Oil Overfill



19 replies to this topic
  • JackAttack

Posted March 11, 2003 - 05:31 PM

#1

I changed the oil in my new BRP today for the first time after breaking it in for an easy 30 miles(low rpms, never past 4th gear). I pulled the plug and out poured almost 4 quarts of oil! I hope to God nothing was too stressed out in there.

When I purchased the bike new from a Honda Dealer they let me start the bike and run it(5 min.) while I checked it out. I pulled the dipstick at this time and it was almost on the mark. After I agreed to purchase they told me to come back in a couple of hours and they would do the paperwork and prep it for me. I believe it was at this time they added oil to fill it up to the mark after the bike was at rest.

When I pulled the dipstick before my oil change it was already at the top mark and the bike had been sitting for two days. It was at this time I knew I had a problem. I could look down into the dipstick hole and see the top of the oil!

I know I should have checked the oil before the first ride.

The bike runs great and does not blow any smoke.

I really don't know what to do from here.

What kind of problems, if any, should I expect? Is there any possible way that no harm was done?

Should I notify someone at the dealer or maybe Honda about this situation? The bike is still under warranty, or does it fall on my shoulders?

Thanks in advance for any help. :)

  • yzfxr

Posted March 11, 2003 - 06:56 PM

#2

as long as seals aren't leaking, you'll probably be ok. with the dry sump motor i think it has two oil pumps, one that pumps oil to the frame and one that pumps oil out of the frame and into the motor at a slower rate than the other pump. so there is never too much oil in the pickup like there would be in a wet sump motor if you overfilled it which could then burn it or possibly hydro lock with oil. maybe the dealer added oil to full mark with out running the motor first. also, on my xr600 if you look at the oil level on the dipstick cold, even with the correct amount in, it will register at the full mark without running it. i don't check it like that, i'm just pointing it out. don't know if the 650r is like this.

  • Keo

Posted March 11, 2003 - 07:13 PM

#3

Just as a BTW, considering the service manual says it. Although a LOT of people say that the bike should take no more than 1800 cc/ml of oil, the official service manual from Honda says it should be filled to the neck. This is just my opinion (and apparently Honda's) and is contrary to the other opinions on the board. I would have a gard time believing the bike took 4 qts.

Keo

  • smashinz2002

Posted March 11, 2003 - 07:18 PM

#4

Hi. Never EVER check the oil when the engine is cold!! The engine must be run normally under sufficient loading (not idled) for a period of time before checking the oil level immediately after killing it. If you check it cold, you will ALWAYS get a lower than normal reading if the oil is at the correct level. Check your manual it states this.
Running the engine with the oil level way too high will result in blown seals, and damage. If you had oil coming out of the plug hole, then some damage has already been done, even if the seals were not blown. Check your airbox for oil also, because excess engine oil will get blown back into there also. Too much oil in the cylinder will result in burned oil in the combustion chamber, which results in glazing of the cylinder and incorrect ring seating during break-in. You should be very angry at the stupid dealer!! There is no excuse for this type of error on their part. The XR650R is tough though, so set the oil level correctly, continue to break it in, and then note oil consumption. After break-in, the oil level should not fall below a half inch or so of the upper level between 300mi. changes. Also remember engine is seriously affected by the "warm-up" period. Warm the bike at idle and wick the throttle a little in neutral for at least 2 min. before riding it. Then ride it moderately for another 3 or so minutes. Then it's ok to hammer it hard. If you don't do this, engine life will be reduced by about half, and these are the facts.
LL.

  • CoreyClough

Posted March 11, 2003 - 08:27 PM

#5

Pardon the opinion here, but doesn't that bike have an oil reservoir, and the engine will only ask for as much oil as it needs? If you fill it to the top, the pump has to pump it into the engine, and the other pumps it back to the reservoir. There is a "fill to" line on the dipstick for a reason, but when you shut the engine off, the oil doesn't fill up the crankcase? It stays there. I'm not being a smarty here I am just interested in understanding the oiling system

  • bbarer

Posted March 12, 2003 - 03:51 AM

#6

For what its worth the 650R will not in any way hold 4 quarts of oil. I actually (before I learned to check the oil right after killing the engine) overfilled mine by about a pint or so. After running it for maybe 5 minutes the excess oil blew out through the breather that leads to the air filter and subsequently poured out that little black drain hose at the bottom of the side cover that houses the air filter. I mean no disrespect but 4 quarts is not possible..........

  • JackAttack

Posted March 12, 2003 - 05:32 PM

#7

As I stated before it was almost 4 quarts. I took the pan of all used oil that I had collected and attempted to fill empty motor oil quarts to see just how much was in there, 3 were filled completely and alot was on the floor from attempting to do this without a funnel.

I think you are right about one of the oil pumps only giving the crankcase the right amount. Before I drained the oil I pulled the OIL CHECK BOLT from the brake side of the engine thinking that if it was overfilled the excess would run out. No oil came out until I tilted the bike a little, meaning the oil level in the crankcase was OK. All the oil was in the frame. I came off of an XR400 and I am used to all the oil sitting in the engine and then pumped into the frame when running.

