2010 pipes


44 replies to this topic
  • fishkiller

Posted March 05, 2010 - 07:07 AM

#21

With that clutch you can lock up the rear going inton turns and then blast out like normal, without ever pulling in the clutch? For real? Brake tap in the air with no clutch pull then? Can you still feather the clutch out of turns for an rpm jump? What are the downfalls to this mod besides price?

  • motojase316

Posted March 05, 2010 - 05:40 PM

#22

With that clutch you can lock up the rear going inton turns and then blast out like normal, without ever pulling in the clutch? For real? Brake tap in the air with no clutch pull then? Can you still feather the clutch out of turns for an rpm jump? What are the downfalls to this mod besides price?


Yeah, for real, the Rekluse Core EXP is one crazy clutch, you can't stall the engine, it can still be used as normal too feathering and clutching out of turns etc :thumbsup: I am yet to find it's down fall but I will get some more riding in and let you know.

  • BBrown626

Posted March 05, 2010 - 07:26 PM

#23

A Rekluse EXP?

If so email me.
factoryphoto@gmail.com

Ive rideen the 2010:
Stock
Stock pipe with mapping
Dr D
Dr D with mapping.
I can assure you that a aftermarket pipe broadens the power out. The stock header is fine im sure but the muffler like most yamaha mufflers is muffled up. Ya 99% of us here cant use the full power of the 450 but a slip on or full system def helps with the power spread. With a full system you can go much further in the direction you want with the programmer than you will with the stocker. The pipe alone without mapping it is a hefty difference, mapping it with a system brings out that motor huge. I know the difference between power and "sound" .. The bike lacks huge on the top end, a pipe lets it rev out more than the stock WITH map. Now put a good mid/top end map in there with the exhaust and its a big difference. Plus I like having a SA if I ever go to a few OHV parks in my area that have tracks to ride during the week. Is a exhaust a must? Hell no nothing is a must does it do good to the power hell yes it does. If the pipe didnt do anything I would be the first to say "no its a waste of freakin money" but it did plain and simple.


NorCal,
did you go with the full system or the slip on?

Yesterday I think was the 3rd ride on my bike. I did blow a shift coming out of a corner before a jump. I figured I just rev it a little more than expected, but I found the overrev wasn't there! From your results it sounds like the pipe is restricting the motor on the top end.

  • norcal_hoss

Posted March 05, 2010 - 10:25 PM

#24

NorCal,
did you go with the full system or the slip on?

Yesterday I think was the 3rd ride on my bike. I did blow a shift coming out of a corner before a jump. I figured I just rev it a little more than expected, but I found the overrev wasn't there! From your results it sounds like the pipe is restricting the motor on the top end.



Ya the bike has zero over rev. First year FI seems thats the way besides the kawi where it was a monster all the way through. The stock muffler is very restrictive imo they usually are and a slip on alone helps out big with the over rev. Even with mapping and Dr D full system it still does not have the over rev I want. I had a 2010 ktm 450 that thing revved to the moon it never stopped pulling and on a mx track it would almost scare me sometimes. I sold the Dr D to a friend who likes that pipe, I never wanted it and when I picked it up it was on my bike just a miscommunication with my dealership. I have a full Akrapovic "Race" system now. Its the cheaper one has a beautiful TI muffler with SS header with a chamber. It was about $200 more than the DR D. Ive never been a fan of DR D thats just me I have a ton of friends that swear by that pipe but I like the Akrapovic, Leo Vince or MRD (MRD does not make one yet) If you can get a deal on those there really nice solid pipes and the packing takes forever to blow out. I cant tell you what the akrapovic is like just yet, im sitting in a hotel room in Daytona beach while my bike is torn apart home in Cali. I wont be home until Tuesday. Ill put the bike together Thursday once I get my photos uploaded from the races. I had a Akrapovic on a ktm I had and there are works of art. But to me worth another $200 bucks.
I have a programmer at the shop I will pick up next week and make a custom map. I sat on the plane next to L&M Larry brooks will see him tomorrow along with Bubbas mechanic, im going to try to get some tips with maps from them while I do my bike photos with those guys. Hopefully I get some good info to pass along. But the programmer seems pretty straight forward just need to find that balance but put alot more towards the mid to top end. I seen the bikes and they cut the air box on top above the two bolts that you unlock the tank with, supposedly it gives it more rev. There race bikes are totally different but im gonna ask about there mx bikes and same with JGR would be nice to get some pointers.

