HP WR450 v KTM 300exc


14 replies to this topic
  • steelboy

Posted February 09, 2009 - 05:49 PM

#1

Hi all
looking at buying new, one or the other. Interested in the HP / torque difference between the two bikes.

Any info would be helpfull

Thanks

  • chipwich

Posted February 10, 2009 - 08:37 AM

#2

I rode a friend's 300EXC about a year ago on an eight mile tight enduro loop. It was a pretty good test because he weighs the same and likes pretty much the same setup. As far as 2 strokes go, the 300EXC has a ton of torque. Some even claim that it is more like a 4 stroke. It's a really popular bike, and those that have them seem to love 'em. Still, IMHO, as mild as it is, it still felt that it had a 2 stroke "hit". If the trail had been slick that little quick wind up might not have been appreciated. In other words, the trail was pretty tacky and rough, and since I ride mostly in the East, I would rather ride a thumper. If I were out West, it might be different. Although lighter, it didn't feel that much lighter, not say as in riding a 250XC-W, which feels like a mountain bike with a 37 hp motor.

Another friend of mine, a former AA enduro competitor in the 70s/80s who still can fly through the woods, also tried the 300, and came away with much the same impression. It is still a 2 stroke. If you like them, then it's a really versatile bike, although the current nat enduro champion, Russel Bobbit, rides a 250XC. Hard to argue with that.

If you do long rides or dual sports, you will need to carry oil, and you will probably use more fuel. Most to the 2 stroke guys that I ride with have a larger tank and are carrying oil somewhere.

If you have the money for a KTM, like $9K for the bike, then add handguards, a skid plate, and tax to be ~ $10K out the door, the 400XC-W (best dirt bike ever made) has by far the best motor, IMO. Otherwise a leftover 2008 WR450F is a killer deal, and will save you about $3500.

The WR450F out the door needs only the AIS kit and handguards, IMO, to be just an awesome dirt bike. Best bang for the buck right now, and that's why I just bought one :lol:

  • djv5

Posted February 10, 2009 - 11:19 AM

#3

I have a 2007WR450 with the free mods, and my riding buddy has a stock 2005 300EXC. We have raced and swapped bikes many times, and are both +1 gearing on the front sprocket. We weigh close to the same weight, and both bikes are street legal.

Our bikes are dead even during roll-ons from 3rd gear to 4th gear. Once we hit top of fourth gear, I can pull ahead a few bike lengths and then my 5th gear pulls even more.

The 300EXC is a great trail bike, and feels about 15-20 pounds lighter than my WR. As mentioned above, fuel range is less on the KTM than my WR. We both have stock gas tanks, and I can go about 85 miles and the KTM only about 60 miles.

  • hillclimbguy

Posted February 10, 2009 - 01:37 PM

#4

Stay with the Yamaha. Just my opinion.

  • mikeythefokker

Posted February 11, 2009 - 12:13 AM

#5

The wr and the 300 are two of the best trail bikes out there, so you really cant go wrong. I personally prefer the 4 stroke any time that I am riding in faster terrain. The 2stroke motor seems so buzzy at speed, and the the bike doesn't seem to plant as well as the 4stroke. However, in the real tight stuff, when you are tossing the bike back and forth in turns all day, the fact that the ktm300 is so much lighter usually wears on you a lot less. Both of the bikes are going to make plenty of power for you, although the wr will come a little corked up if it's still stock when you get it. The 2 stroke will always need a little more clutch work than the 4, but the 4 will always wear you down a bit more with the weight. Like I said, its tough to go wrong with these two. If money is a big concern, like it always is, the yz250 is a great bike and can be had for much less than either of these two. Happy hunting.


Oh yeah, the horsepower numbers should be pretty close, but the wr is going to make more torque. Some of the stock wr450 hp numbers that I have seen are pretty low( as low as 38hp), but with the exhaust baffle removed , greywire mod, and the airbox snorkel removed, you should be around 45. All of those mods are free, and together take about an hour. With some aftermarket or yz exhaust and a couple little goodies, 50 is an easy number to hit.

  • steelboy

Posted February 11, 2009 - 12:38 AM

#6

Thanks all
The deals being offered on the WR, $11200 Aus $ ride away.
The KTM guys dont want to do any deals $12500 ride away.
Around ($1000 in dealer delvery plus taxs)

I think the WR is the way to go with all the aftermarket gear available
i cant go wrong.

Cheers

  • hillclimbguy

Posted February 11, 2009 - 09:32 PM

#7

You made a wise choice!

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted February 12, 2009 - 09:30 PM

#8

I own a wr450 and have ridden several ktm300's. The ktm300 is a bike that solves all the complaints of the 450, which is namely excessive engine braking and top heavy weight.

As far as power goes, that's a wash. The only downside is the limited fuel range of the 2 stroke. But, there are guys that I ride with that get 25mpg on trail rides. On races though, its not as good.

I live in california, so choosing a bike is an entirely different decision process because of our riding areas. But otherwise, I'd be all over that ktm like white on rice! This should be a no brainer.

Again, I love the wr's and I am keeping mine because its plated, but the ktm is just a little better...

