08 yz450 for woods bike?pros and cons


58 replies to this topic
  • shrubitup

Posted October 09, 2009 - 01:10 PM

#21

Maybe this will help: A friend of mine is a front of the pack Vet A offroad racer and he has an '08 YZ450F and an '07 YZ250 smoker...both set up very well for the woods. Our woods here in western WA are incredibly tight and root infested. He decided to sell the YZ250 because he likes the 450 more.

Thanks so much for the encouraging words. :bonk:

The Y we ride sales event is SO damn tempting. I just have to know what a YZ450F rides like in the woods! Will it allow me to ride more often? No! Maybe it's just the shiny new plastics and different motor sound I am curious about. I hate advertising. :bonk:

  • kjwarren

Posted October 09, 2009 - 02:31 PM

#22

He did, indeed. 238/250 on the target range and 95/100 on the combat range for a 333. He might end up as High Shooter.


What range At Camp P was he shooting on

  • Wiz636

Posted October 09, 2009 - 02:35 PM

#23

Thanks so much for the encouraging words. :bonk:

The Y we ride sales event is SO damn tempting. I just have to know what a YZ450F rides like in the woods! Will it allow me to ride more often? No! Maybe it's just the shiny new plastics and different motor sound I am curious about. I hate advertising. :bonk:


Lol...if we ever meet up on the trail somewhere I'll let you ride my '08 450 with the Rekluse, FWW, 18" rear, and the full on Smart Performance suspension with the clover shims...pure offroad sweetness!

  • husqy360

Posted October 09, 2009 - 03:24 PM

#24

seems like you need to try a 450 before you decide.(to heavy? whould you like the tractor like power band? i do :bonk: so controllable everywhere).
my 06 is a little bit to heavy when i get tired in tight trails(compare to a 250 2t) and it does get alot hotter, but except for that, its pretty much perfect anywhere alse and very easy to ride and control for hours!!. the 08 feels a little lighter(from what i heard).

those 450s will climb in any gear. +

ez start? my 14 years old sister can start mine WITH no problem if i get it to the right position , i know it will help abit(somtimes), but i never had any problem fire the beast up with new gas and a clean air filter. the ez start is just extra weight if you ask me.

i will never trade my 450 for a 250, unless its for jumping.

:bonk:

  • shrubitup

Posted October 09, 2009 - 03:31 PM

#25

I'm actually liking the compression braking, extra traction, and no spooge/smelly exhaust ideas. I've owned a few four strokes but not a racing one. Not worried about maint..... it's a Yamaha; they maintain themselves of course. :bonk:

The wife has warned that she'll hafta to go to Paris for four weeks if I buy a new bike. That might not be a bad thing ..... except when the bill comes. :bonk:

  • SparksXR426

Posted October 09, 2009 - 08:41 PM

#26

I'm actually liking the compression braking, extra traction, and no spooge/smelly exhaust ideas. I've owned a few four strokes but not a racing one. Not worried about maint..... it's a Yamaha; they maintain themselves of course. :bonk:

The wife has warned that she'll hafta to go to Paris for four weeks if I buy a new bike. That might not be a bad thing ..... except when the bill comes. :bonk:


Paris huh? It took me putting in a hottub for my wife to get the nod on my 08.
Dont regret it either. Properly set up they make a far better woods bike than I expected and still able to tackle an MX track. My last new MXer was an 98 RM250 and, while a good bike too, doesnt hold a candle to the YZ. But thats just my opinion, I can hear the groans from the Yellow forums as I type this.:bonk:

  • Jim813

Posted October 09, 2009 - 09:30 PM

#27

I'm actually liking the compression braking, extra traction, and no spooge/smelly exhaust ideas. I've owned a few four strokes but not a racing one. Not worried about maint..... it's a Yamaha; they maintain themselves of course. :bonk:


I personally like the engine braking as well.

  • YamaLink

Posted October 10, 2009 - 06:45 AM

#28

The 08 makes a great woods bike for 95% of my needs and even my riding buddies who like to borrow it. The small feel, controllable power (relative term with stock pipe) and great suspension action.

Yeah, some people put on a Dr. D pipe but those are my friends who are either in really good shape, a bit heavier who want the extra oomph or are fast guys who can use that big hit and don't mind the extra arm pulling at the hour #5 mark in the trees.

A local guy uses his 08 450 for almost all his riding. Except when he does a rare big race he'll hop on a 2 stroke or 250F if the course favors them. Otherwise he loves, loves the engine braking, torque and feel of the 08 yz450f. So much so I see him come out of corners with his feel off the pegs and a gear too high just so he can roll on the throttle and clear a big log like the goon he is! And his words are always the same when we stop to chit chat: Man, I love that torque.