  • baja931

Posted March 05, 2010 - 10:28 PM

#25

what aftermarket pipes can anybody recomend.
also how good did they fit.
I am asking because my GYTR pipe is a terrible fit.So bad it will not mount up.


your GYTR pipe doesnt fit. i have never had any kind of problem with GYTR's. i meen there made by yamaha??

  • Scrubba

Posted March 06, 2010 - 01:13 AM

#26

Ya the bike has zero over rev. First year FI seems thats the way besides the kawi where it was a monster all the way through. The stock muffler is very restrictive imo they usually are and a slip on alone helps out big with the over rev. Even with mapping and Dr D full system it still does not have the over rev I want. I had a 2010 ktm 450 that thing revved to the moon it never stopped pulling and on a mx track it would almost scare me sometimes. I sold the Dr D to a friend who likes that pipe, I never wanted it and when I picked it up it was on my bike just a miscommunication with my dealership. I have a full Akrapovic "Race" system now. Its the cheaper one has a beautiful TI muffler with SS header with a chamber. It was about $200 more than the DR D. Ive never been a fan of DR D thats just me I have a ton of friends that swear by that pipe but I like the Akrapovic, Leo Vince or MRD (MRD does not make one yet) If you can get a deal on those there really nice solid pipes and the packing takes forever to blow out. I cant tell you what the akrapovic is like just yet, im sitting in a hotel room in Daytona beach while my bike is torn apart home in Cali. I wont be home until Tuesday. Ill put the bike together Thursday once I get my photos uploaded from the races. I had a Akrapovic on a ktm I had and there are works of art. But to me worth another $200 bucks.
I have a programmer at the shop I will pick up next week and make a custom map. I sat on the plane next to L&M Larry brooks will see him tomorrow along with Bubbas mechanic, im going to try to get some tips with maps from them while I do my bike photos with those guys. Hopefully I get some good info to pass along. But the programmer seems pretty straight forward just need to find that balance but put alot more towards the mid to top end. I seen the bikes and they cut the air box on top above the two bolts that you unlock the tank with, supposedly it gives it more rev. There race bikes are totally different but im gonna ask about there mx bikes and same with JGR would be nice to get some pointers.


Unless youre just trying to get "the look" i wouldnt cut the holes in the plastic. their motors are totally modified to where this extra flow will make a difference.

Too much airflow is not good for the stock motor, and you will have to clean your AF every ride or more.

  • gscx

Posted March 06, 2010 - 01:19 AM

#27

He should probly say something to Yamaha if thier own pipe that they made for thier own bike isnt fitting right, i would def. be getting some kind of refund or maybe they fixed the issue in later production runs. I think that would be better than spending 900 on another system

  • Gunner354

Posted March 06, 2010 - 06:58 AM

#28

Too much airflow is not good for the stock motor, and you will have to clean your AF every ride or more.

Was this a joke?

  • tiruff

Posted March 06, 2010 - 10:17 AM

#29

FMF fit perfect on mine

  • FinchFan194

Posted March 06, 2010 - 12:07 PM

#30

With that clutch you can lock up the rear going inton turns and then blast out like normal, without ever pulling in the clutch? For real? Brake tap in the air with no clutch pull then? Can you still feather the clutch out of turns for an rpm jump? What are the downfalls to this mod besides price?


Pretty much price is the only drawback.

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • BBrown626

Posted March 06, 2010 - 03:22 PM

#31

I cant tell you what the akrapovic is like just yet, im sitting in a hotel room in Daytona beach while my bike is torn apart home in Cali. I wont be home until Tuesday. Ill put the bike together Thursday once I get my photos uploaded from the races. I had a Akrapovic on a ktm I had and there are works of art. But to me worth another $200 bucks.

I seen the bikes and they cut the air box on top above the two bolts that you unlock the tank with, supposedly it gives it more rev. There race bikes are totally different but im gonna ask about there mx bikes and same with JGR would be nice to get some pointers.


Must be nice to be down there "working." My son is an amateur photographer and loves taking pics at the races. In fact today was his first paying session with a local trainer during lessons.

Posted Image

Regarding the air box, i think they only plan to open them up on Supercross bikes. The motocross track is too dusty. I was told they all run the DT-1 over-the-cage air filters. The increased surface area may help with the dirt.

  • Scrubba

Posted March 07, 2010 - 11:41 AM

#32

Too much airflow is not good for the stock motor, and you will have to clean your AF every ride or more.

Was this a joke?


try taking out the air filter and runningyour bike and see what happens. you wont be laughing

  • grayracer513

Posted March 07, 2010 - 02:30 PM

#33

Too much airflow is not good for the stock motor, and you will have to clean your AF every ride or more.

