2011 yz450 vs Ktm 300


42 replies to this topic
  • pudadin

Posted January 15, 2011 - 02:03 PM

#1

Time for a new bike. Coming off of a 2005 wr450 which I still love...has been a great bike. But I am looking to compete in D36 Enduros more seriously this season and would like a more competative bike...would like a lighter bike also! I have ridden an 09 KTM 300xc and liked it, but I also really enjoy the planted feel of a 4 stroke and the smooth roll on power. So many guys swear by the 300 I ride with I am kinda leaning that way? Considering an 11 yz450 also. I am a B rider amd I would love any input...Thanks

  • Gunner354

Posted January 15, 2011 - 02:41 PM

#2

Been there done that. Yz set up for woods hands down way better than a 300.

  • shrubitup

Posted January 15, 2011 - 02:56 PM

#3

300s are hyped. :smirk:

  • brentn

Posted January 15, 2011 - 03:40 PM

#4

They are, I won't deny that they have some potential (porting) but out of the box they are def hyped.
WR gearing with more torque than a yz250 down low but power does not compare up high. This is the jyst I've got from owners of the 300 who have rode both, and from magazine articles that I have read.
If you want a two stroke for the woods, a YZ250 with a dialed in suspension and an eric gorr yz300 kit with MX porting will blow the KTM 300 out of the water.

The 450 stock will outperform the 300 in terms of power IMO, suspension will be better on the 300 out of the box but the 450 suspension stock is actually very nice for woods. Considering the forks and shock were made for MX, I found it worked awesome out in the sticks

  • pudadin

Posted January 15, 2011 - 04:17 PM

#5

Thanks Brentn. I am 6'3 225 and think the mx set up stock would work well since I am well over limit for stock springs. The quote you mentioned about your Dad is touching. I bet you guys rode together. My son and I are best friends and we spend a lot of time out on our bikes together. He 13. Thanks Buddy

  • pudadin

Posted January 15, 2011 - 04:18 PM

#6

How about the EFI aspect for off road? Any thoughts here?

  • Gunner354

Posted January 15, 2011 - 04:55 PM

#7

How about the EFI aspect for off road? Any thoughts here?


Efi with a tuner. Can tune what ever power you desire in a couple of minutes. The one downside I have read is that even the aftermarket tanks are pretty small.

  • petey383

Posted January 15, 2011 - 05:03 PM

#8

This year I switched from an 05' WR450 (that I rode 3 years) to a 2011 KTM 300 XCW. I too was in search of something lighter and something that handled better in the woods! My bike before the WR was a YZF426 and I loved them all, but the 300 is a really good bike too. I have only got 6 hours in the saddle but so far I have only found 2 trade offs. The first one is that it is a little tricky to loft the front tire on demand over obstacles and the other is that when you are in the power on the 300 that traction is a little hard to come by. Other than that I feel like the 300 is better in every way. I really love the lack of compression braking. On the WR it felt like I was accelerating or slowing all of the time. It seems like I can carry more speed easier on the 300 than I could on the WR.

  • pudadin

Posted January 15, 2011 - 05:41 PM

#9

Is the weight factor as big as I think it will be?

  • Gunner354

Posted January 15, 2011 - 06:15 PM

#10

Is the weight factor as big as I think it will be?


I've ridden an 05 wr450 and either bike will ride a whole bunch lighter. The geometry on the wr was not very good. Get the yz

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  • shrubitup

Posted January 15, 2011 - 06:25 PM

#11

This year I switched from an 05' WR450 (that I rode 3 years) to a 2011 KTM 300 XCW. I too was in search of something lighter and something that handled better in the woods! My bike before the WR was a YZF426 and I loved them all, but the 300 is a really good bike too. I have only got 6 hours in the saddle but so far I have only found 2 trade offs. The first one is that it is a little tricky to loft the front tire on demand over obstacles and the other is that when you are in the power on the 300 that traction is a little hard to come by. Other than that I feel like the 300 is better in every way. I really love the lack of compression braking. On the WR it felt like I was accelerating or slowing all of the time. It seems like I can carry more speed easier on the 300 than I could on the WR.

The 2011 KTMs are supposed to be great bikes. They're spendy. Surprised you're having wheelie issues on a 300...

  • petey383

Posted January 15, 2011 - 06:40 PM

#12

The 2011 KTMs are supposed to be great bikes. They're spendy. Surprised you're having wheelie issues on a 300...


Trust me.......... It wheelies very easily but when your cruising along on the trail at a decent clip and you're in the power I'm not always sure if it's going to wheelie or if it's going to spin. Sometimes that is a very uncomfortable feeling. If you are riding very slow and lugging it I can bring it up over obstacles very easily and it is predictable. On the old WR it was very predictable in that area.

I think it's a great bike too! Just need some more time and good weather to ride it!

  • petey383

Posted January 15, 2011 - 06:42 PM

#13

The 2011 KTMs are supposed to be great bikes. They're spendy. Surprised you're having wheelie issues on a 300...


The first time I rode it I had to wheelie over a wash out and I hit the throttle and it just spun! Front tire went in and I went over! Just something that I'm going to have to get used to!

  • grayracer513

Posted January 15, 2011 - 06:47 PM

#14

In the age graduated classes for vets and older in desert racing, there are no limitations either up or down on displacement. In my class, we have one competitor who rides a KTM 300 and he's more than a little bit competitive on it. He finished second in the points this year. The bike is fast, no doubt.

