Should I switch to a 4-stroke?



10 replies to this topic
  • JB

Posted August 24, 2000 - 12:45 PM

#1

I currently ride a CR125 and heard about the YZ 250F. It sounded like an awesome bike. Even though knowbody has ridden one, could somebody who rides a YZ-F please tell me what they like about it and why it would be a better choice for motocross than a 2-stroke

  • JPNTHUMP

Posted August 25, 2000 - 02:32 AM

#2

Ups
1- No pre-mix
2- Traction to the ground, not screaming/spinning for forward momentum
3- Tons fewer top end rebuilds
4- Torque, torque and more torque
5- No more slipping the clutch. Roll Gas on, roll gas off.
6- More torque and traction=Good starts
7- Great resale value
8- No more fouled plugs(almost never).
9- The power is a blast, not snappy like a 2 stroke, just generous and controlled.
10- It'll smoke your CR125. They say it's as fast as a 250 2 stroke. It may not last too long in the 125 class.....They never really said that the 400 was that much faster(on a track) than a 250 (even though they whined a little). It may change the rules if it's that much faster. Especially in the local amature classes. The 125 class is so huge.
11- It's louder.. hehehe :)))
12- Short run jumps are easier because of the added torque.
13- It'll idle for you without holding the throttle. (not too long though, it needs air through the radiators to keep it cool)

Downs
1- Slightly heavier
2- Louder
3- More torque= More Rear tire wear, more sprockets/chain wear.
4- If you blow it up, more costly to repair.
5- You can't slip the clutch like a 2 stroke, you'll wear out clutches.
6- Harder to start if you kill it in a race, on a hill, when your tired, or when it's just being finicky.
7- Can be easily flooded, & a pain in the ass impossible to start after flooding.
8- A short period of learning when transitioning from a 2 stroke.(quickly overcome)
9- They dont like to go slow, they'll stall. (lay off the rear brake a bit and keep the gas going into the turns(roll it on and off, dont snap it like a 2 stroke) The rear brake will drag the motor and stall it. Just technique is all. Part of the learning expierience.
10- At first you'll miss the 2 stroke, but you'll soon learn that you have better contol than you used to have on the CR.

The reason I'm replying is because I just switched from a CR250 to a YZ400F. I love it. But they're a world apart. To be honest, I love both bikes, and I wouldn't quit either one. Problem is I can only afford one. I'm thinking about another 2 stroke if I can earn a few extra bucks, but I'll definatly hold on to my thumper. There are ups and down with both, but downs are easily overcome through expierience on the bike. I have years on a 2 stroke, and weeks on a four stroke. Everyone here will push you towards the four. And they will all have good reasons I'm sure. My advice would be to go try one on (a buddy's bike) at the track, and see what you think. But remember, if you havn't riden one yet, you might hate the way it behaves at first. But believe me, it grows on you quickly with a little time. You can't judge it on one ride. Good luck in your decision.

  • JB

Posted August 26, 2000 - 03:59 PM

#3

Originally posted by JPNTHUMP:
Ups
1- No pre-mix
2- Traction to the ground, not screaming/spinning for forward momentum
3- Tons fewer top end rebuilds
4- Torque, torque and more torque
5- No more slipping the clutch. Roll Gas on, roll gas off.
6- More torque and traction=Good starts
7- Great resale value
8- No more fouled plugs(almost never).
9- The power is a blast, not snappy like a 2 stroke, just generous and controlled.
10- It'll smoke your CR125. They say it's as fast as a 250 2 stroke. It may not last too long in the 125 class.....They never really said that the 400 was that much faster(on a track) than a 250 (even though they whined a little). It may change the rules if it's that much faster. Especially in the local amature classes. The 125 class is so huge.
11- It's louder.. hehehe :)))
12- Short run jumps are easier because of the added torque.
13- It'll idle for you without holding the throttle. (not too long though, it needs air through the radiators to keep it cool)

Downs
1- Slightly heavier
2- Louder
3- More torque= More Rear tire wear, more sprockets/chain wear.
4- If you blow it up, more costly to repair.
5- You can't slip the clutch like a 2 stroke, you'll wear out clutches.
6- Harder to start if you kill it in a race, on a hill, when your tired, or when it's just being finicky.
7- Can be easily flooded, & a pain in the ass impossible to start after flooding.
8- A short period of learning when transitioning from a 2 stroke.(quickly overcome)
9- They dont like to go slow, they'll stall. (lay off the rear brake a bit and keep the gas going into the turns(roll it on and off, dont snap it like a 2 stroke) The rear brake will drag the motor and stall it. Just technique is all. Part of the learning expierience.
10- At first you'll miss the 2 stroke, but you'll soon learn that you have better contol than you used to have on the CR.

