Yami quality


15 replies to this topic
  • bigred455

Posted July 08, 2008 - 01:09 PM

#1

I have read horror stories with all brands,and sure any brand on any given day could go down. The valve trane, crank etc,I have to say Yami has the best built motor going (QUALITY WISE).450 and 250 I am not trying to blow sunshine up our asses.I just get frustrated and dumbfounded why a certain brand is more popular than another,because of what a magazine has written.EVEN THOUGH IT DOES FEEL GOOD GOING TO A TRACK AND YOU HAVE THE ONLY YZ THERE.

We all know The YZ VALVE TRANE is superior to X brand and all the others,this is a fact:worthy: Just look at the prices for the valves ;EXAMPLE.

There are more options for aftermarket valves, cams, springs,for other brands than the YZ,wonder why.:p Admit it, the most popular brand is a time bomb waiting to go off,I am not just talking about the valves either.You can say "well since there is more of this brand out there,there is a better chance of more bad reports",POPPY COCK It just boggles my mind that consumers who buy bikes do not look at the whole picture,the whole picture is, Junk is being poured into these bikes,but riders just keep on buying them . Sales for parts are probably at a ALL TIME HIGH. You see, if people just go on being sheep the quality keeps on suffering. If people finally caught on and the numbers dropped on sales you will see a different tune. There is no doubt in my mind than Yamaha builds a better quality motor from the valve trane down to the crank. I just wanted to rant and keep some of us in check. Maybe the average YZ OWNER has a higher IQ than other brand owners,or am I pushing it.:thumbsup:

  • mkporn

Posted July 08, 2008 - 02:16 PM

#2

I have read horror stories with all brands,and sure any brand on any given day could go down. The valve trane, crank etc,I have to say Yami has the best built motor going (QUALITY WISE).450 and 250 I am not trying to blow sunshine up our asses.I just get frustrated and dumbfounded why a certain brand is more popular than another,because of what a magazine has written.EVEN THOUGH IT DOES FEEL GOOD GOING TO A TRACK AND YOU HAVE THE ONLY YZ THERE.

We all know The YZ VALVE TRANE is superior to X brand and all the others,this is a fact:worthy: Just look at the prices for the valves ;EXAMPLE.

There are more options for aftermarket valves, cams, springs,for other brands than the YZ,wonder why.:p Admit it, the most popular brand is a time bomb waiting to go off,I am not just talking about the valves either.You can say "well since there is more of this brand out there,there is a better chance of more bad reports",POPPY COCK It just boggles my mind that consumers who buy bikes do not look at the whole picture,the whole picture is, Junk is being poured into these bikes,but riders just keep on buying them . Sales for parts are probably at a ALL TIME HIGH. You see, if people just go on being sheep the quality keeps on suffering. If people finally caught on and the numbers dropped on sales you will see a different tune. There is no doubt in my mind than Yamaha builds a better quality motor from the valve trane down to the crank. I just wanted to rant and keep some of us in check. Maybe the average YZ OWNER has a higher IQ than other brand owners,or am I pushing it.:thumbsup:


+1..... Every time i split the cases on a red one (easily a 3:1 ratio) i am in amazement of the motor, its the build a better mouse trap syndrom.......I'll take the original.

Funny thing is, everyone complained that Yamaha was building in problems by running the same oil for both the motor and tranny....... Anyone wanna put money on who has more problems?:cry:

  • Family Man

Posted July 08, 2008 - 02:37 PM

#3

To go along with that point look at the old honda XR's, they have a reputation for for being super dependable. They mixed the engine and tranny oil on the xr's. I dont see a problem with doing so. Infact I think it makes it a little easier to do an oil change. And you only have to buy one type of oil.

  • grayracer513

Posted July 08, 2008 - 02:46 PM

#4

everyone complained that Yamaha was building in problems by running the same oil for both the motor and tranny.......


That's the one thing I would change if I was given oversight of the matter. I would rather see the trans and clutch isolated from the engine, and I'd like to see the oil capacity increased to closer to two quarts in a dry sump engine system, so that as little as 1 or as much as 2 could be run equally well.

