Should I go big


32 replies to this topic
  • Martian

Posted February 19, 2008 - 06:34 PM

#1

Here's my dilemma for the last five years I've been riding a 2001 yz250f. I love the weight and how it handles on the trails so easily, so far I've installed hot cams a vertex 300 big bore kit and a recluse clutch. I ride primarily trails and hill climbs. I'm finding myself needing more power so I was thinking about a stroker crank. Then it dawned on me, why not a 450. So my question is, how do you guys like the big bike. I'm 5 foot 10" 170 pounds. Do you think a wr450 is too much for me on tight trails. For all of you that have both bikes, what is the major difference can I expect. I picked a WR because I like the thought of electric start but I'm nervous about the extra weight. I am 40 years old. Any input would be appreciated.

The new 2008 WR looks like a bad as**bike

Thanks TTrs

  • 2grimjim

Posted February 19, 2008 - 06:43 PM

#2

The WR450 will do fine in the tight stuff and and the suspension on the WR would be much better suited to trail riding than the YZ (assuming that the YZ you have has stock suspension).

  • MaxPower

Posted February 20, 2008 - 02:17 AM

#3

[COLOR="Green"]I rode a YZ250F the other day and hated it. I cant see why anyone would rather ride one of those than a 450
I know a lot of people do, I just like the power of the 450 better.Im 43 and a half, 175 pounds and not real fast.Only my opinion[/COLOR]

  • dirtysouth

Posted February 20, 2008 - 07:30 AM

#4

Here's my dilemma for the last five years I've been riding a 2001 yz250f. I love the weight and how it handles on the trails so easily, so far I've installed hot cams a vertex 300 big bore kit and a recluse clutch. I ride primarily trails and hill climbs. I'm finding myself needing more power so I was thinking about a stroker crank. Then it dawned on me, why not a 450. So my question is, how do you guys like the big bike. I'm 5 foot 10" 170 pounds. Do you think a wr450 is too much for me on tight trails. For all of you that have both bikes, what is the major difference can I expect. I picked a WR because I like the thought of electric start but I'm nervous about the extra weight. I am 40 years old. Any input would be appreciated.

The new 2008 WR looks like a bad as**bike

Thanks TTrs


I am 5'11 160 and the 450 is the only way to fly. YZ is lighter and is a bit more responsive considering the snap you get from the timing/cam more on the top end. Grunt on the bottom is about the same but the WR is a lot more tame as it doesn't run up high in the revs as fast. So if you're a balls to the walls rider go YZ if you're a creeper in the trails ride the WR plus you get the lights for night time rides. WR is a bit heavier but the new aluminum frames make it worthless to worry about. Either way, go 450...you'll love it at your current size..will fit like a glove. BTW, if you go YZ its ready to flogg out of the box and the WR will require some mods to get where you wanna be.:applause:

  • dugabrams

Posted February 20, 2008 - 09:29 AM

#5

"A bit heavier"

Yeah right, don't kid yourselves, a 40-45 lb. difference will absolutely be felt it the tight stuff. Just going from a WR250 to a WR450 is a very noticable difference when the trail gets tight and the YZ250 is 25 lbs. lighter than the WR250 to boot.
It's my opinion that no single 4 stroke bike can give you everything. I have both and simply choose the right tool for the job as needed. My YZ is set up for trails with proper springs and valving and not much else because riding a stock YZ off road does kinda beat you up.
If you go with the WR450, you will love the engine in every way. You will love the way it torques up a steep hill, and has power everywhere. You will find yourself a lot less worried about being it the right gear. But make no mistake, on trails where it's hard to get past 2nd gear, plan on not being able to use that power and getting fatigued quicker. There will be places you wish you had the lighter bike.
Why don't you just keep your 250 and get a new 450 so it won't be lonely. Either that or consider one of those ugly orange KTM 200cc 2 smokers.

