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Electrosport 150W stator



29 replies to this topic
  • ESTRENT

    TT Member

89 posts
Location: California

Posted July 31, 2009 - 02:03 PM


Hey Guys,
We just finished our 03-04 Yamaha WR450F (ESK770) kit. The stator produces a healthy 150w and it a complete plug and play kit. The kit includes a new stator and a Regulator Rectifier to handle the output load. Even though right now it only fits the 03-04 hopefully in the next week or two it will also work on the 05-06 as well. The only issue we are having is Yamaha switched the location of the R/R on the later model WR's so where are trying to find a good place to located it.

Best Regards,
Trent Kirby
Technical Sales Representative
Electrosport Industries
3803 Oceanic Dr Suite 201
Oceanside Ca 92056
760-842-8300 x1
760-842-8306 fax
www.Electrosport.com

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted July 31, 2009 - 02:07 PM


Thanks for the info...check out this thread:

http://www.thumperta...light=07 stator

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted July 31, 2009 - 02:16 PM


How does your stator compare to the Ricky Stator and Trail Tech?

What core are you using? What gauge wire is it wrapped with?

What can you tell us about the reg/rec?

And finally...price wise...your almost 100 bucks more than RS and TT...why? (if you dont mind me asking :thumbsup: )

http://www.electrosp...detail-1975.php

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  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted July 31, 2009 - 02:22 PM


The only issue we are having is Yamaha switched the location of the R/R on the later model WR's so where are trying to find a good place to located it


FYI...the stock location works great if your stator is shaped like this:
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(06 WR)
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(07+ WR)
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  • ESTRENT

    TT Member

89 posts
Location: California

Posted July 31, 2009 - 03:36 PM


How does your stator compare to the Ricky Stator and Trail Tech?

What core are you using? What gauge wire is it wrapped with?

What can you tell us about the reg/rec?

And finally...price wise...your almost 100 bucks more than RS and TT...why? (if you dont mind me asking :thumbsup: )

http://www.electrosp...detail-1975.php

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That is actually the wrong picture and I was going to try and have it swapped out before anyone saw it, but to late. That picture is actually the KTM ESG145 250w kit. I attached some rough photos of the kit for you guys to take a look at. I did not know that the TT kit and the RS kit were priced that low and the whole point is to be competitive so I just change the price on the website to $159. It may take a couple ours for the website to update though.

The core that we are using is our own and the size wire gauge we are using is 1.1.

The R/R is our ESR601 which is a modified ESR600. This R/R is designed to handle a max of 250w.

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  • ESTRENT

    TT Member

89 posts
Location: California

Posted July 31, 2009 - 03:40 PM


FYI...the stock location works great if your stator is shaped like this:
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(06 WR)
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(07+ WR)
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Thank you very much for the pictures I will save these and show our R/D manager. Unfortunately we are not using that R/R. We did do some testing with one of those R/R and found that the regulator portion was right on the limits and there is a higher chance of a failure. So that is why we are using our ESR601. It is much more reliable, the only downfall is finding somewhere to mount the unit.

How close is that R/R to your front forks when you crank your handle bars all the way in?

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted July 31, 2009 - 04:33 PM


How close is that R/R to your front forks when you crank your handle bars all the way in?


Im bummed I had a couple pictures of it but I deleted them. Overall mounting it that way I was able to get about 1/4 room from the reg/rec and the for tube. I also used a spacer to get the reg/rec tight.

I am currently running a different setup and the reg/rec mounts differently...

Posted Image

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted July 31, 2009 - 04:39 PM


I did not know that the TT kit and the RS kit were priced that low and the whole point is to be competitive so I just change the price on the website to $159. It may take a couple ours for the website to update though.


RS is running $150 for the stator and reg/rec
TT is running $169 for the stator and reg/rec

Its nice to see you drop the price down to what the rest of the industry is currently selling at :thumbsup:

The core that we are using is our own and the size wire gauge we are using is 1.1


How does that compare to an 18 gauge wire in size?
Is your core the same size as stock or thicker?


The R/R is our ESR601 which is a modified ESR600. This R/R is designed to handle a max of 250w.


