winter dual sporting?


17 replies to this topic
  • xr650Lbenbriand

Posted October 03, 2007 - 09:27 AM

#1

I was wondering if there was a way to get my bike setup for winter and i want to drive it on the road and would like to stud my tires so i could go on the ice if i wanted to. I dont know if i can get normal car studs or not, the normal ice screws would get all messed up wouldint you think. what should i do?

thanks

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted October 03, 2007 - 01:53 PM

#2

I don't think car-type ice studs will do much for you.
They don't seem to do much for cars, for that matter.

You might get away with ice screws on the street for a short hop, but they'll rip out or slide and smooth off very fast.

Dave

  • xr650Lbenbriand

Posted October 03, 2007 - 02:41 PM

#3

i think if i put only a few screws and only drive slow to get to the lake i will be good it is a 9 mile drive one way paved or 12 mile dirt road so i could stick to the dirt roads for most of the places i go.

  • xr650Lbenbriand

Posted October 03, 2007 - 02:44 PM

#4

I wonder if car studs would get you from point a to b on the ice (not racing) fairly good

  • bosshog

Posted October 03, 2007 - 03:32 PM

#5

studs are quite slippery on bare pavement so be carful. A car tire has much more contact with the road than just the studs so not an issue so much for them. Nobby tires don't have much contact area as it is, once you stud them there's even less. Now if you stuck to the dirt road you might do alright.

  • frankiewhipit

Posted October 03, 2007 - 04:48 PM

#6

Ice screws are not happy on anything other than ice, the short hop to the lake on asphalt will dull the edges & pull them out (in my experience)

  • Descalzo

Posted October 04, 2007 - 02:55 AM

#7

A long, long, time ago I recall reading an article in a mag & they were putting small (short) little sheet metal screws in the knobs of old knpbby tires & running around on the ice. The hex head of the screw acted like a "stud", but with slightly better bite (so they said). They were also using some sort of liner in the tires to keep the screws from puncturing the carcass of the tire & poking holes in the tube, but I don't remember what.

Also, doesn't IRC(?) make a "pre-studded" knobby for just this sort of thing? I'd swear I saw those somewhere...

  • xr650Lbenbriand

Posted October 04, 2007 - 03:52 AM

#8

yea they are like $500. a peice!

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted October 04, 2007 - 08:04 AM

#9

Sounds like the trellborg.

D

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  • rm298z

Posted October 04, 2007 - 03:35 PM

#10

Ice screws will rip out on any length of dirt or road more than 10 feet. Its easy enough just to throw the bike in the back of a pickup and drive to the ice. Or ride snowmobile trails. Any type of screw, even cars studs would be dangerous. Steel against pavement is as slippery as rubber on ice. Don't do it.

  • justanotherider

Posted October 23, 2007 - 08:35 PM

#11

Ben:

You can stud bike tires with automotive studs. The normal steel studs used in car tires aren't very useful on bikes. They don't grip well, and they wear out quickly. We use automotive rally studs, (with carbide inserts) and mount them with more of the head sticking out than recommended for cars, (about 3/16").

They are slippery on pavement, and I wouldn't recommend riding 9 miles on pavement. When we have to ride paved roads, we stick to the shoulders where it's icy, (or at least snowy) to get better grip and preserve the studs. Frozen gravel isn't quite so hard on the studs, (even tungsten carbide has it's limits) and offers better grip than pavement.

You will have to pre-drill your tires to the required depth for the particular studs you buy, clean the studs well, (boiling in water gets the oil and crud off them) use Black Max glue, (made by Locktite, or whoever they are these days) to glue the studs in, (hellish exspensive that glue) and insert the studs with the correct automotive stud gun, (they come in differing diameters).

In effect, you are manufacturing your own 'Trellaborg' tires. The cost of the studs isn't too steep, (~$125 for two tires) but unless you can borrow a stud gun, the price of that toy will make you think at least twice about this project. If you have to buy a stud gun, you will end up spending about as much as you would buying Trellaborg tires, unless you can get a used one cheap.

The beauty of building your own ice tires this way is that you can mount the studs a bit further into the tire than Trellaborg does, which makes them more useful on ice, (Trellaborgs work better in snow than on ice). The down-side of this type of tire is that it does not work in deep snow like a Trellaborg does - in fact, with only 3/16" of stud sticking out of your tire, you won't go anywhere in deep snow.

I've done ice racing on racing screws, which work really well on ice, and not well on much else. I've done long distance tours on ice roads with automotive rally studs, which work well on ice roads; but don't give that race quality grip of racing screws. I've seen tires studded with race screws used on hard-frozen sled trails successfully, but go no-where in deep snow. Having said all that, ice tire design and use, like most things motorcycle are always exercises in compromise. You can make them work really well in one circumstance; but they don't work so well in others.

If you just want to ride on a river or lake, the cheapest solution would be to screw in some steel CMRC race screws, and take your bike to the lake on your pickup truck.

justanotherider

  • Smoke Eater

Posted October 25, 2007 - 05:30 AM

#12

I highly recommend riding with ice tires on a frozen lake at least once in your life. It's a blast!

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted October 25, 2007 - 06:12 AM

#13

Riding on a frozen lake WITHOUT studs teaches you the meaning of 'throttle control'. There is a surprisingly large amount of traction avail. as long as you do not spin/slide the tires.

Its also something you have to try at least once!

Dave

  • Yamaha WR400F

Posted December 10, 2007 - 04:37 PM

#14

justanotherider

How do you go about gluing the stud in?
And what is it's affect on the stud gun?
I have my own gun, and stud my own tires, but have never used glue.
Thanks

  • algunn

Posted December 10, 2007 - 05:01 PM

#15

Make sure you hose off your bike (which I know is tough in the winter) if you get any slush on it that has road salt in it. I used to ride my 3-wheeler on the roads during snow storms and not clean off the frozen slush and the exhaust header eventually rotted away on a garage kept machine with few hours.

  • xr650Lbenbriand

Posted December 12, 2007 - 09:23 AM

#16

that sounds like a good idea with the stud gun i think i will try that , I know a guy with a stud gun but where can i get the studs at?

  • Yamaha WR400F

Posted December 12, 2007 - 10:08 AM

#17

I found the glue at one of our vender's.
Loctite 380 Black Max Glue.
1oz bottle- $20.00, man that is expensive!

  • Yamaha WR400F

Posted December 12, 2007 - 11:25 AM

#18

that sounds like a good idea with the stud gun i think i will try that , I know a guy with a stud gun but where can i get the studs at?



Look on Ebay.





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