  • Robey14

Posted February 20, 2008 - 09:47 AM

#6

im assuming you like yamaha, but why not try a ktm, they have electric start but none of the lights, plus ktms have always been some of the lightest bikes around

  • xBRIANx

Posted February 20, 2008 - 10:06 AM

#7

My last bike was an 96 xr250r. Loved it. Just recentley retired it last year. Thought that was the best bike ever, power, ability to manuver it in tight trails, hills. etc,etc. Wasnt until I got my wr450 that I was shocked on the power difference, and the way it handled and rode. Granted Im comparing a 96250, to an 06 450. But as far as the weight goes, I really didnt notice a difference, (maybe there wasnt one). The only thing that really bothered me was how much higher it sat, which really was like, 2-3 inches probably.. maybe more maybe less. I say get the 450. You figure 25 lbs is a big difference or w/e, then I suggest hit the gym a little- its really not that big of a difference, for me at least. But all in all i would recommend taking the step up to the 450, being used to the size, and handling of a 250, the 450 didnt seem much different, other than the power gain, and the amount of fun i have on it. just my .02 cents tho.

  • mvryder

Posted February 20, 2008 - 10:10 AM

#8

Everyone seems to throw out those 200's as this great trail bike suggestion. How many people suggesting these bike have actually ridden one?? I have a 07 wr 450 and it feels fine in the "tight stuff". I have ridden an 08 wr250f for about 30 min as well. I did not notice a difference in weight, only in power. My friend has a ktm 200 and the the is a pain to ride all the time, it is not some magical trail bike. Seriously, it is cheaper to own and maintain engine wise but it is a a handful with a lot of difficult to use power. I regularly out ride my buddy in the tight stuff. I am tractoring though the tough stuff and he is screaming the engine spewing smoke and fanning the heck out of the clutch as i wait for him to catch up. I am less tired than he is because I have smooth tractable 4 stroke power.

This last weekend he brought out is 4 stroke klx 300 out and was right back on my rear tire through tight stuff and all. And he hadn't ridden it in a good number of months.

The whole point of those 200's is to get the most horsepower into the small bike offroad / enduro classes (the class is 86 to 200cc's regardless of stroke). So that bike is not some wonder trail bike, it is a maxed competition bike and it rides like it.

The wr250 could be construed as a bit easier to ride in tight situations because the power is mellower. Do the math, do you think the 450 feels like more of a handful because of 5 percent more weight or 80% more displacement?!?!? That all changes when the tight stuff gets you in a hole you have to climb out of it it (maybe when you are not in the right gear because you are battling rough terrain at the same time).

Just my 2 cent rant on those 200 pumpkins and this whole 250s are so much lighter thing. I am not saying everyone, but I think a lot of that 200 2t praise is just people parroting stuff they read on here. I think this because I did it and that's, in part, why my buddy bought that POS 200.

  • xBRIANx

Posted February 20, 2008 - 10:33 AM

#9

well said.

  • drtbk4ever

Posted February 20, 2008 - 01:56 PM

#10

Well as my riding buddies say..

GO BIG OR GO HOME...

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • dugabrams

Posted February 20, 2008 - 03:39 PM

#11

Everyone seems to throw out those 200's as this great trail bike suggestion. How many people suggesting these bike have actually ridden one?? I have a 07 wr 450 and it feels fine in the "tight stuff". I have ridden an 08 wr250f for about 30 min as well. I did not notice a difference in weight, only in power. My friend has a ktm 200 and the the is a pain to ride all the time, it is not some magical trail bike. Seriously, it is cheaper to own and maintain engine wise but it is a a handful with a lot of difficult to use power. I regularly out ride my buddy in the tight stuff. I am tractoring though the tough stuff and he is screaming the engine spewing smoke and fanning the heck out of the clutch as i wait for him to catch up. I am less tired than he is because I have smooth tractable 4 stroke power.