  • bigred455

Posted July 08, 2008 - 03:24 PM

#5

You know off the top of the head it does sound better, seperate oil for motor and tranny,clutch. The amount that it holds on the CRF is what 600+cc's for each compartment. The tranny in a 2 stroke 250 holds 850cc's,850 across the board for the motor and for the tranny total 1700cc's would be the ticket. Sure weight is added,but come on. One thing,in 2 seperate compartments the oil which is barely any, does not get to circulate like it does in 1 sump.

  • bigred455

Posted July 08, 2008 - 03:28 PM

#6

+1..... Every time i split the cases on a red one (easily a 3:1 ratio) i am in amazement of the motor, its the build a better mouse trap syndrom.......I'll take the original.

Funny thing is, everyone complained that Yamaha was building in problems by running the same oil for both the motor and tranny....... Anyone wanna put money on who has more problems?:p



Pretty delicate isn't it.:thumbsup:

  • grayracer513

Posted July 08, 2008 - 03:31 PM

#7

If you examine the oiling system in a typical, sophisticated 5 speed manual transaxle, such as an Aisin, both shafts are "fed" a steady supply of oil whenever the vehicle is in motion. In a motorcycle, the same scheme could supply oil whenever the engine is running without any additional moving parts. That would circulate the oil as well as it currently does.

  • mkporn

Posted July 09, 2008 - 06:31 AM

#8

That's the one thing I would change if I was given oversight of the matter. I would rather see the trans and clutch isolated from the engine, and I'd like to see the oil capacity increased to closer to two quarts in a dry sump engine system, so that as little as 1 or as much as 2 could be run equally well.


I don't have an issue with this cause it would be better for the motor, but on the flip side of that, I have done several crank seals on CR 4strokes and that bill is a chunk of change. I would say that in my opinion I would still rather it be the same then have to have such a pain in the ass. Pretty easy to change oil in and I have one less item to check every time I throw a leg over the seat.

Beside, I think Yamaha has pretty much proven this is not a flawed design, and like said before, Honda did it for years on one of the most reliable lines of bikes ever made.

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • bigred455

Posted July 09, 2008 - 08:44 AM

#9

The tranny side on the CRF does like to lose oil to the motor side.I have seen crank seals replaced in only 30 hrs on the bike.:thumbsup:

  • grayracer513

Posted July 09, 2008 - 08:53 AM

#10

The tranny side on the CRF does like to lose oil to the motor side.I have seen crank seals replaced in only 30 hrs on the bike.:thumbsup:

That's an issue that needs to be addressed by stepping up to a seal more capable of handling the high shaft speeds of the crank and balancer shafts. Running everything on a common oil supply gets around that problem, and one or two others, but you can't escape the fact that transmissions can and always will shed big pieces of metal into the oil, and that's never been good for any part of an engine, starting with the oil pump. I'd just rather it was different than it is, but the way it is obviously works pretty well

  • bigred455

Posted July 09, 2008 - 09:12 AM

#11

That's an issue that needs to be addressed by stepping up to a seal more capable of handling the high shaft speeds of the crank and balancer shafts. Running everything on a common oil supply gets around that problem, and one or two others, but you can't escape the fact that transmissions can and always will shed big pieces of metal into the oil, and that's never been good for any part of an engine, starting with the oil pump. I'd just rather it was different than it is, but the way it is obviously works pretty well



I like to correct what I said,the CRF's are losing oil from the motor side to the tranny side. I know if you have seperate compartments it can work ,you see quality of the other brands suffer. Beef up the seals make sure the shafts on the crank ,tranny, etc,are more true. Also that is just not enough oil for each compartment especially the motor side,and the motor side holds more than the tranny.

  • yamihoo2

Posted July 10, 2008 - 09:09 AM

#12

The seperate oil makes sense to me, since the clutch grimes up the oil, I think it would be nice to have the cylinder not use that dirty oil with clutch and metal in it. The new KTM's have this system, (they always seem to make good sensible designs) anybody know if any others do?

