All California Riders



23 replies to this topic
  • DaveJ

Posted June 21, 2000 - 10:11 AM

#1

I'm sure most of you are aware that the California Air Resource Board (CARB) is imposing standards on off-highway vehicles that has resulted in the red and green sticker riding program.

This requires that all off highway vehicles that are either not certified with CARB by the manufacture, or produce more than 1.2 hydrocarbons (HC) and 15.0 parts of Carbon Monoxide (C0) will have either a "3" or "C" in the eight character of the VIN number.

Some of us have been fortunate enough to have accidental issuance of green stickers for bikes that are only suppose to have red ones. I have confirmed with both the DMV and CARB that these were accidental, but will not be re-called.

Today, I contacted CARB to investigate other options for green sticker certification. I was informed that many of the 4 stroke and 2 stroke model actually pass the standards that have been set (as listed above) but the manufacture choose not to certify the bike with CARB for green sticker operation. This, apparently, keeps an owner of a clean running bike, or an owner who modifies a bike for cleaner running, from processing the bike through an emissions test, and then applying for valid green sticker.

So what's my point?

Well, I'm looking for advice as where to turn to next. Would it be best to verify that the YZ and WR 4-strokes are meeting these standards, and then go to Yamaha of North America with the request for certification? Or, are there other legal options? Do you guys feel that the AMA or other groups could help with this? Is there any legal ground that can be taken against CARB or Yamaha that would force them to comply.

You're thoughts on this matter would be very helpful, as well as any additional information or contacts in the industry that you feel could provide additional assistance.

Thanks in advance for your help.

PS - for those that ride the Hollister ranch, they are still allowing red-sticker bikes to enter. See their web site for details.

Dave Johnson
Campbell, CA.
YZ426

  • holeshot

Posted June 21, 2000 - 10:45 AM

#2

I received a green sticker for my '00 426 also. Shshshshshsh....quiet - don't tell anyone.

  • eBayThumper

Posted April 23, 2001 - 04:16 PM

#3

Hey Dave,

Have you found out anything more about this? I just got my RED sticker in the mail and just about crapped! I knew there was a chance of this happening and now I guess I'm screwed.

I have heard of some creative ways to get the green sticker but don't know for sure what to do now. Do I sell my brand new yz426 or what?

Please let me know if you (or anyone reading this) has any suggestions. I cannot handle not riding this bike... :)

thanks,
J

  • DaveJ

Posted April 23, 2001 - 05:25 PM

#4

Ebay,

Well...nothing has really changed.

When I purchased the bike I received a red sticker. I went to one DMV and told them I lost my "registration" and they gave me another red sticker.

I then went to another DMV with the same story and they gave me a green one. Two of my friends pulled this off as well.

Then the boys in Sacramento sent me a letter telling me that I received the sticker in error and that I was to send it back.

But, I have yet to find any time to remove and trade it in for a red sticker since I've been too busy riding.

In addition to this, I never found any actual law that you can be cited for in using a red sticker. CARB sets the standard, but there's no law in the Penal, Health and Safety, or Traffic Code that can enforce it.

Perhaps my resources were dated, but it seems like I remember reading something about this as well.

In either event, the rangers in my area won't open the gates to red sticker bikes during certain months of the year.

Now...there are many other means of getting a green sticker, which I'll gladly discuss off-line.

DaveJ

  • Guest_Guest_*

Posted April 23, 2001 - 06:51 PM

#5

DaveJ:
I would be interested to hear about your other ways to recieve a Green sticker off line. Email me somtime at sirhk100@hotmail.com I did that opps, I lost my sticker and the lady tried to give me a red sticker and I flat out told her that I should get a green one and not a red one and she said okay so out I walked with my green sticker for $2 or what ever it was. I'm hoping that works again but if it doesn't then what?
Khris

------------------
When in doubt, GAS IT!

  • yzernie

Posted April 23, 2001 - 07:27 PM

#6

In theory this is what could happen.

If you ride in a green sticker area, the rangers or whoever checks the registrations is supposed to inspect the bike for the correct "check" digit. This digit is contained within the V.I.N. number of the motorcycle.

If the ranger finds that you are in violation of the off highway registration requirements, he could remove your green sticker. He could issue you a citation for the registration violation.

Chances are they won't cite but there are some letter of the law rangers out there.

yzernie

  • eBayThumper

Posted April 24, 2001 - 06:26 AM

#7

What is the world coming to? I mean...you can race the 1/4 mile in a vehicle that burns gallons per foot but can't put around on a single piston! This should change soon or people will stop buying new bikes and resort to the pre-ban years.