Thats good to know...the TT/RS/BD reg/rec is rated at 150 watts.

How many watts is your stator rated for? How does it compare (volts wise) to the other stators in this post?

http://www.thumperta...10&postcount=16

*** Sorry for all the questions! Did you get my PM? I have more questions but would rather ask them off line :worthy:

  • TLRam1

    TT Bronze Member

115 posts
Location: Texas

Posted August 03, 2009 - 09:09 PM


Trent,

What is the output for the stock 04 WR450 stator?

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted August 04, 2009 - 06:10 AM


What is the output for the stock 04 WR450 stator?


At idle, it puts out enough to run a dual sport kit and 1 hid...thats all :thumbsup:

  • MaxPower

    TT Platinum Member

1,742 posts
Location: New Jersey

Posted August 04, 2009 - 08:50 PM


[COLOR="DarkGreen"]I wonder if Electorsport got there customer service issues sorted out since I had dealings with them
3 times[/COLOR]

  • TLRam1

    TT Bronze Member

115 posts
Location: Texas

Posted August 04, 2009 - 09:16 PM


At idle, it puts out enough to run a dual sport kit and 1 hid...thats all :thumbsup:


Guessing here,

The HID is lower wattage than the stock headlight, correct, so it will not run a duel sport setup stock on it's own?

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted August 05, 2009 - 05:52 AM


The HID is lower wattage than the stock headlight, correct, so it will not run a duel sport setup stock on it's own?


No, In stock form, you can run a dual sport kit (barely)

FYI:
Pre 07 bikes came stock with a 50/55 watt bulb
07+ Bikes come stock with a 35 watt bulb

With that said, an 35 watt HID will draw the same as a regular incandescent 35 watt bulb. The major difference between the two is HID must run off the battery were the stock bulb doesnt have too.

To run HID, you must (at a minimum) float the ground on your stock stator and replace the stock regulator with an aftermarket regulator/rectifier. By doing this, converts the charging system to DC only.

The stock stator has enough power to run a dual sport kit and one HID...nothing more.

  • TLRam1

    TT Bronze Member

115 posts
Location: Texas

Posted August 05, 2009 - 11:21 PM


What does Float the Ground mean?

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted August 06, 2009 - 05:51 AM


What does Float the Ground mean?


You take the stock stator that has two different coil windings and combine them to make one.

See these links

http://www.thumperta...ad.php?t=721647

http://www.bajadesig... Stator Mod.pdf

http://www.thumperta...ad.php?t=438469

  • fadingfastsd

    TT Member

88 posts
Location: California

Posted September 25, 2009 - 12:39 PM


Hi guys,

I originally posted this in another thread comparing various WR450 stator kits, you can see that thread here:
http://www.thumperta...199#post8638199

This is Evan in R&D at Electrosport Industries.
Since we are just now launching our ESK770 high power DC kit for the WR450's I figured I'd add our numbers to this thread to show what we have to offer.

I'm attaching a chart showing charging voltages measured at the battery of our kit, using our ESL770 stator and ESR601 regulator.

Now looking at previous numbers for other companies stators quoted in this thread, I don't know exactly what RPM you're using for idle and for 1/4 throttle.
My numbers will be quoted at 1200RPM idle, and 3000RPM 1/4 throttle.

These tests are done with our new 4" HID's (we will have these available with a mounting bracket kit soon), with a stock flywheel and battery on our test rig.

Keep in mind that on our kit, with (2) 35W 4" HID's on, breaks even on battery voltage at 2200 RPM!! That means 13.6V steady on the battery, slightly above discharging level. Any lower RPM and the battery will be slowly discharging.

With that said, here is a chart showing output of our kit.

I'll print the data below in the same format as the other kit comparisons you posted above:

Raw AC Voltage:
Idle (1200RPM) - 11.7 VAC
1/4 Throttle (300)RPM) - 29.5 VAC

DCV @ Idle:
No Lights - 12.9VDC
1 HID - 12.0VDC
2 HIDs - 11.5VDC

DVC @ 1/4 Trottle:
No Lights - 14.6VDC (regulator maximum)
1 HID - 14.6VDC
2 HIDs - 14.6VDC

Charging System break even point w/ 2 HIDs on - 2200RPM @ 13.6VDC.