Was this a joke?

It's a misconception, either way. The bottleneck in the intake is the throttle body or carb venturi. Occasionally, the intake ports are smaller or more restrictive than that, but generally, it's the throttle body cross section that determines air flow. The combined area of the stock air inlets are significantly larger than this, so I'll predict that little or nothing can be gained by adding holes in the shrouds.

As to cleaning the filter, no more or less air will flow through the filter than what the engine takes in, regardless of how many directions the air comes from, so it won't make the get dirtier faster, other than mud splashing directly on the element. Besides, you should be cleaning the air filter every ride day, anyway.

  • delmas

Posted March 07, 2010 - 04:02 PM

#34

what aftermarket pipes can anybody recomend.
also how good did they fit.
I am asking because my GYTR pipe is a terrible fit.So bad it will not mount up.


Well I did get the pipe on and it just does not fit exactly perfect as the stock one.
with the stock map it smoothed out the hit and revs out more.
So then I loaded the map from Yamaha for sharpe throttle responce and more overall power.
It is a smoker .it does not hit as hard on the bottom as stock but at half throttle it just comes on fire.I like it and did try any more maps.
this is a great bike .i love it

  • BBrown626

Posted March 08, 2010 - 08:11 PM

#35

As to cleaning the filter, no more or less air will flow through the filter than what the engine takes in, regardless of how many directions the air comes from, so it won't make the get dirtier faster, other than mud splashing directly on the element. Besides, you should be cleaning the air filter every ride day, anyway.


Emig described the mods one team was running. They opened the air box and found it flowed better, but collected more dust. Probably due to the location more than the volume. If you take the airbox cover off then air would flow in from the sides and bottom of the tank. I would think air would tend to swirl in behind the stem and engine and draw in dust kind of like dust swirling behind your car as you drive down a gravel road.

While it is true that no more air will flow through the filter than the engine takes in (simple logic), if the air flows better then some impediment to performance may be reduced or eliminated. Isn't that the goal of aftermarket filters, pipes, head mods, etc?

  • Scrubba

Posted March 08, 2010 - 11:06 PM

#36

Emig described the mods one team was running. They opened the air box and found it flowed better, but collected more dust. Probably due to the location more than the volume. If you take the airbox cover off then air would flow in from the sides and bottom of the tank. I would think air would tend to swirl in behind the stem and engine and draw in dust kind of like dust swirling behind your car as you drive down a gravel road.

While it is true that no more air will flow through the filter than the engine takes in (simple logic), if the air flows better then some impediment to performance may be reduced or eliminated. Isn't that the goal of aftermarket filters, pipes, head mods, etc?


I agree. Otherwise why run an airbox at all, on dry days? a pod type air filter will do.

well, he will say the rocks will hit it and rip it apart. then just run a wire cage over it.

with the open yamaha cutouts, it would be suseptible to anything the front wheel kicks up, otherwise which would end up Behind the scoops.

  • grayracer513

Posted March 09, 2010 - 08:03 AM

#37

Well designed air boxes are set up so as to create an indirect path to the air filter, and to cause a drop in air velocity as the air arrives at the filter. This causes most of the heavier debris in the air to either "miss the turn" getting to the filter element or settle out of the air as the velocity drops.

In any conduit through which a gas or a fluid flows, the areas having the greatest cross section will have the lowest velocity, and the areas with the least cross section will show both the highest velocity and create the greatest restriction. The smallest of these will be the single limiting factor in determining the ultimate flow capabilities of the conduit, unless there are two such places of the same size.

In the case of an engine's intake tract, any section that causes a significant restriction in air flow will cause a drop in pressure to the engine side of it because the vacuum created by the engine can't be relieved by incoming air quickly enough. You can test this on your own 2010 model, or anything else, by setting up a slack tube manometer, or a vacuum gauge that reads in inches of water. Run a tube up the shroud to a point near the back end, then run the engine at full throttle at high rpm. If the pressure drops in this low velocity area, it means the inlets in the shrouds are too small. I predict here and now that it won't.

You can say what you want, or believe what you want, but the fact is that the total cross sectional area of the shroud air inlets is larger than the narrowest point in the intake tract. The other thing being overlooked here is that at speed, the area in front of the radiators, where the air inlet is positioned, becomes a high pressure zone because of air running up against the obstruction created by the radiators. That pressure will aid in pushing air through the inlets.

