Posted 19 April 2008 - 12:41 PM
Posted 19 April 2008 - 01:37 PM
The idiot behind the wheel. I think it boils down to people driving them beyond both theirs and the machines capability combined with a false sense of security that since it's like a car they can't get hurt.
Posted 19 April 2008 - 08:35 PM
Posted 20 April 2008 - 04:18 AM
But I have a few questions:
1) look at this you tube vido http://www.youtube.c....eature=related What was this driver doing that was crazy?
2)PRETEND, that Yamaha knew in the maufacturing of the Rhino they could tip over. Just suppose one of their corp executives rolled one and broke his leg. Just suppose the Yamaha engineers cautioned their bosses of the tip over danger. But Yamaha went forward with the Rhino. Would that change your feelings?
Please remember....I am not taking sides I am just wondering and asking the "what if" question.
I do have to admit I have seen some REAL crazy riders on the Rhino on you tube and they have pushed the vehicle WAY beyond its design.
Posted 20 April 2008 - 08:06 AM
It said the video ID was invalid.
Posted 20 April 2008 - 08:14 AM
Posted 20 April 2008 - 04:06 PM
I will try to figure what is the deal with that you tube video.
Posted 20 April 2008 - 08:41 PM
once it rolls you can see the dude stick his leg out.
reminds me of when my dad rolled over his leg on my ATC back in 1983.
Posted 24 April 2008 - 10:40 AM
If you do that on a regular utility atv without leaning really hard, it would do the same thing.
Posted 24 April 2008 - 04:16 PM
The J-ROD said:
I've done that exact thing on a utility quad with the same result. Didn't get hurt but it was definitely MY fault.
Posted 04 May 2008 - 11:42 PM
BTW I would expect a bike or quad to flip over in a similar situation.
Come on people, take some personal responsibility!!!
Posted 11 May 2008 - 05:23 AM
Yamaha knew they had a problem with it so they retro-fitted doors for them to keep your legs inside during a roll-over.
I know 2 people who rolled them over when they first got them.
But that being said I love mine and use it all the time but you do have to respect it.
Posted 14 May 2008 - 07:56 PM
Posted 29 May 2008 - 06:40 AM
I agree that the roll-bars may give some a false sense of security, but that's the rider's fault.. not Yamaha.
Posted 14 July 2008 - 09:57 PM
But.......all the suits against Yamaha are because the DESIGN is faulty AND Yamaha Execs were warned by their people in the design process. The wheels are too close together, it is too high off the ground, the rear wheels are locked together (no slip diff) there is no padding on the roll bar. Their SSF (static stability factor) is way too low, it would NEVER pass in a SUV, jeep or car. http://www.safercar....fd17898RCRD#ssf
I am NOT a lawyer, but I can prove that what I am writing is 100% true.
In the past 3 years there have been OVER 75 suits against Yamaha for the Rhino rolling over, many or on the Orange County Clerk of Courts web site: https://ocapps.occou...rc=case_src_dtl Do a search under “business” for “Yamaha”.
NOT ONE SUIT HAS YAMAHA MADE A MOTION TO THROW OUT OR HAVE DISMISSED. EVERY SUIT IS EITHER IN PROGRESS OR HAS BEEN SETTLED, IN FAVOR IF THE INJURED PERSON.
The real interesting thing is this.......EVERY suit against Yamaha, they (Yamaha) gets a “Protective Order”. This order protects Yamaha when they turn over documents to the opposing lawyer. The documents HAVE to be returned or destroyed with in 30 days after the suit is finished. Some of the documents are the amount and degree of testing Yamaha did (if any). Some of the documents are testimony from the engineers in the research & development stages. There is testimony from about 20 different Yamaha executives with damaging comments, including Yamaha’ in house lawyer Roy Watson. Also included are any possible safety features designed but not installed (like doors). This is a fraction of what is in there. IF Yamaha is so squeaky clean, why not fight these suits and set a pattern? Their current pattern is to settle these cases AND to keep their documents quite. Why file motions to keep SELECT documents secret?