You can see our kit here:
http://www.electrosp...detail-1975.php

New pictures will be up soon, and it will be available for purchase online very soon.

Let me know if you have any questions

-Evan

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  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 25, 2009 - 01:15 PM


Hi guys,
I'll print the data below in the same format as the other kit comparisons you posted above:

Raw AC Voltage:
Idle (1200RPM) - 11.7 VAC
1/4 Throttle (300)RPM) - 29.5 VAC

DCV @ Idle:
No Lights - 12.9VDC
1 HID - 12.0VDC
2 HIDs - 11.5VDC

DVC @ 1/4 Trottle:
No Lights - 14.6VDC (regulator maximum)
1 HID - 14.6VDC
2 HIDs - 14.6VDC

Charging System break even point w/ 2 HIDs on - 2200RPM @ 13.6VDC.


Thanks for the test data...However when you compare it to the other stators, your stator clear does not have the power to push one HID at idle and still charge the battery (like the Stock Stator and the Trail Tech stator do)

I think for MOST (if not all) of the guys on this forum want at a MINIMUM a stator that will run at least one HID at idle while the battery is still charging. Your test data CLEAR shows that your stator CAN NOT do that...

Also, I am very skeptical of your 14.6 readings with 2 HID's at 1/4 throttle especially when your RAW AC power is not even close to the Trail Tech or the Ricky Stator :busted:

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 25, 2009 - 01:31 PM


Evan, I also think its important that anyone who is thinking about buying from ElectroSport check out this thread...

http://www.thumperta...ad.php?t=804678

You guys dont seem to have the best "rap" (I know my phone calls have NEVER been returned :busted: )

  • fadingfastsd

    TT Member

88 posts
Location: California

Posted September 25, 2009 - 01:59 PM


BigCoop, I think we have some misconceptions here.
From the link that you posted above, here is Trent (Our Technical Sales Rep)'s last reply to you:
http://www.thumperta...453#post8524453

I'll go ahead and quote it here so everybody can know that you have been responded to:

Originally Posted by 123BigcoopDawg576 View Post
I have to agree. Im still waiting for my return phone from a voice mail I left a month ago.

Heck I even posted questions for Electrosports in a thread they started and they still have not gotten back to them

http://www.thumperta....82#post8423982

I talked to you less then one month ago it was around three weeks ago to be exact. I answered every single question that you sent to me via Pm over the phone the following day. I even talked to you about beta testing this unit on your 08 model WR450 which was already equipped with an aftermarket high output stator and R/R kit. So why you would say you did not talked to any one at Electrosport is beyond me. One of the reason that you said you called was because know body did return your phone call, which I do apologize for and you said yourself since you were already talking to me that you did not need the phone call returned.


You never responded to him there. He has already talked with you on the phone regarding your issues. I'm not sure why you are still bringing this issue up? If you have any problems with our parts, please feel free to call myself or Trent, at the number listed in my signature.

Moving on to the WR450 kit:

I never said our kit would power an HID at idle and still charge the battery.
That is exactly what the battery is there for, to allow you to do so for a short period of time. Winding a stator is all about a tradeoff, you can have some power at lower RPMs, or MORE power at higher RPMS.
Our stator is wound to produce more power than stock at higher RPMs at the cost of low RPM power. Where in the RPM range do you usually ride your bike? Our stator breaks even on battery voltage at 2200RPM, much lower than you would typically be riding a WR450.

If you're picking a charging system for your bike based on idle rpm power output, why wouldn't you just stick with the stock setup, unless you're using your nice shiny WR450 as an expensive generator to run lights for your campsite? :busted:

Bottomline is our part was NOT DESIGNED for that kind of power output at idle. It was designed for higher output in normal riding RPM range.

As far as your comment regarding AC power output, I don't think quite understand what that means.
Measuring AC power on output of the single phase stator wires is NOT a measurement of POWER. Power is unit that describes current flow at a specific voltage to a load.