The reason I'm replying is because I just switched from a CR250 to a YZ400F. I love it. But they're a world apart. To be honest, I love both bikes, and I wouldn't quit either one. Problem is I can only afford one. I'm thinking about another 2 stroke if I can earn a few extra bucks, but I'll definatly hold on to my thumper. There are ups and down with both, but downs are easily overcome through expierience on the bike. I have years on a 2 stroke, and weeks on a four stroke. Everyone here will push you towards the four. And they will all have good reasons I'm sure. My advice would be to go try one on (a buddy's bike) at the track, and see what you think. But remember, if you havn't riden one yet, you might hate the way it behaves at first. But believe me, it grows on you quickly with a little time. You can't judge it on one ride. Good luck in your decision.


Hey, thanks for all the helpful information.
I like what I hear about the YZ-F's.

  • YZFWrench

Posted August 26, 2000 - 04:05 PM

#4

That's quite a jump from a 125 to the YZF- Your 125 will feel like a BMX bike compared to the YZF, weight-wise, and the power feels more like a 500 2-stroke. Try to bum a test ride on a YZF before you buy.

Phil
'00 YZ426

  • MikeOK

Posted August 26, 2000 - 04:38 PM

#5

I can't add much to what JB said except I have found the added weight of my 426 to be a plus in some things, like whoops and cruddy ruts. It soaks these up better. I'm coming from a YZ250 to this 426 and it did take a bit to get a handle on it, but I like it more every time I race it. The 250F should be an awesome bike, if I didn't already have this 426 I would be buying one as soon as they hit the shelves. There was an article recently on www.off-road.com and they predicted all MX bikes would be 4 strokes in 5 years. After I got used to mine I can actually do most things better on it than my old 250 except for real tight tracks where the weight works you so much...

Mike

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  • JPNTHUMP

Posted August 26, 2000 - 08:29 PM

#6

I agree with mikeok, I'm not nessesaryily faster on the 400 then my CR250, but deffinatly more in control. Whoops are a breeze. My 400 soaks up square edges tons better. Of course, CR suspensions were never very supple in square edge bumps. The forks on my 96 were very unforgiving. The thing thats best about the 400 is the way the power comes on. My cr was a bottle rocket. Once you cracked in on the pipe, it would yank your arms out the sockets. Arm pump was a b**ch. With the 400, you still have the power on tap, and it's still instant, but it's not abrupt like my CR250 was. I must say in respect for Honda though, I havn't seen a better "built" bike yet. There is a suprise anouncement that Honda's gonna make very soon now (September). Watch for a new 4 stroke.

  • Guest_Guest_*

Posted August 27, 2000 - 05:05 PM

#7

JB; I have been riding since 1978 and have been a die hard 2 stroker, raced Dist 36 mx for many years and even could win a few bucks in the expert class now and then. Not difficult to understand when the alternative was an XR,DR,or KLX, or the price tag of the more recent Husky's or Husaberg. There is an older but familiar CR250 in the garage next to my YZF. Obviously if the CR was as new as the YZF it would be more fair but let me say that since I don't restrict myself to track riding, I can only find one reason to buy another CR or whatever. I have to agree 100% with what all the other replies said and have a couple points. (Did anyone mention the extra torque)? he he. The noise is a personal issue for me because one of my favorite riding areas, an ohv park near Auburn, now has a 101 db sound level maximum limit. The park is not all that spectacular but it is close to home, has a nice sandy motocross track and I could go burn some laps, get a good workout, chat with fellow riders and be home in a few hours. But not with the YZF. It's too loud unless I put a cork in it so that I have to keep checking to see if I am on that XR. ( No offense to you XR owners). A great piece of my enjoyment, now with a kink. Do I keep the CR to ride this one track, or let that bit of fun fade away? I didn't intend on bringing gloom but what can we do about this guys and girls? How many more riding areas pop up with a sound level requirement until we are screaming back to our favorite 2 strokes only to find them extinct due to our facination with this new breed of machine and technology? I sort of agree with what MIKEOK quoted re garding all dirtbikes will be 4 strokes in a few years, but where will we ride them? In the desert and deep woods? Fun but limited. Just a point to keep in mind JB depending on where you ride. The YZF is really a cool machine and I like mine more each time I ride. Maybe a box full of exaust systems (and horsepower levels) is all the new rage. Let us know what you think JB when you swindle someone out of their YZF for a test ride. See Ya.