Two engineering firms http://www.renfroe.com/ and http://www.sealcorp....-testing.htmlin have proven that IF Yamaha spaced the wheels 4” further apart instead of tipping over at 12 mph, it will tip over at 30 MPH. (Call them and ask)
The present of Yamaha of France Jean Claude Olivier (an accomplished racer) tipped over and broke HIS leg.......on flat ground. Then he made every Rhino that came in to France have doors (early design, leg minders, diagonal like bars).
Jeep was sued because they had NO padding on the Roll Bars, they started padding them now. The SFI foundation has written roll bar padding standards (originally for cars and jeeps). Specification 45.1; 45.1.1; & 45.2.1: written 2/2/1995 was written because of the Jeep deal. Yamaha has chosen to ignore it. The roll bars have landed on atleast 13 peoples heads killing them. http://www.sfifoundation.com/
Yamaha says do NOT drive the Rhino on black top (or cement), they also say to be very careful on FLAT ground going SLOW speeds. When, where, and how are you to ride them. Yes, Yamaha has admitted they they do tip over on FLAT GROUND AT SLOW SPEEDS.
The reason I know all of this is because my 10 year old daughters skull was crushed (LITERALLY) when a Rhino she was a passenger in tipped. The roll bar landed on her head. The police determined the driver was only going 10 to 12 MPH. They reconstructed the scene, I have the pictures of the land and tire indentations, he was making a gradual turn. This was investigated VERY throually for about 2 months by sheriffs, accident reconstruction specialists, and prosecuting attorney, and grand jury. The conclusion was he was not being reckless in any way.
I personally have talked with the parents of 12 kids who have been killed the EXACT same way. When you see your 10 year old unconscious on a field and thick blood is pouring out of her ears and nose. Then when 24 hours later you have to allow the hospital to turn off the life support and explain to her 14 yr old and 8 yr old brothers that this is the end of their sister, you want answers. When this happens to your family you dig, and dig and dig until either you give up because there is nothing to find OR you find answers.
As I said I feel we all need to be accountable for our actions.......including Yamaha.
Posted 14 July 2008 - 10:16 PM
1. Was your daughter wearing a helmet?
2. Any gear?
3. Safety belts?
4. Was the operator experienced and of age to be running the machine?
5. Were any abrubt maeuvers made at speed such as the one shown in the video that was posted? (It seems that the false sense of security provided by this machine with its roll bars and "car-like" feel would lead an inexperienced driver to think that at slow speeds abrupt maneuvers should be "easy" and without consequences.) We all know that on a quad of any type, leaning is required to help the vehicle turn and reduce the chance of a rollover. There's nothing different with the Rhino. It's probably in fact exaggerated in the Rhino given the top heaviness of the roll cage sticking way up in the air.
I've got a hard time swallowing the "it's Yamaha's fault" pill. Yamaha designed a machine that could be used to pull trailers, go reasonably quickly in a straight line and be a fun, useful workhorse. It's not a porsche. It needs to be driven and used with utmost respect and training just like any other OHV, including bikes. Blaming Yamaha for a freak accident that may or may not have been able to be prevented seems wrong to me.
These are all simply my opinions and I hope we can leave it at that and continue with the thought provoking discussion.
Again johnsand, I offer you my most heartfelt sorrow for the loss of your daughter and wish you peace in her memory. I can't even begin to imagine what youve gone through. Godspeed to you and yours.
Posted 15 July 2008 - 10:30 AM
1. It's Much Bigger than a regular ATV 2.It has a roll cage small SUV comes to mind... Now if you were to roll your SUV whilst off road, would you go out and sue the manufacturer? My point is ALL ATV's Dirt Bikes and Jetski's for that matter are DANGEROUS depending how you operate them. LOGIC says don't operate the vehicle irresponsibly. If you want to be an ass and go beyond a vehicles limits, then you and the vehilce are gonna get hurt.
EG. a few years back i saw a guy doing donuts on the beach in his pickup truck, needless to say he managed to flip the thing and crushed his arm through the open window.. . How many guys try and Sue a manufacturer if they flip theier quads? You Yanks, seem to be notorious for farcical law suits and BS claims against manufacturers, play with fire and EXPECT to be burned.
Posted 15 July 2008 - 10:38 AM