Anyway, I am into the alternative and creative workarounds to this dilemma. Dave, please e-me at jjlacy@pacbell.net.

I think there are enough recreational riders to have some impact on this issue. I will look further into this matter and let you all know if I come up with anything we can do...remember all of you not in CA who think this won't affect you...what happens in CA eventually rolls across the country...

Next thing you know we'll be licensing our lawnmowers, but not if they're new because those won't be legal either!

Sorry for the 'rant'

J out...

  • DaveJ

Posted April 24, 2001 - 09:07 PM

#8

Well...we live in a very crowded world. And if we all drove cars from the 60's and used our fireplaces to heat our homes, most of us would not live past the age of 50.

Changes that make our planet a cleaner and healthier place to live are the right changes. However, mandatory blanket bans are not the way to do this.

I've read that a 2 stroke bike produces as much emissions as 180 modern day cars. And although there are not as many dirt bikes as cars, it's enough to cause problems.

The fix is to mandate a standard, then allow the technology from the manufactures to meet it. Then encourage people, mainly financially, to update to the new technology.

This has worked out well in the auto sector, however, there were some pains along the way.

How quickly can manufactures meet the standard? At what cost to the consumer? Can people afford it? Should it be applicable to certain states or all states? When new technology is implemented, what about the remaining 10% that now cause 90% of the smog?

Well, unless you been asleep for the last few years, the only reason we have the technology of the YZFs is because of California. This is the only state in the world were laws on emissions happen first. In fact, just about everything happens in California first, then filters out into the rest of the world.

If you live in Iowa and think you're safe from dirt bike emission laws, go climb under your car and take a look at the device behind the header pipe. That too came from California.

So I do support clean air, but not when the decisions of technology are being made by radical environmentalists. Until the other side takes a stance, it's going to be bumpy for a few years.

While this takes place, I can justify moving around the law to keep my hobby alive.

DaveJ

  • yzernie

Posted April 24, 2001 - 08:33 PM

#9

When I purchased my 01 426 from my dealer, they sent the paperwork to DMV. I subsequently received a green sticker for my 01 426.

My concern would be for you guys who fraudulently obtain the green stickers. DMV has very strict parameters concerning fraud. If, and I say if, you were to be discovered the penalties are severe.

Your motorcycle could be seized as evidence. You could face felony charges for fraud and perjury. There is probably more, but, after loosing my bike and getting arrested--that should be enough.

As I said above, there are some rangers who are very strict too. They are such jerks that I would say they are a part of some radical ecological group.

For me, it is not worth the chance. For you...you're on your own.

yzernie

  • DaveJ

Posted April 25, 2001 - 12:40 PM

#10

yzernie - are you saying this happened to you?

If so, was the only premise of the arrest and confiscation the issue of the green sticker, or was there something else involved?

And if the DMV sent you a green sticker, the ranger does not have the right to take it from you.

Ya know, there's a big difference between citing and prosecuting.

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • yzernie

Posted April 25, 2001 - 05:15 PM

#11

Thankfully this did not happen to me.

The issue is that if you are not supposed to have a green sticker, they can take it from you. It makes no difference if it was originally issued to you by DMV or if it was fraudulently obtained.

They would have to prove that you received the sticker by fraud and that is very easy. All they would have to do is research the registration from prior years and determine that a red sticker was issued to the bike.
You would then have to explain how that green sticker got on your bike.

The chances of this happening are remote but, certainly possible.

yzernie

  • eBayThumper

Posted April 25, 2001 - 08:02 PM

#12

I am just curious where you heard that "they can take your bike."

Is this a fact, and if so where did you read it?

J

  • yzernie

Posted April 25, 2001 - 10:09 PM

#13

Originally posted by eBayThumper:
I am just curious where you heard that "they can take your bike."

Is this a fact, and if so where did you read it?

J


It is in the Evidence Code for the State of California. Any "fruit of the crme" (which is the bike) can be taken as evidence.

Ernie

  • DaveJ

Posted April 26, 2001 - 12:09 AM

#14

Well..that's a bit of a stretch.

I'm not sure what sort of crime you had in mind since the DMV is the one that issued the sticker. It's not like it's a sticker from some other bike.

In my case, if they call the number up, it will show that it's assigned to a 2000 YZ426. No crime there.

And as I mentioned earlier, I was never able to find any law that you could be cited for, so I'm not sure what authority they think they would have.

I'd be impressed if someone could actually find me the vehicle or penal code that covers the usage of a red sticker bike.