Having seen a whole set of test results of different air box configurations done by a major super moto team running a YZ450 a few years ago, none of which yielded any improvement over the original set up, I'll believe that cutting out the shrouds on a 2010 improves air flow when a dyno tells me it does, and not until.

  • grayracer513

Posted March 09, 2010 - 04:20 PM

#38

The stock header is fine im sure but the muffler like most yamaha mufflers is muffled up.

I missed this earlier. For the most part, OEM Yamaha exhaust systems have been pretty good over the years. Only the '08 and '09 "Shorty" muffler has been an abysmal disappointment. That's not to say they can't be improved on; they can. But replacing the pipe on any of them is not the near necessity it is on the '08-'09 models.

  • Scrubba

Posted March 10, 2010 - 01:05 AM

#39

Well designed air boxes are set up so as to create an indirect path to the air filter, and to cause a drop in air velocity as the air arrives at the filter. This causes most of the heavier debris in the air to either "miss the turn" getting to the filter element or settle out of the air as the velocity drops.

In any conduit through which a gas or a fluid flows, the areas having the greatest cross section will have the lowest velocity, and the areas with the least cross section will show both the highest velocity and create the greatest restriction. The smallest of these will be the single limiting factor in determining the ultimate flow capabilities of the conduit, unless there are two such places of the same size.

In the case of an engine's intake tract, any section that causes a significant restriction in air flow will cause a drop in pressure to the engine side of it because the vacuum created by the engine can't be relieved by incoming air quickly enough. You can test this on your own 2010 model, or anything else, by setting up a slack tube manometer, or a vacuum gauge that reads in inches of water. Run a tube up the shroud to a point near the back end, then run the engine at full throttle at high rpm. If the pressure drops in this low velocity area, it means the inlets in the shrouds are too small. I predict here and now that it won't.

You can say what you want, or believe what you want, but the fact is that the total cross sectional area of the shroud air inlets is larger than the narrowest point in the intake tract. The other thing being overlooked here is that at speed, the area in front of the radiators, where the air inlet is positioned, becomes a high pressure zone because of air running up against the obstruction created by the radiators. That pressure will aid in pushing air through the inlets.

Having seen a whole set of test results of different air box configurations done by a major super moto team running a YZ450 a few years ago, none of which yielded any improvement over the original set up, I'll believe that cutting out the shrouds on a 2010 improves air flow when a dyno tells me it does, and not until.


im not quite so sure the the "ram" induction principle is greater than the large cut outs, when supplying quantitative volumetric parameters.

most of the intake vacuum takes place upon acceleration from a slower speed than can ram the air in at greater volumes than the injector can compensate for.

By the time the speeds are great enough to forcefully induct greater amounts than what are called for, the throttle will not be fully open or even close to it, as throttle quantity is inveresly related to the overall speed of the bike.

wheareas in a freeflowing state, as in the cutouts, air is proportiontely supplied in a linear demandddddddddddddddddd.

  • grayracer513

Posted March 10, 2010 - 08:10 AM

#40

most of the intake vacuum takes place upon acceleration from a slower speed than can ram the air in at greater volumes than the injector can compensate for.

Not true. First, the question of what the injector can deal with is entirely up to the programmed fuel curve and the physical delivery capabilities of the injector itself. Secondly, in a low speed, high throttle opening situation, there is both very low manifold vacuum and relatively low air velocity across the throttle body. In a carburetor, this had to be dealt with through the use of enrichment devices such as power valves (not like those on two-stroke exhausts) and accelerator pumps. These have to be manually calibrated and cannot respond to changing conditions in the venturi very well. An EFI unit has no such natural limitation, and can deliver fuel in the correct amount for any situation it is programmed to deal with.

Higher manifold vacuum and air flow comes only with higher speeds.

By the time the speeds are great enough to forcefully induct greater amounts than what are called for, the throttle will not be fully open or even close to it, as throttle quantity is inveresly (sic) related to the overall speed of the bike.

Very weird thing to say, that the throttle will be less open as speed increases? That's you, not the machine. Let me assure you that racing across the dry lake at Superstition, or the front straight at a GP race, mine doesn't behave that way.

As far as forceful induction, it will never go fast enough to do that if what you mean is that it would ever force enough air into the air box to increase manifold pressure (boost). The increase in air pressure at the inlets related to speed will, however have an affect on the pressure differential between the manifold and the outside air, and will cause air to flow more freely into the filter.

Cut out slots on the sides, on the other hand, are positioned in a way that will more probably reduce atmospheric pressure over them as speed increases.

But as I said, you can believe anything you like.





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