What is really critical when talking about DC electrical systems on a bike like this is power output, which means how much current can the stator source at a DC voltage (after the rectifier and regulator) that will run the load (light) and still be able to keep the battery charged.
Knowing the AC voltage output from the stator tells you whether or not it is working, but nothing about the DC POWER the stator is able to produce.

The measurements I quoted, were done on my test bench, with a stock 04 WR450 flywheel, our ESL770 stator, our ESR601 Regulator, a Yuasa battery, and 2 of our 4" 35W HID's. This is as close to an on-bike setup as you can get on a test bench. The DC Voltage measurements I quoted are exact measurements at the battery terminals under the given condition.

I will post a chart soon showing current sourced from the stator by RPM while maintaining 13VDC output from the regulator, to show you power output across the full RPM range.
I can tell you that at 2200RPM where I said our part broke even, the stator is sourcing 6A of current at exactly 13VDC. Power is Current * Voltage, so P=6*13 = 78Watts of power at 2200RPM.

With the lights attached, we were driving (2) 35Watt load, which is 2*35=70Watts draw on the stator, which it was handling with almost 10Watts headroom. This is why the regulator was at its maximum regulation range of 14.6V, ensuring a FULLY charged battery on your bike while in use anywhere in the RPM range over 2200RPM.

If you have any other questions, please feel free to ask.
Also, I see you are in California, you are more than welcome to come to our facility anytime and I can give you a personal demonstration of our WR450 kit to prove these numbers to you.

Thanks!

Evan

  • 123BigcoopDawg576

    TT Titanium Member

2,664 posts
Location: Other

Posted September 25, 2009 - 02:28 PM


You never responded to him there. He has already talked with you on the phone regarding your issues. I'm not sure why you are still bringing this issue up? If you have any problems with our parts, please feel free to call myself or Trent, at the number listed in my signature.


He did respond to that complaint BUT he never came back to the WR forum and answered the questions...Also I NEVER talked to him on the phone so that statement is a little off :busted:

I never said our kit would power an HID at idle and still charge the battery.
That is exactly what the battery is there for, to allow you to do so for a short period of time. Winding a stator is all about a tradeoff, you can have some power at lower RPMs, or MORE power at higher RPMS.
Our stator is wound to produce more power than stock at higher RPMs at the cost of low RPM power. Where in the RPM range do you usually ride your bike? Our stator breaks even on battery voltage at 2200RPM, much lower than you would typically be riding a WR450.


I never said that you said your stator could run and HID at idle...I said that it could NOT and that is a BIG turn off especially when there are two other stators on the market that can.

Also when you speak of the trade off, I dont see that trade off with the Trail Tech....especially as it powers one HID at idle and TWO at anything above idle....so what trade off is there again :banana:

If you're picking a charging system for your bike based on idle rpm power output, why wouldn't you just stick with the stock setup, unless you're using your nice shiny WR450 as an expensive generator to run lights for your campsite? :banana:


Im picking power based on the fact that I dont want a dead battery...I run TWO HID's and when come to a stop I want to be able to run one along with my dual sport kit, GPS and electric start...if the stator can't keep up then I am stuck with a dead battery....that is NO good:bonk:

Bottomline is our part was NOT DESIGNED for that kind of power output at idle. It was designed for higher output in normal riding RPM range.

As far as your comment regarding AC power output, I don't think quite understand what that means.
Measuring AC power on output of the single phase stator wires is NOT a measurement of POWER. Power is unit that describes current flow at a specific voltage to a load.


You are correct about AC voltage not being a great way to measure power but is a good way to simple compare...I was simply comparing AC numbers accross the board...I just dont see how you can claim such a high DC reading when your raw AC power is so low...again I would be more than happy to test your setup and see what it really is putting out :thumbsup:

If you have any other questions, please feel free to ask.
Also, I see you are in California, you are more than welcome to come to our facility anytime and I can give you a personal demonstration of our WR450 kit to prove these numbers to you.



Thanks for the offer...please also consider mine!

PS my "shinny bike" is actually used to power 2 HID's :banana:

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