  • KillerHiller

Posted October 10, 2009 - 07:56 AM

#29

I'll throw my 2 cents in. I own an 08 YZF450 and a 06 YZ250 2stroke. I use the 2 stroke in the woods and the 450 on the track. I have taken my 450 into the woods a few times and just don't like it as well. Especially in tight woods I like the 2 stroke much better and I see you are back east so tight woods I would guess are normal for you. FWIW I ride enduros in the A class so that is where I'm using the 2 stroke mostly. One of my fellow class riders is on an 08 YZ450 and loves it in the woods and he was on a 2 stroke last year.


My feelings are very similar regarding the 2 bikes. I own both bikes 2006 model year and I much prefer the 250 in the tight stuff.

I'm 180lbs Vet A rider, fyi.

Once it opens up a bt the 450 is a hoot.

  • shrubitup

Posted October 10, 2009 - 08:19 AM

#30

My feelings are very similar regarding the 2 bikes. I own both bikes 2006 model year and I much prefer the 250 in the tight stuff.

I'm 180lbs Vet A rider, fyi.

Once it opens up a bt the 450 is a hoot.

A good point. :bonk:

The tighter the better for me is what I say. :bonk: Yes, we ride tight here and Wiz knows all well the terrain and has surely conquered all with his 450F around here.

I'm no A class rider though but I do know my skillz went from zero to hero once I got a reklused YZ. Please don't let the 450F be the next bolt on for my skill advancement. :bonk: :bonk:

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  • KAS

Posted October 10, 2009 - 12:48 PM

#31

I was in the same boat as you. I got rid of my '07 YZ250 and bought an '07 YZ450.

About 5 minutes in to my first ride on the 450 I thought I had made a $6000 mistake. It wasn't anywhere near as good as the 250 for tight woods.

By the end of the day I was a lot more used to the bike, but was still kinda skeptical.

Then I put a heavier flywheel on, and that helped quite a bit.

Point it up a long, steep uphill, or on slightly more open trails, and I love it.

But I still don't think its quite as good in on tight trails as a 2-stroke. Even with the flywheel the motor still has a herky-jerky nature that I don't care for.

As far as weight & handling, I didn't notice a huge difference. Its not such a big difference as say, between your old WR and your 250.

  • DT360

Posted October 11, 2009 - 09:06 AM

#32

Just spent last two weekends woods riding my new 09YZ450F after spending the whole summer riding my woods set-up 08YZ250 2T.
Only mods to the 450 were standard protection and Renthal 51 tooth rear sprocket. The thing is still not geared low enough in 1st for my liking, and still way fast in 5th. Next set of chain/rings I'll go with a 52 rear.
While there is no way to hide the fact you are riding a much more weighty machine, I must say it is suspended very well (after preferred set-up), and the bike went where pointed and was very plush. Best of all, WHAT A MOTOR!!! I really enjoyed the hard and seemingly endless pull. Wheel-stands and climbs like a champion.
The 2T is definitely more nimble and really stands out in slow and technical terrain, but overall, I think the 450 is more all-around useful.
Really appreciated the 450 yesterday doing a long dirt road haul from the mountains (where we got shut down by snow at 5000ft), to the truck. Was nice to haul the mail at 450 speed with wheel stands just a crack of the throttle away. My pinger would have been 20mph slower and not nearly so enjoyable to cruise.
Again, for our terrain (mixed tight woods and long-haul XC) the 450 will prove the better all-around choice. At least until the injected 2T's come out!
One more thing, the price of new 08 and 09 YZ450's must be considered!

  • rubberband-man

Posted October 11, 2009 - 12:48 PM

#33

08yz450f is a perfect woods bike. i have a 2007 wr450 and love it, but ever since i got the 08 yz, my wr sits in the garage for all my morning/ midday rides. i pull it out when i need a light.

  • shrubitup

Posted October 11, 2009 - 09:32 PM

#34

One more thing, the price of new 08 and 09 YZ450's must be considered!


Thanks for that note and the irritating little point at the end quoted above. I'm thinking I will return my YZ250 to stock MX attire and sell off all my trail mods and then sell the bike (maybe!) and rustle up a YZ450F. :bonk:

But I still don't think its quite as good in on tight trails as a 2-stroke. Even with the flywheel the motor still has a herky-jerky nature that I don't care for.

As far as weight & handling, I didn't notice a huge difference. Its not such a big difference as say, between your old WR and your 250.