This last weekend he brought out is 4 stroke klx 300 out and was right back on my rear tire through tight stuff and all. And he hadn't ridden it in a good number of months.

The whole point of those 200's is to get the most horsepower into the small bike offroad / enduro classes (the class is 86 to 200cc's regardless of stroke). So that bike is not some wonder trail bike, it is a maxed competition bike and it rides like it.

The wr250 could be construed as a bit easier to ride in tight situations because the power is mellower. Do the math, do you think the 450 feels like more of a handful because of 0.5 percent more weight or 80% more displacement?!?!? That all changes when the tight stuff gets you in a hole you have to climb out of it it (maybe when you are not in the right gear because you are battling rough terrain at the same time).

Just my 2 cent rant on those 200 pumpkins and this whole 250s are so much lighter thing. I am not saying everyone, but I think a lot of that 200 2t praise is just people parroting stuff they read on here. I think this because I did it and that's, in part, why my buddy bought that POS 200.




Your point is somewhat valid, but you failed to note he is comparing a YZ250f to a WR450 and that's a 40 lb. difference. You mention .5% difference in weight but it's more like 15% and while I love my WR450 as much as anyone, it's a big bike compared to his YZ250f. Anybody saying otherwise is not giving him correct info.

  • mvryder

Posted February 20, 2008 - 04:07 PM

#12

I agree. I missed that part. I would say the majority of 4 strokes, including a YZ250F is going to be a better trail bike than a 2t. It looks like a racy 250f could make a light weight trail bike.


Oh and I meant 5 percent, forgot to change that




WR450F 248
WR250F 234 -5.6% off wr450
YZ450F 219 -11.7% off wr450
YZ250F 204 -17.7% off wr450

  • Martian

Posted February 20, 2008 - 05:24 PM

#13

Thanks for the great replies to this post, a new bike is a lot of $$ so I want to make sure the one I buy is the one I'll ride for years to come. So looks like the WRs softer suspension, electric start in the 450's torque is the way to go. I'm sure I'll adjust to the weight difference. Thanks again for your input

  • tacotory

Posted February 20, 2008 - 05:56 PM

#14

Thanks for the great replies to this post, a new bike is a lot of $$ so I want to make sure the one I buy is the one I'll ride for years to come. So looks like the WRs softer suspension, electric start in the 450's torque is the way to go. I'm sure I'll adjust to the weight difference. Thanks again for your input


Just make sure you put a rekluse on your new wr450 and the fatigue issue won't be nearly as big a deal. I used to get tired in the tight stuff with my 450, but I think it was mainly because you are clutching so much. Problem solved with the rekluse.

  • Martian

Posted February 20, 2008 - 06:03 PM

#15

Just make sure you put a rekluse on your new wr450 and the fatigue issue won't be nearly as big a deal. I used to get tired in the tight stuff with my 450, but I think it was mainly because you are clutching so much. Problem solved with the rekluse.


I have a rekluse in the yz best mod ever for me anyhow I also have the rear hand brake love it.

  • SJMC_DON

Posted February 20, 2008 - 06:27 PM

#16

Thanks for the great replies to this post, a new bike is a lot of $$ so I want to make sure the one I buy is the one I'll ride for years to come. So looks like the WRs softer suspension, electric start in the 450's torque is the way to go. I'm sure I'll adjust to the weight difference. Thanks again for your input


Yes new bikes are $$$$ and you mentioned in your first post that the 08' WR's look sweet... Save money and find a new or barely used 07' because they are the same bike :)

As far as all this heavy bike vs. light bike in the tight woods sheet... Are you strong? You'll have to be because it is heavy and you are definitely gonna feel it when comparing it to your 250f... BUT I find my WR to be a great all around bike, I race it and win in an "A" class off road series that has everything from super gnarly tight stuff to wide open GP's and it continues to chew pumpkins up and spit them out:busted: I am 6'3", 210lbs and after the free mods and suspension upgrades I feel like I have a great all around bike.