  • AngryCandy

Posted April 26, 2001 - 05:03 AM

#15

Originally posted by DaveJ:
In fact, just about everything happens in California first, then filters out into the rest of the world.
DaveJ


Thank God that is NOT true. The rest of the country is realizing that the CA liberals and the clusterfu**s they implement (as evidenced here by the 'sticker' debacle) will never work on a large scale implementation.

The Calif. car emissions have been more stringent than any other state for years and no one else is implementing their standards.

The latest example of the how NOT to plan for the future is the power crisis in CA.

Thankfully, Dave and EbayThump, you are dead wrong in thinking that the rest of the country cares to follow California's lead.

  • racer629

Posted May 01, 2001 - 06:02 PM

#16

Hi guys,
Please forgive my ignorance for what I am about to ask; What is the difference between a red, green, and purple sticker for that matter. We don't have any of that stuff here in Ohio. I am familiar with CARB, and what they are doing. But are these stickers like the ones that they put on our # plates for practice, or something completly different?
Why don't we make ones with markers, and go wherever we want? Hack!Hack!
Or are they "VERY VERY" special stickers?
Thanks for the info.
Todd.

  • DaveJ

Posted May 01, 2001 - 09:38 PM

#17

race629 - the stickers are like stick-on license plates. About 2x4 inches. Not something you can easily duplicate. Check out the following link.
http://www.dmv.ca.go...acts/ffvr16.htm

Angrycandy - You'll have to expand your reading beyond the Big Mac wrappers at McDonalds before you can start a debate with me on the subject of laws and lifestyles originating from California. Let me know when you're ready.

  • racer629

Posted May 02, 2001 - 03:29 AM

#18

Thanks dave.

  • hodaphile

Posted May 02, 2001 - 11:59 AM

#19

Dave,

If the "F" technology came about because of California, then why are they subject to the red stickers???


Originally posted by DaveJ:
Well...we live in a very crowded world. And if we all drove cars from the 60's and used our fireplaces to heat our homes, most of us would not live past the age of 50.

Changes that make our planet a cleaner and healthier place to live are the right changes. However, mandatory blanket bans are not the way to do this.

I've read that a 2 stroke bike produces as much emissions as 180 modern day cars. And although there are not as many dirt bikes as cars, it's enough to cause problems.

The fix is to mandate a standard, then allow the technology from the manufactures to meet it. Then encourage people, mainly financially, to update to the new technology.

This has worked out well in the auto sector, however, there were some pains along the way.

How quickly can manufactures meet the standard? At what cost to the consumer? Can people afford it? Should it be applicable to certain states or all states? When new technology is implemented, what about the remaining 10% that now cause 90% of the smog?

Well, unless you been asleep for the last few years, the only reason we have the technology of the YZFs is because of California. This is the only state in the world were laws on emissions happen first. In fact, just about everything happens in California first, then filters out into the rest of the world.

If you live in Iowa and think you're safe from dirt bike emission laws, go climb under your car and take a look at the device behind the header pipe. That too came from California.

So I do support clean air, but not when the decisions of technology are being made by radical environmentalists. Until the other side takes a stance, it's going to be bumpy for a few years.

While this takes place, I can justify moving around the law to keep my hobby alive.

DaveJ



  • Sparky_So_Cal

Posted May 03, 2001 - 08:35 AM

#20

I have been doing some research and I found the website where all the CARB stuff for CA is located w/ all doc's. I emailed them and they informed me that Yamaha never submitted any of the "F" series for emissions testing. Now I don't know if they would fail immediatly or not. If anybody wants to read the docs and check for updates, email me and I will send you the link.

I am new user and REALLY enjoy the information I have come accross..........





Related Content

Forums
Photo
Motocross

Thinking about Yamaha 250... by Arctic Pride


Dirt Bike   Special Interest Forums   Pro Racing
  • Hot  491 replies
Forums
Photo

Snake pit oct 30th by The Anvil


Dirt Bike   Dirt Bike Regional Discussion   California
  • Hot  293 replies
Forums
Photo

Is it worth it? (Cam and High compression piston) by macgi77


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Honda   CRF 150/230 F/L
  • Hot  36 replies
Forums
Photo

YZ450F 03 Sparks driving me crazy by SirAttard


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Yamaha   YZ 400/426/450
  • 5 replies
Forums
Photo

James Stewart back on a YZ450F by YamaLink


Dirt Bike   Special Interest Forums   Pro Racing
  • Hot  47 replies
 
x

Join Our Community!

Even if you don't want to post, registered members get access to tools that make finding & following the good stuff easier.

If you enjoyed reading about "" here in the ThumperTalk archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join ThumperTalk today!

The views and opinions expressed on this page are strictly those of the author, and have not been reviewed or approved by ThumperTalk.