my posting! I assure you, I am not trying to change the topic of this forum! Its about the upgrade parts and I just wanted to bring that article to light! I never would have known about it had YOU not stepped forward and opened this forum! I appreciate that very much! I want my clutch fixed right, and if that will help deliver butter smooth performance with the HINSON - KUDOS! :D

THIS TOPIC IS ABOUT THE PARTS!


But to kindly and respectfully reply to your questions, Im completely dumb-founded! :)

Im not refusing to let the dealer open up the bike and work on it. In fact, I prefer that they do! I've never tackled anything like this before. The truth is that:

THE DEALER has refused to open the bike up with me present.

THE DEALER has refused to present the parts to me for my personal inspection.

THE DEALER despite Yamaha claiming they spoke twice to the supervisor knows nothing about my issue.

THE DEALER despite a signed certified letter knows absolutely nothing about my issues.

Now for Yamaha--

Yamaha, despite the public notice that they will repair the bike if it is the clutch free of charge, in terms of parts/labor, has refused to commit to that.

Yamaha, despite that public notice, says they may credit me $150.00 toward the purchase of Yamaha accessories.

Yamaha NEVER sent me a welcome or a thank you letter for purchasing their product.

Yamaha NEVER sent me a notification that there is a issue surrounding the clutch or other parts of the bike.

Yamaha NEVER sent me a notification that they made adjustments in the 2001 model that WILL improve my 2000 bikes clutch performance.

Yamaha HAS sent me customer support surveys!
Yamaha HAS sent me new product catalogs!
Yamaha HAS sent me requests to promote their products!


Now I ask--seeing all that would you trust your dealer or Yamaha?

Would you, after reading all the unjustices done to everyone in this forum concerning clutches, gas tanks, hubs, sprockets, gear boxes, and other issues- trust Yamaha?

Why is it unreasonable for Yamaha to supply those parts to those who have bon-a-fide clutch issues?

If I caused the clutch failure, yes-I am responsibile, I am accountable. I would pay for those parts! But the fact remains that Yamaha screwed up with this bike and they are not stepping in and doing what's right!


Im not trying to look for something for nothing! I am not like that! But why, if I do indeed have one of the bikes that has the faulty basket, should I shell out:

$600.00 for the Hinson pressure plate, inner hub & basket

I understand the Hinson is my choice. So I accept paying for the upgrade. But Yamaha won't even give me credit of the difference between the MSRP of stock parts and Hinsons. Yet Yamaha has now added the complete Hinson set up as a factory option. That is per Yamaha Customer Service. :D

And...

I can't even begin to go into what was told to me from Ron and Brian Hinson at Hinson Racing concerning this issue.

How would you feel if Yamaha put free of charge Hinson baskets, inner hubs & pressure plates ( if needed ) in defective bikes for a few, then went back to stock parts. To get the Hinsons all you had to do was open your mouth and they gave it to you-but they didn't tell you about that option!


$ 50.00 for those new parts to prevent the grabby feeling

$ 300.00 for shop labor

$ 100.00 for spring packs and friction plates


You're expecting me to shell out $ 1100.00 for a problem I didn't cause.

Why is this so hard to everyone to accept as being wrong? :D

Just because we request product support and accountablility doesn't mean that it will send the dirt-bike industry back a million years.

Look at Cannondale
Look at Honda

I NEVER hear of customers shouting about legitamate repair issues! Why? Because when they mess up, they step to the plate and fix it, no matter what the cost!

Im so sorry I didn't buy a XR400! This will be the last Yammie I ever buy! Period!

By the way, is it just my misinterpretation, or is Yamaha stopping production with the 426 to promote a new 450??

Hmmm...only two model years on the market. both troubled with apparent production defects. I wonder why?

Curious to see what may come about to plague the YZ450F

Thanks!

God Bless!

Randy
YZ426 Kicks




[This message has been edited by YZ426 Kicks (edited 04-08-2001).]

  • dirtdad

Posted April 08, 2001 - 07:45 AM

#16

Randy,
I hope I did not offend you with my reply! I never said you didn't have a legitimate complaint. I agree with you on the issue of the clutch basket. That is the one item that I know of that Yamaha has admitted to. I don't understand why you are having such a problem with them over that. To my knowledge, they never made claims to replace or pay for any other clutch parts such as inner hub, pressure plate, friction plates etc...! I do know that GYT-R (Yamaha's accessory arm) offers billet clutch parts (Hinson or their own, I'm not sure), but I've never heard of them offering these to people free to fix the problem! It sounds to me like you have a very unscrupulous dealership! Is there another dealer in your area you can go to for help? I just can't imagine why Yamaha would rescind their admitted responsibility to fix defective 2000 model clutch baskets concerning your situation!? I still think it's a little much to expect Yamaha to provide these three upgraded clutch parts free of charge. Maybe someone else can site an instance where a manufacturer has done this (unless it's a safety related recall), but I can't think of one. I can't respond with authority to your claims on the Honda or Cannondale being totally responsible concerning all the problems with their bikes. I've never owned or known anyone personally that's owned a Cannondale, but I have heard/read countless remarks/articles concerning their less than perfect track record. I believe they take responsibility to their consumers, one because they are small and new (in the motorcycle business) and they are trying to establish themselves and stay in that business. They've also admitted that their bikes are a work in progress with no two being exactly the same so they need to support their customers in that fashion. Owning a Cannondale is a VERY big gamble. As far as Honda goes, I own a 91 CR125R. It's a nice bike, but certainly not without flaw. It suffered from less than perfect forks and high rpm popping that Honda didn't really cure until about two years later and they never came back to me and offered to update my bike. I didn't expect them to either. Anyone looking forward to buying the first model year of the Honda moto specific thumper is fooling themselves if they think it will be without flaw! Your comment on it taking $1100 to correct the problem is a little exagerated. I'm not disputing that's how much it costs to purchase and have ALL those parts installed, but ALL those parts are NOT required to fix your bike. ALL those parts WILL make your clutch bullit proof and probably operate without flaw. There are alot of 2000 owners still riding on the stock basket/inner hub and pressure plate without problems. There are alot of owners that have also upgraded to the Hinson basket(a common mod on any brand bike) in combo with stock inner hub and pressure plate that are completely satisfied. My point is that all the parts you're installing are just that much better than stock, not necessarily required to make your bike function properly. I DO wish you the best of luck in resolving your problem though. You certainly do have an issue with Yamaha if it is indeed your clutch basket, but I don't think you'll ever be satisfied if you expect them to pay for any of the other parts unless a clutch basket failure caused other damage (which is likely). I believe the real issue/deficiancy is with your dealer. I really don't know what to tell you about dealing with them except stick to your guns until you get them to do what they're supposed to or find an honest dealer if that's possible!

