WR450 2003 oil spewing out of dipstick

[Johnyrrr]

Ok I just bought a new to me 450 today. I test ride the thing around a parking lot where I met the guy I was buying it from and we go to check the oil and its spewing over as soon as we take the dipstick out??? The bike was barley warm and it supposedly had 15w50 in it and it has sat for a couple of months. we wait a minutues or two and pull the dipstick again and it starts spewing out the dipstick hole on the top of the frame....What gives?

[grayracer513]

Overfilled.

Someone probably let the bike sit a day or two or three, and when they found out there was no oil on the dipstick, they added some. Then, once the bike started and ran, the oil that had drained to the crankcase while it sat was returned to the tank, resulting in the condition you have now.

The bike has a Dry Sump Oiling System. Oil is filled into the crankcase, while the actual oil storage during operation is the frame oil tank, where the dipstick is. On the steel frame bikes, oil will drain fairly quickly from the frame to the crankcase, and may show on the dip stick as being significantly lower than normal after as little as 8 hours.

Oil should always be checked within 10 minutes after shutoff to avoid inaccurate readings.

[Johnyrrr]

thank you, i changed it out to 10w30 for now with the correct amount and seems to be fine:banana:

[PBDBLUE]

thank you, i changed it out to 10w30 for now with the correct amount and seems to be fine:banana:

I hope that isn't automotive 10w30 oil. Almost all 10W30 automotive oil contains friction modifiers that will damage the clutch. If the bottle has the "Energy Conserving" emblem on it drain it right away and refill with proper oil. You may want to even flush it a few times. There are a bunch of threads on oil preference so I won't go into what to use. Rotella T is one but do a search and you'll find more info than you want.

[grayracer513]

Almost all 10W30 automotive oil contains friction modifiers that will damage the clutch. If the bottle has the "Energy Conserving" emblem on it drain it right away and refill with proper oil.

That isn't entirely true. In the first place, while it is true that oils labeled EC II may cause clutch problems, it doesn't follow that they will. Still, they aren't recommended.

Interesting that you warn against automotive oils and then recommend one. The number of automotive oils labeled EC II is nowhere near "almost all", but it is becoming more common. The real problem with automotive and commercial (C grade oils) is that most of them are not blended for use as a gear lube, and will not retain their viscosity for very long at all in the WRF/YZF engines because of this. Rotella, for example, while it is otherwise a very good lubricant, will drop below its labeled grade in as little as 2 hours or less. If you use it, you should change it often, probably every ride.

See page 9 of this study: http://www.amsoil.com/lit/G-2156.pdf

One concern I have is that you used a 10w-30. 30 wt is not recommended for outside temps above 70 degrees, and even if the weather stays cold, it's pretty light inside a hot engine and trans. A 10w-40 will cover you down to the same -10 degrees while protecting the engine to outside temps as high as 110.

[PBDBLUE]

I didn't mean to imply that all automotive oils are bad. Just to avoid EC2 oils. There are very few 10W30 oils that are not EC2 so that's what caught my attention. Lot's of people run Rotella T, Mobil 1 15W50, etc with no ill effects.

[Johnyrrr]

It was Casteroil GTX, I have run this oil in many bikes with wet clutchs before with no ill effects. "Sport Rider magazine" even did a write up on an old 1993 CBR 900 that went 100K on this very same oil. I live in Michigan and its getting cold, that is why I chose this light wieght oil and also it was in the garage and I absolutly needed to Ride the bike last night because I just brought it home only hours ago.

[byggd]

Rotella, for example, while it is otherwise a very good lubricant, will drop below its labeled grade in as little as 2 hours or less. If you use it, you should change it often, probably every ride.

Are you talking Rotella full synthetic?

[grayracer513]

Are you talking Rotella full synthetic?

Either one of the two.

[byggd]

Either one of the two.

The PDF didn't list Rotella full synthetic. Which product tested is = to Rotella 5w40 FS? ?

[grayracer513]

Amsoil's test only compared MC oils with other MC oils. I would like to see some of the more popularly touted automotive and truck oils tested as well, but I'm not paying for the lab work, so...

Based on the used oils analyses I've seen, Rotella (either of them) compares roughly to Lucas, Royal Purple, or Valvoline 4 stroke *w-40 in so far as it's viscosity retention.

[byggd]

Good thing I change it every 2 rides then eh??

[grayracer513]

Good thing I change it every 2 rides then eh??

The UOA's suggest changing every ride (1-3 hours) would be wiser. It just doesn't stay in grade well.

[PBDBLUE]

So does anyone have any meaningful REAL data on M1 15W50? Or is all this just internet lore?

Edited November 2, 2009 by PBDBLUE

[grayracer513]

So does anyone have any meaningful REAL data on M1 15W50? Or is all this just internet lore?

I know that it's significantly better than Rotella in several ways, including shear stability, but may not be as good in that regard as M1 V-Twin (the 20w-50 equivalent of M1 Racing 4T 10w-40).

What you can always do is test your own used oil. Blackstone Labs offers test kits for free, charging you a fee only when you send a sample in. The cost is around $20, and you'll get a full report on the oil's condition.

You'll get complete instructions as to how to take the sample, but one thing in particular that's important to pay attention to if the oil's viscosity is going to be something you're looking at: take the sample only after the engine has been run for AT LEAST 30 minutes since the last cold start up, and preferably, since a start up of any kind, since fuel residue will often reach the oil supply in quantities that may be sufficient to affect the results.

By sampling your own oil at your own change interval, you will know for certain.

[PBDBLUE]

Understood but just curious. I have searched the internet far and wide but have yet to find anything documented on Mobil 15W50. Amsoil's own test on 10W30 automotive oils shows that while Mobil 1 is not at the top of the field it does have a relatively good shear rating of 3.35cp. Well within grade so I guess I am a little skeptical of all this talk about how bad Mobil 1 is with respect to shear. Perhaps the 15W50 behaves differently but I've yet to find any data to back that up. I suppose I could run a sample but I'm really not that concerned. I've run tens of thousands of miles with the stuff and have yet to have a gearbox or bearing failure.

[123BigcoopDawg576]

I am sorry to completely go off topic here but I cant help but think of the Castrol commercial where the guys says,

[grayracer513]

I am a little skeptical of all this talk about how bad Mobil 1 is with respect to shear.

I must have missed that, and I know I've said no such thing myself, mostly because I don't have on hand any facts on which to base such a statement, or the contrary, for that matter. I was speaking only of Rotella, and of the general deficiency of most automotive engine oils with regard to shear stability. The testing I remember (vaguely) was a user UOA or two that seemed to support the notion that M1 EP was fairly durable, certainly more so than Rotella.

I also couldn't find the Amsoil sheet on 10w-30 oils, so I can't speak to that test specifically. One thing to bear in mind is that there are a few different ways of testing for shear stable viscosity. There is a certain level of shear stability that's acceptable in an engine oil, and a tougher standard for transmission lube, because of the greater shear forces at work in a gear box. The D-6278 test used in the motorcycle test is very tough, but is typically used on gear lubes, so it was applied in the MC test. I can't say what test was used in the report you mention, but it's likely to have been one focused more on the level of shear resistance an engine oil is expected to have.

That doesn't mean M1 EP will fare poorly in a transmission, but it also doesn't say it won't. Pending better info, my mind is open on that concern.