  • mkporn

Posted July 10, 2008 - 12:07 PM

#13

That's an issue that needs to be addressed by stepping up to a seal more capable of handling the high shaft speeds of the crank and balancer shafts. Running everything on a common oil supply gets around that problem, and one or two others, but you can't escape the fact that transmissions can and always will shed big pieces of metal into the oil, and that's never been good for any part of an engine, starting with the oil pump. I'd just rather it was different than it is, but the way it is obviously works pretty well


Hear ya. The thing about the Yamy is the fact that you have a inlet screen that weeks out the big crap, then the scavanger pump is a gear unit (just like the main pump) which is not a hard fail unit (meaning a gear pump typically does not fail instantly and actually loses efficency from the first time it is started and is also very tolerant of debris, I have actually see pastry dough pumped with small block Chevy oil pumps (total different story) and not fail for years) Any way back to my point, so really if you take care of the filter (not sthe inlet) you will see very little contamination getting to the motor.

Gray, what did you say the nominal micron rating for the oil filter in the Yamaha? Did you say you had researched it as being an absolute or a nominal rated unit? (going back to a thread many months ago)....


Anyway, I don't mind the Honda design, just seems to be a bit over engineered (maybe that's caus I am biased and find the yamaha to be easier to work on).

On a side note, the engineered this motor and put it in thier bike and it seems they have more problems based on a per 1000 or so unit comparison. This is based on what I have read and seen. ( then again, you cant believe everything you read.:thumbsup:


Babbling is over, I still think that Yammie has the better design.

  • mkporn

Posted July 10, 2008 - 12:12 PM

#14

The seperate oil makes sense to me, since the clutch grimes up the oil, I think it would be nice to have the cylinder not use that dirty oil with clutch and metal in it. The new KTM's have this system, (they always seem to make good sensible designs) anybody know if any others do?


Ya, KTM has a good design, don't they use 2 different filters?

There are many ways to go about this and each could get better, but if you were to draw a line and base it on what gets the job done the best based on manufacturing costs, reliability of the system, easy of maintenance and and maintenance costs, I pick Yamaha.:thumbsup:

Just my opinion based on working on many a different bike.

  • grayracer513

Posted July 10, 2008 - 12:48 PM

#15

Gray, what did you say the nominal micron rating for the oil filter in the Yamaha? Did you say you had researched it as being an absolute or a nominal rated unit? (going back to a thread many months ago)....

Scotts filters are 35μ absolute. The old brass YZF filters were about 80μ. Fiber media filters are beta rated, and vary widely.

http://www.thumperta...297#post4676297

Ya, KTM has a good design, don't they use 2 different filters?

Did, but the new engines don't anymore. Personally, I'd love two filters in tandem; A Scotts as the primary and a paper as the secondary. It would be ideal.

  • kevin nichols

Posted July 15, 2008 - 09:22 AM

#16

Myself, my family and a whole lot of my friends used to ride Honda's. Now my garage is full of Yamaha's. It also helps with the kind of race support, invovlement and sponsorship that we get from our local Yamaha dealer. There are very few Honda dealers in our area that even compare.





Related Content

Forums
Photo

Snake pit oct 30th by The Anvil


Dirt Bike   Dirt Bike Regional Discussion   California
  • Hot  293 replies
Reviews

Yamaha YZ450F 2017 by Chris.GVS


Yamaha YZ450F 2017
  • - - - - -
  • 0 reviews
Forums
Photo

2016 YZ450 by CaptainKnobby


Dirt Bike   Dirt Bike Technical Forums   Suspension
  • Hot  59 replies
Forums
Photo

Michigan Motocross Tires by 288yz450


Dirt Bike   Dirt Bike Regional Discussion   North
  • 1 reply
Forums
Photo

100 hrs on 2014 yz450f, shim valves or replace them? by ttr230rider6


Dirt Bike   Make / Model Specific   Yamaha   YZ 400/426/450
  • Hot  79 replies
 
x

Join Our Community!

Even if you don't want to post, registered members get access to tools that make finding & following the good stuff easier.

If you enjoyed reading about "" here in the ThumperTalk archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join ThumperTalk today!

The views and opinions expressed on this page are strictly those of the author, and have not been reviewed or approved by ThumperTalk.