New 110cc won't start!


44 replies to this topic
  • ThumperOne

Posted September 08, 2009 - 05:14 PM

#1

Purchased a chinese 110cc from CA for my son to get him started in dirt biking, and it won't start! Shipped the carb and starter relay back to seller and they confirmed they are not the problem. Getting spark and fuel. Battery checked and good. Electric starter was bench tested and okay, but will not turn over with battery (nothing happens when the starter button is pushed). Will not start by kicking or pushing. Appears to be electrical and seller has no other suggestions. Any help? Thank you!!

  • NVR2L8

Posted September 08, 2009 - 05:27 PM

#2

Not exactly sure what you mean by "won't turn over" does it not fire or do you not get anything when you hit the e-start? If you're hitting the e-start and nothing is happening (I'm assuming this is it) I would trace the wiring looking for it grounding out somewhere, either between the battery and switch or the switch and starter. Can you bump start it? I would try bump starting it (if you haven't already) if that does the trick you'll have narrowwed it down to probably being a grounding problem.

  • R-Dubya

Posted September 08, 2009 - 05:30 PM

#3

check the CDI. They're easy to get to on chinese bikes, just look up under the seat. Also, on the kickstart, try pushing it down all the way then slowly letting it back up. Then push it down until it catches, and then kick it down. Sorry if that sounds complicated but that's the way it is with my old one. If you try to kick it through too hard, it doesn't catch. Don't kick it like it's a big bike lol.

  • NVR2L8

Posted September 08, 2009 - 05:31 PM

#4

OK just re-read your post, have you tried hot wiring the battery to the starter? Checked the kill switch to make sure it's not bad/staying grounded?

  • R-Dubya

Posted September 08, 2009 - 05:32 PM

#5

Oh and btw don't try to bump start it. That proves nothing, because chinese bikes aren't "any gear start". All that will happen is the back tire will lock up lol

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 08, 2009 - 07:09 PM

#6

Not exactly sure what you mean by "won't turn over" does it not fire or do you not get anything when you hit the e-start? If you're hitting the e-start and nothing is happening (I'm assuming this is it) I would trace the wiring looking for it grounding out somewhere, either between the battery and switch or the switch and starter. Can you bump start it? I would try bump starting it (if you haven't already) if that does the trick you'll have narrowwed it down to probably being a grounding problem.


Thanks for the quick response! The starter does have a green (I assume ) ground wire connected to it.
The seller does not have a wiring schematic available to double check all of the connections.
I hear no clicking sound from the starter relay when the electric start button is pushed. I jumped the starter relay by placing a screwdriver over the terminals with no spark and again nothing happened. Shouldn't it have sparked? Should it be replaced?

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 08, 2009 - 07:10 PM

#7

check the CDI. They're easy to get to on chinese bikes, just look up under the seat. Also, on the kickstart, try pushing it down all the way then slowly letting it back up. Then push it down until it catches, and then kick it down. Sorry if that sounds complicated but that's the way it is with my old one. If you try to kick it through too hard, it doesn't catch. Don't kick it like it's a big bike lol.


I'll try it tomorrow, thanks !!

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 08, 2009 - 07:12 PM

#8

OK just re-read your post, have you tried hot wiring the battery to the starter? Checked the kill switch to make sure it's not bad/staying grounded?


I did remove the starter, checked it out and connected to a battery and it spun just fine.
Can you tell me how to check the kill switch/staying grounded?
Thanks again!

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 08, 2009 - 07:13 PM

#9

Oh and btw don't try to bump start it. That proves nothing, because chinese bikes aren't "any gear start". All that will happen is the back tire will lock up lol


That's exactly what happened! Won't try it again. Thanks!

  • R-Dubya

Posted September 08, 2009 - 07:23 PM

#10

Lol I had the same problem with my 125 that I ordered from CA...It doesn't even sound like it's trying to start, right? Just do that. Make sure you push it all the way down, then hold it there, try to push it down even further, then slowly bring it back up. You'll hear it engage. Takes a while to get used to it.

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 12, 2009 - 12:39 PM

#11

I'll try it tomorrow, thanks !!


Tried your suggestion, but no luck. Since I do not have anything happening when the starter button is pushed I think the problem lies in something electrical. Any suggestions on what and how to check?

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 12, 2009 - 12:43 PM

#12

Thanks for the quick response! The starter does have a green (I assume ground) wire connected to it.
The seller does not have a wiring schematic available to double check all of the connections.
I hear no clicking sound from the starter relay when the electric start button is pushed. I jumped the starter by placing a screwdriver over the terminals with no spark and again nothing happened.


The starter button and kill switch wires go into a harness and it is difficult to follw them exactly, but all appears connected and no cuts in the harness cover. The fuse by the battery is okay also. ANy suggestions on how to test the wiring?

  • msgtretired

Posted September 12, 2009 - 12:50 PM

#13

we have one of them Chinese 110's. i think it's a vicco or something like that,. it could be a couple things that seem to always happen. on handle Bars, near the brake lever, there are two wires that seem to always fall off the connection points. check that. if those are ok, on the rear, there may be a safety pull cap. if that backs off, it may not start. and of course. to start. put on the hand brake.

  • NVR2L8

Posted September 12, 2009 - 05:07 PM

#14

I may be a little later but here'sa good way to check the kill switch. Pulled it form one of my manuals. As far as I know they're all pretty much the same.