  • WR250F Captain

Posted February 12, 2009 - 11:47 PM

#9

top heavy weight and 4 stroke... brings to mind the new husaberg te450/570

you should also post this in the KTM forum, there are plenty of people who can give you even better details on the 300

like it has a dual map ignition which you can switch between power and traction (not a grey wire thing, an actual map made for traction and not de-tuning)

as far as HP numbers go, every dyno is different. you need both bikes on the same dyno with the same temp etc... but the WR450F stock should be around 42 stock, but 50 is what the new 450R honda gets, the yz450 doesn't hit 50 yet, and ricky carmichaels race bike had 55, and built CR500's don't get out of the 50~60 range, so a WR450 with 45hp will be a powerful bike.

a motor with holes on the side of it isn't going to have as much torque as a perfectly sealed 4 stroke at a much higher displacement

according to JD jetting my bike, minus the sx exhaust, has 47hp when jetted correctly and the stock exhaust altered a bit, and I've had that thing up to 111mph

oh, my friends WR450F will out accelerate my bike barely, and he has all the yz mods too it, aftermarket exhaust, and does about 90mph. probably just the gearing difference though

:lol: i'd go blue though, KTM's suspension doesn't compare... and thats what I miss :worthy:

I own a wr450 and have ridden several ktm300's. The ktm300 is a bike that solves all the complaints of the 450, which is namely excessive engine braking and top heavy weight.

As far as power goes, that's a wash. The only downside is the limited fuel range of the 2 stroke. But, there are guys that I ride with that get 25mpg on trail rides. On races though, its not as good.

I live in california, so choosing a bike is an entirely different decision process because of our riding areas. But otherwise, I'd be all over that ktm like white on rice! This should be a no brainer.

Again, I love the wr's and I am keeping mine because its plated, but the ktm is just a little better...



  • Bamster

Posted February 13, 2009 - 04:50 AM

#10

I have owned WR's in the past and I loved them. I ride mainly technical single track and found the big wr's were more of a workout. I got tired quickly.
For where I ride I found the wr 250 allot easier to go fast on and found it less tiring. Now I ride a ktm 200 and it feels like a trials bike compared to the big WR.
I still love the WR 250 for the tight stuff and would buy an other before I would buy a WR 450 . If I was only riding open desert stuff I would buy a WR 450 but if you are going to do any tight stuff the 300 hundred will out shine the 450 and still hold its own in the open stuff.

  • Charles De Mar

Posted February 13, 2009 - 08:00 AM

#11

I have owned WR's in the past and I loved them. I ride mainly technical single track and found the big wr's were more of a workout. I got tired quickly.
For where I ride I found the wr 250 allot easier to go fast on and found it less tiring. Now I ride a ktm 200 and it feels like a trials bike compared to the big WR.
I still love the WR 250 for the tight stuff and would buy an other before I would buy a WR 450 . If I was only riding open desert stuff I would buy a WR 450 but if you are going to do any tight stuff the 300 hundred will out shine the 450 and still hold its own in the open stuff.


So why did you still come to the wr450 forum? Just axing!

  • revolution01

Posted February 13, 2009 - 10:23 AM

#12

Beta 525 RR

Had the WR450, 480 kit, Rekluse, RTT Damper, and all the rest of the toys.

Got this Beta now and its everything the WR tried to be, sorry guys but the Beta rules for me, likes to be pushed hard and comes back begging for more.

Rekluse Pro.
GPR V2.
Pivot Pegz.

ITS LIGHTER, NOT TOP HEAVY, AND GOT 6 GEARS !!!!! :lol:

  • WR250F Captain

Posted February 13, 2009 - 11:42 AM

#13

that's a KTM engine and trans, and not even there new one.

why not get a 530xc-w or a 505xc-f which both have more power, and the 505 is just a 450 sx motor bored out to i think a 478 and hits 100mph or just shy of it, stock

but WR's are bullet proof, my friend bent one in half, and after 10 minutes of sticking in the sand, I pulled it out and it started right up. and they are very reasonably priced

Beta 525 RR

Had the WR450, 480 kit, Rekluse, RTT Damper, and all the rest of the toys.

Got this Beta now and its everything the WR tried to be, sorry guys but the Beta rules for me, likes to be pushed hard and comes back begging for more.

Rekluse Pro.
GPR V2.
Pivot Pegz.

ITS LIGHTER, NOT TOP HEAVY, AND GOT 6 GEARS !!!!! :lol:



  • revolution01

Posted February 13, 2009 - 12:19 PM

#14

The RFS motor is proven, can lay the power down better than the WR and still be mental when you want it to.

I`ve had WR`s for 6 years, tried a KTM525exc and thought very good engine shame about the rest, when the Beta came out with a linkage.....well, the rest is history.

Before it went.
Posted Image

  • chipwich

Posted February 13, 2009 - 01:29 PM

#15

I bet that the Beta is a sweet ride. Still, there is a big difference in the way that steel frame feels as apposed to the aluminum framed WR. If your comparison is from the pre 2007 WR, it's not really a fair comparison, IMO. Can't argue with the 6th gear though. Would be handy.

I have owned a 2004 WR, 2005 KTM 400EXC, now the 2008 WR, and have ridden most of the newer KTMs, including the 450XC-W. IMO, all of these bikes are so good, that the suspension setup is what separates them. As has been said here many times, a properly sprung and setup suspension, will make a rider quicker, longer.




 
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