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-08-2001).]

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-08-2001).]

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-08-2001).]

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-08-2001).]

  • YZ426_Kicks

Posted April 08, 2001 - 08:33 AM

#17

Hey Dirtdad!

Ah, don't sweat it! No offense taken, for I feel no offense was given.

I don't know what will happen when I open that casing. I haven't done it yet because I have been afraid of what Yamaha would say.

Will the inner parts need to be replaced?
I don't know.

I am of this mind-set:

Should the basket be the culpret, I am very leary about using parts that have been exposed to that particular failing part. That is why I have chosen to completely replace with all three components - basket, inner hub & pressure plate - from Hinson. I have chosen to replace all friction and fiber clutch plates, and new springs. I cannot ignore the fact that all the clutch mechanism works as a team. If one team member fails, then the others are overworked and overstressed. I feel it better to be safe than sorry and replace everything.

I don't expect Yamaha to pay for everything. But they are showing no consideration! NONE!
The dealer isn't cooperating, and because I have so many "red flags" popping up I don't trust anyone. That is sad!

I will order the parts brought to my attention in this forum, along with the others and do the job myself. I cannot afford to pay the labor rates, find the clutch is defective, then Yamaha walk away. They haven't proven themselves to me.

One cries wolf-shame on me
Two cry wolf-shame on you
Three or more cry wolf-Hey there is a problem!

I never believed that the YZ426F was perfect. I read and researched before I bought. I saw the reviews regarding this weakness, that weakness, this being cheap, or that being not as comfortable, but I understood that along with the good comes the not so good. I accepted these reports as fact! I just didn't buy blind.

No dirtbike magazine review hinted towards the clutch woes or hub issues, etc. In fact, all these issues have come to light after the majority of the bikes were sold. Only now are the mags starting to report on issues, but they are so watered down. That's because of advertising $$$. Please, I don't even want to go there!

I do enjoy my Yammie when she works. And that's just it-when it works.

You said something key in your reply-Cannondale is working with each individual to ensure product satisfaction, because they are new in the industry and want to have a good name.

Does this mean that once the name is established and a reputation is earned, you can just drop the ball?

Look at some of the people you have known and look back at their lives when they were good, hardworking, dependable and responsibile. Then see how many are now just skating because of the name they built but the foundation that built the name is gone.

I ask-aren't they falling wayside?

Just a thought.

I ask for nothing except what I feel I, or anyone else should be entitled to:

THE REASONABLE EXPECTATION THAT OUR BIKES SHOULD PERFORM ACCORDINGLY.

I believe that reasonable expectation for many, including myself has not been mechanically, and I stress mechanically, met.

I just wanna ride and get muddy!

God Bless!

Randy
YZ426 Kicks

  • dirtdad

Posted April 08, 2001 - 09:05 PM

#18

Good luck Randy!

  • DaveJ

Posted April 09, 2001 - 12:05 PM

#19

Dirtdad,

The part numbers posted don't make sense.

They are the friction discs, springs, and lever holder. You would need 9 discs, 5 springs, and 1 holder. My dealer totaled this out to $264. In short, it's just a new clutch.

I would have to assume you could get a replacement clutch on the after market for less than that. And there's nothing that I can think of that would cause that last part number (5jg-16384-00-00) to cause such a problem.

Did I miss something?

DaveJ

  • dirtdad

Posted April 09, 2001 - 01:24 PM

#20

DaveJ, The part #'s and item descriptions listed above are exactly as the guy at North County Yamaha read them to me. I even had him describe what was pictured. He said it showed a separate friction plate, flat spring and washer (both the same diameter as the friction plate). These also match the part #'s that F-pilot got from his dealer when he placed his order. The friction plate listed is NOT the same as the rest of the stack (per BK's post) and the parts guy at NCY said the fiche showed that single plate as a separate part # from the other common friction plates. I don't understand why your parts guy read it out the way he did!? You can call NCY at (800)225-1629. Maybe they could provide your parts guy with the correct info. Hope this helps and sorry if I gave bum info! :)

------------------
like a kid again!
00 YZ426F
01 TT-R125L (my son's)
91 CR125
83 YZ490
74 Hodaka Super Combat(gone but not forgotten!)

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-09-2001).]

[This message has been edited by dirtdad (edited 04-09-2001).]





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