At 170lbs, at least the thing is sprung correctly in stock form :applause:

  • dirtysouth

Posted February 20, 2008 - 06:38 PM

#17

Thanks for the great replies to this post, a new bike is a lot of $$ so I want to make sure the one I buy is the one I'll ride for years to come. So looks like the WRs softer suspension, electric start in the 450's torque is the way to go. I'm sure I'll adjust to the weight difference. Thanks again for your input


I pity tha fool that don't go fo fiddy.....B.A. Baracus

  • jpoehls

Posted February 20, 2008 - 07:53 PM

#18

Your height and weight are perfect for a 450, and not have to make suspension changes. Don't think twice, make the change. You will be in WR heaven if you go with the 07 or 08 WR or YZ450. Serious power!!!

  • Just_a_trail_rider

Posted February 20, 2008 - 10:19 PM

#19

Everyone seems to throw out those 200's as this great trail bike suggestion. How many people suggesting these bike have actually ridden one?? I have a 07 wr 450 and it feels fine in the "tight stuff". I have ridden an 08 wr250f for about 30 min as well. I did not notice a difference in weight, only in power. My friend has a ktm 200 and the the is a pain to ride all the time, it is not some magical trail bike. Seriously, it is cheaper to own and maintain engine wise but it is a a handful with a lot of difficult to use power. I regularly out ride my buddy in the tight stuff. I am tractoring though the tough stuff and he is screaming the engine spewing smoke and fanning the heck out of the clutch as i wait for him to catch up. I am less tired than he is because I have smooth tractable 4 stroke power.

This last weekend he brought out is 4 stroke klx 300 out and was right back on my rear tire through tight stuff and all. And he hadn't ridden it in a good number of months.

The whole point of those 200's is to get the most horsepower into the small bike offroad / enduro classes (the class is 86 to 200cc's regardless of stroke). So that bike is not some wonder trail bike, it is a maxed competition bike and it rides like it.

The wr250 could be construed as a bit easier to ride in tight situations because the power is mellower. Do the math, do you think the 450 feels like more of a handful because of 5 percent more weight or 80% more displacement?!?!? That all changes when the tight stuff gets you in a hole you have to climb out of it it (maybe when you are not in the right gear because you are battling rough terrain at the same time).

Just my 2 cent rant on those 200 pumpkins and this whole 250s are so much lighter thing. I am not saying everyone, but I think a lot of that 200 2t praise is just people parroting stuff they read on here. I think this because I did it and that's, in part, why my buddy bought that POS 200.


So what exactly does "tractable" mean? That sounds like something you read. I've never heard anyone actually use that word except the mfg's.

Regarding the 200's, 250's and 450's... I race D37 on my 05 wr450. It has plenty of power. I like the tight and technical stuff, but its not the best bike for it. Right next to me, or even in front of me, are plenty of bigger guys on ktm 200's , 250's or 250 four strokes that climb out of the same hole that I am in. I'm 5-9 and 210lbs.

Reading what you say implies that if you have a yz250f, then you won't be able to climb a hill. I have been at the bottom of and stuck on the side of some very nasty hills. I see all kinds of people climbing them on 200's, 250's, 450's and even 85's. I have yet to see a hill that a 250 won't climb with just a little more twist of the wrist.

Wouldn't the rekluse clutch kinda eliminate or reduce the need for the estart?

If you race or go for long hard rides, then lighter is always better.

  • brett_h

Posted February 21, 2008 - 07:28 AM

#20

Martian; I have a 2002 WR-300 and I ride with 250 2-strokes and 450's and I never lack power, is your bike jetted good? What else have you done? Have good exhaust? Powernow?
Another thing to consider is that since being introduced the YZ-250F now makes about 5 more H.P. Maybe a new WR-250F with a big-bore would be the ticket. I will never go back to a big 4-stroke.
BTW, I am 43, 6'4" and 190 lbs.




 
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