But it's only about 10 pounds lighter than a YZ450.

it is a little tricky to loft the front tire on demand over obstacles and the other is that when you are in the power on the 300 that traction is a little hard to come by.

These are typical characteristics of powerful two-strokes; instant wheelspin and difficult to manage power. The YZF is going to be much better in both departments.

The two biggest faults the YZ would have to begin with are the sudden nature of the throttle tip-in, which is slightly correctable by changing throttle tubes and using the tuner, but totally correctable by having the throttle body reworked, and the small gas tank. Because of the tank configuration, the biggest you can so far get for the bike is 2.4 gallons. I would guess, though that you could reliably go 40-45 miles on that in a race.

  • shrubitup

Posted January 16, 2011 - 04:10 PM

#15

The first time I rode it I had to wheelie over a wash out and I hit the throttle and it just spun! Front tire went in and I went over! Just something that I'm going to have to get used to!

Depending on your speed, I would suggest lower tire pressures, a trials tire, a FWW, and/or a Rekluse auto clutch in that order. These help two smokes with traction. The four strokes do hook up better but the smokers can be dialed. Another suggestion is to try a ride on the 250XC. It`s supposed to have more snap in the motor - that can only help if you have traction however.

  • Summit

Posted January 16, 2011 - 09:03 PM

#16

I agree, I think the 300's are somewhat hyped. Test rode a new holdover 09 and I was expecting so much more just based on the hype. Definitely a nice bike but not near the power I was expecting. I'm also on an 05 WR that's tuned and pulls hard but would like something more nimble for certain areas of single track goat trails we occasionally ride. I love my 450 for more open stuff and know I would miss the grunt so I think I'll get a new 200 xcw and keep the WR.

  • pudadin

Posted January 17, 2011 - 08:42 PM

#17

I rode a 08 300 today at Carnegie (northern Cal) in mud up and down some very steep hills. If you ride Carnegie you know what I mean. 300 was good but I felt my old wr450 was easier to get traction both up and down......engine braking in slippery mud on very step downhill I feel is a plus. My bike has a rekluse and the 300 did not....so maybe not a fair assessment. I am going with the yz. Yes the tank is small but with the larger tank I should be able to get 50mi and can carry a gallon with me. I am going to miss the button but not the weight!

  • tech24

Posted January 18, 2011 - 05:32 AM

#18

I agree with Brentn on the suspension, stock seems to work pretty darn good in the woods. All I did was soften HS comp 2 clicks fron and rear and its all I need. And oddly enough I don't change it any when I go to the track. Never ridden a 300 but I think the yz could be very competitive and comfy in a woods race with a few mods.

  • Gunner354

Posted January 18, 2011 - 10:39 AM

#19

I rode a 08 300 today at Carnegie (northern Cal) in mud up and down some very steep hills. If you ride Carnegie you know what I mean. 300 was good but I felt my old wr450 was easier to get traction both up and down......engine braking in slippery mud on very step downhill I feel is a plus. My bike has a rekluse and the 300 did not....so maybe not a fair assessment. I am going with the yz. Yes the tank is small but with the larger tank I should be able to get 50mi and can carry a gallon with me. I am going to miss the button but not the weight!



You are making the right choice.

  • Sycamore

Posted January 20, 2011 - 08:04 PM

#20

In the age graduated classes for vets and older in desert racing, there are no limitations either up or down on displacement. In my class, we have one competitor who rides a KTM 300 and he's more than a little bit competitive on it. He finished second in the points this year. The bike is fast, no doubt.

But it's only about 10 pounds lighter than a YZ450.

These are typical characteristics of powerful two-strokes; instant wheelspin and difficult to manage power. The YZF is going to be much better in both departments.

The two biggest faults the YZ would have to begin with are the sudden nature of the throttle tip-in, which is slightly correctable by changing throttle tubes and using the tuner, but totally correctable by having the throttle body reworked, and the small gas tank. Because of the tank configuration, the biggest you can so far get for the bike is 2.4 gallons. I would guess, though that you could reliably go 40-45 miles on that in a race.


Agree on most of your points.

The 300 is for the same type of rider that rides a 500. The bike isnt ridden on the pipe typically. That's the beauty of it, ride it a gear high and get smooth tractable power. Engines last forever and you wont be working on it ever either. Truly incredible really.

The 2011's come with e-start, why? Take it off and save another 8 or so pounds on top of the other 10lb you have on the porkier competion. From the factory with a full take of gas (3g), estart to boot it comes in at 241lb The 11's supposedly have an awesome chasis, same with suspension.

The YZ450 from the factory comes in at 250lb with 1.5 gas, add a bigger tank (something not need on the ktm), and your up to 256lb, now add hand guads, skid plate, 18 inch wheel, FWW, other trail do-dads, get the picture?

But it is a cool design and I think about this bike often. Yammie engine is rock solid IMO..at least the older designs were. this new one looks cool and with the pipe out the back the engine probably does run cooler, kind of important for enduros. Also as much as I hear the suspension is nice on the KTM I cant imagine it better then a YZ, handling too..I could be wrong.

BUT for anything but easy enduros the KTM300/250 is going to be a better choice. If the D36 enduros are easy flowy stuff then I'm thinking the yz will have an advantage. But in a long techical enduros the KTM will have a distinct advantage. Mostly because of weight, but the type of power the 300 makes will be an advantage too...the thing will not stall, it is a lugger where a four stroke will flame out. I think I read it wll go down to 400rpm or something.





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