Can you elaborate on the Herky Jerky?

  • KAS

Posted October 12, 2009 - 05:45 AM

#35

Thanks for that note and the irritating little point at the end quoted above. I'm thinking I will return my YZ250 to stock MX attire and sell off all my trail mods and then sell the bike (maybe!) and rustle up a YZ450F. :bonk:



Can you elaborate on the Herky Jerky?


Sure.

When you lug a 2-stroke down low, the motor just kinda buzzes along smoothly.

On my 450, if you let the revs drop you get this chunk-a-chunk-a-chunk feel, its just not very smooth, kinda high-strung.

Engine braking plays in to this as well. I never have liked the way a 4-stroke feels when you chop the throttle. Kind of a back-n-forth see-saw effect from opening the throttle (snap) and let off (engine brake).

Like I said, this only applies to really tight trails. More flowing, quad-width trails or open desert, and the 450 is sweet.

This is all just my oddball opinion though. Results may vary.

  • grayracer513

Posted October 12, 2009 - 06:32 AM

#36

When you lug a 2-stroke down low, the motor just kinda buzzes along smoothly.

On my 450, if you let the revs drop you get this chunk-a-chunk-a-chunk feel, its just not very smooth, kinda high-strung.

Engine braking plays in to this as well. I never have liked the way a 4-stroke feels when you chop the throttle. Kind of a back-n-forth see-saw effect from opening the throttle (snap) and let off (engine brake).

I can see you've never ridden a CR500 :bonk:

The problem at very low RPM with a YZ450 is that the engine doesn't have enough rotating inertia (flywheel's too light), and even with the heaviest available unit, it's still much less than what a WR has, and it's the reason it won't pull smoothly at very low speeds. The WR also has a much lower first gear already built in, and the suspension is more geared toward trail riding. If that's to be your primary use for the bike, it deserves consideration.

As far as engine braking goes, you're in control of whether the bike jerks abruptly when the throttle is operated. Coming from big four strokes to two-strokes years ago, I never liked the lack of engine braking. Engine braking is a great thing. It requires neither foot, and won't lock the rear wheel. Just learn to work the throttle a bit more smoothly. There's far more control available with it on a thumper than on a pinger.

  • shrubitup

Posted October 12, 2009 - 07:13 AM

#37

The WR also has a much lower first gear already built in, and the suspension is more geared toward trail riding. If that's to be your primary use for the bike, it deserves consideration.


Like I said, this only applies to really tight trails. More flowing, quad-width trails or open desert, and the 450 is sweet.


I see. I have no plans for quad width trails or other open areas and my smoker lugs very well like you noted. The last WR I rode was all uncorked but I hated the engine due to lack of spin-up. It would not power wheelie (I'm heavy) and just didn't rev fast enough for me. That's why I'm thinking YZ450F. Possibly with a big azz FWW and a Rekluse the herk-a-jerk can be gone. Compression breaking rocks. :bonk:

  • grayracer513

Posted October 12, 2009 - 08:49 AM

#38

The last WR I rode was all uncorked but I hated the engine due to lack of spin-up. It would not power wheelie (I'm heavy) and just didn't rev fast enough for me.

IMO, it is far easier to make the WR engine perform better and get it to shed a few pounds than to smooth out the low speed performance of a YZ450. The low gear issue can be resolved for the most part by installing a Rekuse, but that costs about as much (or more) as a WR trans swap. The only difference is the cases don't need to be split to change the clutch.

Then there is the suspension. You can, of course, work the suspension over to soften it for the kind of trail work we're talking about, but the WR starts out like that already (in fact, a lot of people try to stiffen them up a bit).

In truth, neither one is ideal for the task as is. It just becomes a question of which end you want to start from, and which side of the center you want to end up on.

  • KAS

Posted October 12, 2009 - 03:44 PM

#39

As far as engine braking goes, you're in control of whether the bike jerks abruptly when the throttle is operated. Coming from big four strokes to two-strokes years ago, I never liked the lack of engine braking. Engine braking is a great thing. It requires neither foot, and won't lock the rear wheel. Just learn to work the throttle a bit more smoothly. There's far more control available with it on a thumper than on a pinger.



I learned to ride mostly on big 4-strokes (XR500, 600, 650), then I bought a 2-stroke and immediately loved the lack of engine braking.


I guess I'm just weird like that. :bonk:

  • Wiz636

Posted October 12, 2009 - 03:58 PM

#40

I like engine braking. They way I see it, unless you are just out for an easy trail cruise you are either on the gas or on the brakes unless descending a hill in which case the engine braking is a plus.





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