Engine Stop Button Electric Current Inspection
•Disconnect the engine stop button lead or connector.
•Start the engine.
•Ground the stop button lead or black/yellow of the magneto
lead (KX85A6F ∼/B6F ∼, KX100D6F ∼) while the engine
is running.

If the engine does not stop by this action, replace the CDI
unit.

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 12, 2009 - 05:37 PM

#15

we have one of them Chinese 110's. i think it's a vicco or something like that,. it could be a couple things that seem to always happen. on handle Bars, near the brake lever, there are two wires that seem to always fall off the connection points. check that. if those are ok, on the rear, there may be a safety pull cap. if that backs off, it may not start. and of course. to start. put on the hand brake.


This one is a Kazuma Viper 110. I checked the connection points -as this is new, they are okay. The handle bar switch does have a light switch on it but those two leads are not connected to anything since the bike has no headlight. I don't know of any "safety pull cap" on the bike.
The front and rear brakes are the drum type an dI don't see any electrical connection, but pulled it in anyway and nothing happened.
Could the starter relay be the problem? :busted:

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 12, 2009 - 05:44 PM

#16

I may be a little later but here'sa good way to check the kill switch. Pulled it form one of my manuals. As far as I know they're all pretty much the same.

Engine Stop Button Electric Current Inspection
•Disconnect the engine stop button lead or connector.
•Start the engine.
•Ground the stop button lead or black/yellow of the magneto
lead (KX85A6F ∼/B6F ∼, KX100D6F ∼) while the engine
is running.

If the engine does not stop by this action, replace the CDI
unit.


I have not been able to get the bike started. I did disconnect the starter switch, but it still wouldn't start. Again - I don't know why the electric starter will not work. I think that is the issue. If I can find out the electrical problem there I'll bet the bike will start.
Thanks for your help!

  • brentn

Posted September 14, 2009 - 07:47 PM

#17

If your getting spark and fuel then there's only a few things it could be.

Too much fuel;

Turn the idle screw all the way in for the highest idle.

Spark plug gap is too small

You don't have any compression
Try a compression test, you should be getting over 100 psi for a bike like this to start. If there is no compression, make sure that the valves are not adjusted to tight, as the valves are then open on the compression cycle and the bike will not start.
If the valves are in check and there's still no compression, then you have a big problem and the engine will need to be disassembeled.

This isn't rocket science, so maybe we should go through thebasics.

How do you know the bike is getting air?
How do you know that the engine is getting fuel? Can you smell it from the exhaust?
How do you know the bike has a spark?

Answer these 3 questions and we'll go from there.

  • R-Dubya

Posted September 14, 2009 - 08:21 PM

#18

Like I said before and someone else also said, replacing the CDI is worth a shot. It's pretty cheap (probably around 20 bucks shipped to your door) and will take you around a minute to swap out with the old one. Before you get into tinkering with the engine, just do that. If that doesn't work, before you rip the bike apart yourself or have a shop do it and spend 500 bucks, get your warranty papers together and ship it back for a new one.

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 15, 2009 - 03:25 PM

#19

If your getting spark and fuel then there's only a few things it could be.

Too much fuel;

Turn the idle screw all the way in for the highest idle.

Spark plug gap is too small

You don't have any compression
Try a compression test, you should be getting over 100 psi for a bike like this to start. If there is no compression, make sure that the valves are not adjusted to tight, as the valves are then open on the compression cycle and the bike will not start.
If the valves are in check and there's still no compression, then you have a big problem and the engine will need to be disassembeled.

This isn't rocket science, so maybe we should go through thebasics.

How do you know the bike is getting air?
How do you know that the engine is getting fuel? Can you smell it from the exhaust?
How do you know the bike has a spark?

Answer these 3 questions and we'll go from there.


A very long story cut short is that the seller reduced the cost and the manufacturer agreed to checkout the carb - which was shipped to them and adjusted. But still made no difference on the bike. Since new the starter button has never worked! The manufacturer said the bike was run before being crated and stated the problem must be in the carb - but this doesn't explain why the starter will not work! I checked the battery and it is fully charged.
I've removed the air filter and verified the choke is working.
I can smell the fule, but also opened the drain screw on the bottom of the carb bowl.
I removed the spark plug, plafced it back in the wire and held it near a ground while kick starting and got a nice blue spark.
Thank you very much for your ime and assistance!!!!:busted:

  • ThumperOne

Posted September 15, 2009 - 03:30 PM

#20

[quote name='ThumperOne']A very long story cut short is that the seller reduced the cost and the manufacturer agreed to checkout the carb - which was shipped to them and adjusted. But still made no difference on the bike. Since new the starter button has never worked! The manufacturer said the bike was run before being crated and stated the problem must be in the carb - but this doesn't explain why the starter will not work! I checked the battery and it is fully charged.
I've removed the air filter and verified the choke is working.
I can smell the fuel, but also opened the drain screw on the bottom of the carb bowl and gas ran out.
I removed the spark plug, placed it back in the wire and held it near a ground while kick starting and got a nice blue spark -and good compression coming from the spark plug hole.

Thank you very much for your time and assistance!!!!
Even though I'm getting spark, could there be something else electrical that is stopping the electric start and stopping the bike from firing?




 
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