My next thought was that the downtube screen may have been clogged holding the oil in the frame, after inspection this was not the case.

I ran the bike today with 1800ml (Bel Ray) for about 30min. no problems and no smoke, I checked the oil directly after(5 seconds) shutting the motor down and it was right on the mark.

:)

  • loufish

Posted March 12, 2003 - 07:04 PM

#8

What oil check bolt? Are you talking about the case drain bolt?
My friend did the same trick as others, checking level while cold, then adding enough to bring to full mark...I learned from his mistakes. Nearly 4 qts sounds very fishy, never thought you could get that much in the crankcase, and frame.

Pardon the opinion here, but doesn't that bike have an oil reservoir, and the engine will only ask for as much oil as it needs?



It's a dry sump system, the scavage pump returning oil back to the tank moves more oil then the pressure pump, that keeps as little oil in the sump as possible. You DO NOT fill the tank up to the neck ever, all dry sumps need expansion room in the tank.

  • josephbodden

Posted May 01, 2016 - 07:12 PM

#9

WHAT THE hell is Honda thinking? they call themselves engineers and then set up this weird oil level deal where you can't tell how much oil is in the engine, if it has enough, or too much? Never buying another Honda. ever.



  • hollerhead

Posted May 02, 2016 - 06:26 PM

#10

WHAT THE hell is Honda thinking? they call themselves engineers and then set up this weird oil level deal where you can't tell how much oil is in the engine, if it has enough, or too much? Never buying another Honda. ever.

No, you can't tell.  Everyone else can.  :lol:



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  • JoeRC51

Posted May 04, 2016 - 04:18 PM

#11

There's always knitting or gardening.



  • brianhare

Posted May 04, 2016 - 04:20 PM

#12

i`m sure Honda will miss you,,honest i do

 

 

B



  • josephbodden

Posted May 04, 2016 - 08:33 PM

#13

There's always knitting or gardening.

true, and any knitwit or gardener could probably design a better oil filler indicator than one that inspires about three different descriptions of how to determine if there is too much, or even more importantly, NOT ENOUGH oil for the engine. Can't check it when it's cold Oh nononono... must check it after running... of course there is that little matter of sometimes IT WON'T START so... you just keep trying to start it and hope it gets 'warmed up' before it BLOWS UP...

knitting and gardening, damn fine ideas...



  • bork

Posted May 05, 2016 - 03:58 PM

#14

:naughty:


Edited by bork, May 05, 2016 - 04:00 PM.


  • brianhare

Posted May 05, 2016 - 04:05 PM

#15

:devil:

 

B



  • jjktmrider

Posted May 06, 2016 - 09:22 AM

#16

Most all bikes with a dry sump have the "deal" that it has to be ran and warmed up to properly check oil , my Yami's do as well as my DRZ . Just the nature of the setup . I much prefer this setup over having all the oil in the motor , you can usually get 1/2 to 3/4 quart more oil for circulating and keeping it in good shape. Easy to add a bigger tank and gain another quart (or more)of reserve capacity as well .



  • Fivefive1

Posted May 08, 2016 - 06:09 AM

#17

true, and any knitwit or gardener could probably design a better oil filler indicator than one that inspires about three different descriptions of how to determine if there is too much, or even more importantly, NOT ENOUGH oil for the engine. Can't check it when it's cold Oh nononono... must check it after running... of course there is that little matter of sometimes IT WON'T START so... you just keep trying to start it and hope it gets 'warmed up' before it BLOWS UP...
knitting and gardening, damn fine ideas...


I think they're is more then one way to water a plant....i also think ot requires reading as well. So owning a Honda and gardening is out of the book for you guy.

  • crawsfire

Posted May 08, 2016 - 12:45 PM

#18

I see the same oil level hot or cold so I'm not sure why this is an issue. Easy enough to see the level by using a flashlight through the fill hole. I'm about to install my Sutton oil cooler and if i can source some clear tubing I'll see I'll incorporate a sight tube.



  • JoeRC51

Posted May 08, 2016 - 02:02 PM

#19

I see the same oil level hot or cold so I'm not sure why this is an issue. Easy enough to see the level by using a flashlight through the fill hole. I'm about to install my Sutton oil cooler and if i can source some clear tubing I'll see I'll incorporate a sight tube.

 

The check valve in the oil pump lets the oil tank drain into the crankcase on some bikes while sitting off , then unknowing owners check their oil cold and add oil to an already adequately filled motor. I check mine running when all of the oil is where it should be either way.



  • Chocos

Posted May 11, 2016 - 09:00 AM

#20

If you would`ve overfilled it then it should have blown a gasket already. Just pull the downtube drain bolt and let a small amount drain. Start her up, warm up engine, check oil level and refill accordingly.

 

In the future always check oil level with warm engine. At least 5 min idle or short ride/after ride prior to that.







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