loud tinking and water leaking
Posted April 29, 2009 - 02:24 PM
I raced, and WON the beginner class SuperMoto 5280 series in Grand Junction, CO this past weekend. On pre-grid, I thought I heard some tinking noises, but knowing the WR has a noisy motor, and that they had checked all the valve clearances and what not less than 2 weeks ago, I figured it was just my imagination.
I went to go practice today, and the tinking was *very* noticeable in the garage. I shut it down, and took it down to the place I bought it to have someone with a clue listen to it. They said it didn't sound normal. Also it started leaking (slight drippage) water out on the right side of the engine. I am wondering if the dang thing froze while coming over the passes between Grand Junction and Denver. I honestly don't think it was that cold, but it was whizzing through the air at 65MPH+ in the back of my truck
Next race is this weekend, and then the weekend after that. Being in the beginner class would mean that there are no points anyhow, but I still want to ride. Anyone have any ideas what it might be so I can at least try to act like I know whats going on when they call and tell me how bad it is, and I come pick it up cause I can't afford to fix it
Please remember, I am a geek, not a mechanic
Posted April 29, 2009 - 08:21 PM
Posted April 29, 2009 - 09:43 PM
I'd expect further failures if you just use water and WaterWetter, including galvanic corrosion in the cooling system.
Posted April 29, 2009 - 10:46 PM
Aussie: I wish my noise was gone the next day. I only ran it about 7 miles since I heard the noise, I am hoping whatever is "wrong" is simple and that I haven't done more damage riding it.
I have read about the "weap" hole, and think that may be where the water was coming out, but yea, that probably points to a bad (seal?) on the water pump. I have been running waterwetter for almost 2 weeks now (tomorrow). I was told that it needs to be swapped out periodically because of this, but 2 weeks should be fine, right?
The race rules were pretty clear that only water wetter or equivalent was allowed. I believe they are mostly worried about spills on the asphalt being extremely difficult to clean up. I made several suggestions of alternate additives and was shut down every time. I was mostly concerned about having no freeze protection. I figured water wetter contained the necessary lubes for the water pump, and corrosion protection. guess not, eh?
A lot of guys are running this setup, presumably without issues. Is the WR specifically vulnerable to watter wetter only or did I do something wrong?
After focusing my search on wr450 water pump, I see all the threads you are talking about, no problem on that then, the bike is almost exactly a year old (maybe a little over) with something like 6-7k miles on it probably.
Is it possible that the water pump is making the noise? (that would be nice if fixing one problem fixes them both)
Posted April 30, 2009 - 01:05 PM
DiIsopropyl Alcohol Ether 1-40% CAS #25265-71-8 <-- solvent
Tri Isopropyl Alcohol DiEther 1-40% CAS #24800-44-0 <-- solvent
Sodium Molybdate 2-10% CAS #10102-40-6 <-- corrosion inhibitor
Tolyltriazole 1-3% CAS #29385-43-1 <-- corrosion inhibitor
PolySiloxane Polymer <-- what makes WW work
There is silicone lubricant in there: the PolySiloxane Polymer (a silicone "oil"). It also could act work in the water pump by binding to the plastic and metal surfaces. You will get some corrosion protection if you use enough of the stuff so that it's not too dilute. Not sure I like the Siloxane in there, now I know where the "goo" comes from after using the stuff for a while.
I'm guessing that there just wasn't enough WW in there. The WR is notorious for water pump shaft and seal issues, so it may have just been its time to go.
Might be worth ringing up RedLine Oil and see what they say about it.
Edit: Fwiw, once you put WW in, it's pretty hard to get it all out by flushing the coolant system with water.
Edit #2: Did I say 'grats on winning? Well, I'm saying it now.
Posted April 30, 2009 - 01:37 PM
Again, I hope the "noise" I hear is fixed by replacing the water pump seals and impeller shaft (?).. cause thats still really my primary concern.
THANKS for your help TT is awesome!
Posted May 01, 2009 - 02:20 PM
Bottom End problems, crank shaft and bearings need replaced
As we suspected water pump seals, bearing and impeller.
Also suggested that there was considerable wear on the piston and cylinder and that should be replaced while its all taken apart.
They said the valves and cam look good
Looks like I am going to be out more than one race
Posted May 02, 2009 - 09:37 AM
Do take the time to let the officals know about the water pump issues. Even if they're not directly related to the "coolant" mix you're required to use, if enough people complain, maybe they'll rethink their coolant (or lack of it) requirement.
Posted May 03, 2009 - 09:00 AM
The bottom end is what has me more concerned. I know the other day when I was practicing starts, I missed a shift and banged it off the rev limiter pretty hard for a few seconds. There were other people starting too, so I couldn't hear mine till I realized I was falling behind. The TrailTech Vapor said I was up to 10840RPM, which seems awful high, is there a way to change the rev limiter down to like 9999 RPM to help prevent damage?
Posted May 03, 2009 - 10:01 AM
afaik, the WR450F rev limiter is set to 11K, so the Vapor pegged it about right.
You can probably install one of these:
and reprogram the rev limiter. Maybe there's one out there that's made for YZs and WRs.
But why would you want to? Dropping the rev limit might make the bike uncompetitive since you might need the 10k-11k range at some point in a race.
The factory rev limiter is designed to prevent catastrophic failure from high reciprocating loads and valve float, but introduces its own stresses from not firing the cylinder on every power stroke - not that one should spend much time on the rev limiter...
It seems to me that there's more stress on an engine from banging it back into gear after a missed shift than just hitting the limiter. I think that Lotus has it about right: If something doesn't break once in a while, they made it to heavy...
Posted May 04, 2009 - 09:39 AM
Posted June 12, 2009 - 12:00 PM
Posted June 12, 2009 - 12:33 PM