  • JB

Posted August 27, 2000 - 05:34 PM

#8

Thanks for all the helpful info on the YZ-F's. I can see now what the advantages/disadvantages are now. I still have a couple of questions about the YZ-F's(and other racing 4-strokes in common):

1- I understand the YZ-F's would whip the 2-strokes at the start, but could the 250F keep up with the rest(of the 125's) until the end?

2- Are the stock pipes on the YZ-F's as quiet or quieter than all aftermarket pipes?

3- What is the top end like of a YZ-F compared to a 2-stroke?

Thanks

  • JPNTHUMP

Posted August 28, 2000 - 03:09 AM

#9

Top end.....Hmmmm....or top speed...

To quote the latest issue of Dirt Bike Magazine on 2000 model bikes..

CR125 69 MPH
CR250 77 MPH
CR500 89 MPH
YZ426F 88 MPH

Now, those are just numbers right. My 400F will pull well away from my buddies YZ250 effortlessly rolling the throttle. It's simaler to open class top end power. I can hold the throttle open just wide enough to hold off a 250 in an open strait and still have plenty of throttle left.

In other words, it's got plenty of top end. As for the YZ250F. It'll have it too. Look at the RPMs that thing will turn. It will have all you need to be competitive against 125s and then some. They sound and feel like thy're slower than a 2 stroke, but don't be fooled, you'll be moving faster than you think, you'll head into corners too hot at first. Make sure you bleed the front brake well, you'll need it.

Oh yeah, theres nothing really quiet about a YZF, but they do have quieted down pipes available out there. Most tone down the power a small amount though. There have been some shootouts in the last couple of months magazines that break down the pipes. And yes, some are noted as quieter.


[This message has been edited by JPNTHUMP (edited 08-28-2000).]

  • jdiamond

Posted August 28, 2000 - 05:06 PM

#10

JB,

I purchased my 00 426 in May of this year. Been out of racing for 15 years and wanted to get back in. I'm 38, 5'6" and 160 pounds. I love this thing but I ride with guys in the +30 class and cant handle the weight. It like having a 8 year old riding with you, CR125 @ 193lbs and YZ426 @ 250lbs plus. When the 250F comes it should be alot better. I actually just purchased a 01 CR125 this week. Good Luck

  • rsilvers

Posted August 30, 2000 - 08:28 AM

#11

I had my DRZ-400S up to 99 MPH this week in stock form. Note that this has taller gearing than the offroad only DRZ-400E. I am sure I can hit 100+ the next time. Also got 60.4 miles per gallon with a mix of highway and offroad riding (3/4 highway, 1/4 offroad, but always heavy on the throttle).


Originally posted by JPNTHUMP:
Top end.....Hmmmm....or top speed...

To quote the latest issue of Dirt Bike Magazine on 2000 model bikes..

CR125 69 MPH
CR250 77 MPH
CR500 89 MPH
YZ426F 88 MPH

Now, those are just numbers right. My 400F will pull well away from my buddies YZ250 effortlessly rolling the throttle. It's simaler to open class top end power. I can hold the throttle open just wide enough to hold off a 250 in an open strait and still have plenty of throttle left.

In other words, it's got plenty of top end. As for the YZ250F. It'll have it too. Look at the RPMs that thing will turn. It will have all you need to be competitive against 125s and then some. They sound and feel like thy're slower than a 2 stroke, but don't be fooled, you'll be moving faster than you think, you'll head into corners too hot at first. Make sure you bleed the front brake well, you'll need it.

Oh yeah, theres nothing really quiet about a YZF, but they do have quieted down pipes available out there. Most tone down the power a small amount though. There have been some shootouts in the last couple of months magazines that break down the pipes. And yes, some are noted as quieter.


[This message has been edited by JPNTHUMP (edited 08-28-2000).]







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