yz350f??


76 replies to this topic
  • grayracer513

Posted January 04, 2010 - 12:48 AM

#61

the manufacturers showd by changing to 4 strokes they dont care much about our needs, they care about or money.

The 4T MX bike was built in it's current numbers because there was a market demand for them. The 2T models that were available in 1998 stayed available until they were no longer commercially viable, in some cases, and in others, they're still around. The customer voted it this way, no one legislated it as the AMA is attempting to do.

  • nephic

Posted January 04, 2010 - 10:34 AM

#62

Create the 350 class at the amateur level, and allow it to grow as it will, if it will. Then, you can bring it into the Pro world.[/QUOTE]

I may be in the minority, but I honestly don't think that a 450 "is too much" and I think that the "funner" moniker only applies in certain situations. 350 is a great idea, buy a big bore kit, you can try it out. I personally love the smaller bikes in the woods, but that's why I own a 125, it's way fun, when I don't have to race it. 350 better? Maybe the smaller bike is fun. It's fun untill you realize that you really can occasionally use all the power the 450 has, and at times, even I, a rank piece o nothing amateur have my 450 WFO. It is at those times, usually on specific sandy straightways or corners, or maybe the uphill step up after a corner at Lakewood, that I really don't want a 350. If I wanted it, I'd own KX250f with an Athena and all the other goodies to try and ring a little extra horse out of the smaller machine.

Grey makes a good point about giving them the option of opening a class for the 350. They did it with the Honda 150's in our amateur racing here. That class died here in Wyoming, because frankly, it was a niche. 350's will be a tough niche. I race guys on 250's, 290's, 450's, 530's, 500's etc...I'm betting that I see very few KTM 350's lining up. There will be some, but no more than the number of combined vets lining up with big bore kits on 250's. And probably close to the number of kids running "cheater" kits on their 250's up here.

In a recent interview with Mitch Payton, that can be viewed on the TWMX website, they talked about the 350 idea. Mitch knows what everyone else does. People will need to spend more to race a 350 then they need to on a 450 class machine. As Mitch said, "basically a high compression piston and a pipe" is all people need to add to get to that threshold of useable, tractable, power that most of us mortals can actually race.

  • myoung

Posted January 04, 2010 - 01:49 PM

#63

I'm confused, is there really that many people out there that think their 450 is too much to handle? I race an '09 YZ450 in the Old Timers as an amateur and there are sections on some tracks where I'm in fifth gear, wide open, sometimes wishing I had changed to a smaller rear sprocket for the day. These machines are powerful, but come on, they're not that powerful. :cheers:

Just look at the number of people putting big bore kits in them looking to get more............hell, there's 16 year old kids out there tearing it up with these things on practice days! My ride at 16 was an '82 YZ490! Am I supposed to believe there are significant numbers of 20-50 year olds complaining about the 450's? Please........I don't think so.

No doubt a 350 could weigh less, but let's say Yamaha did make one, they would just put it in an existing chassis and the weight difference would be minimal. Same would go for all the others. Then you have the reliability disparity if they start squeezing 450 size HP from a smaller displacement. To me the 450 fits the sweet spot of reliable power too well to go away from.

The new KTM 350 will sell, no doubt. But lets face it, it's something new. Everything new flies out the door in this game...........well, almost everything, there was the Cannondale. :smirk: My guess is, once the honeymoon is over, there will be plenty that go back to a 450 when the repair bills start rolling in. To be fair, if that doesn't happen, then I will concede that 350's have a chance to replace the 450's. At least with the new KTM we will actually have something to look at that could possibly shine some light on the debate. :moon:

  • twenty34

Posted January 04, 2010 - 09:57 PM

#64

I'm confused, is there really that many people out there that think their 450 is too much to handle? I race an '09 YZ450 in the Old Timers as an amateur and there are sections on some tracks where I'm in fifth gear, wide open, sometimes wishing I had changed to a smaller rear sprocket for the day. These machines are powerful, but come on, they're not that powerful. :moon:

I used to think like you. Heck, I was running WFO on my 450 at my favorite GP MX track and wanted more. Well, get a streetbike. MX is won in the turns and I guess you can say jumps, but there aren't many old school tracks out there these days. Well GH is and maybe Pala...Ok, maybe there are, but that's not the point. You need to slow down. LOL.

I'm sure you are a Vet like myself so who cares about all those jumps and stuff, we don't ride that anyway, right?

Well, how many fans show up to a national vs a SX race? See where the advertising and dollars are spent? Heck, I'd bet JS uses 2 gears an entire SX race. Do you really think he needs a 450?

BTW: I used to ride 150+ down the OC toll-roads frequently. Did I really need a 150+HP streetbike? It's not about the sheer HP, if so, Gray would have KR 750cc 2 stroke in his garage.

  • grayracer513

Posted January 04, 2010 - 10:26 PM

#65

I'd bet JS uses 2 gears an entire SX race. Do you really think he needs a 450?

If he had to ride a 50 HP 350, he'd need at least 3, though, which is one of the things I like about the 450.

... if so, Gray would have KR 750cc 2 stroke in his garage.

Hmm. There is a certain twisted appeal in the ATK Intimidator.

  • myoung

Posted January 04, 2010 - 11:44 PM

#66

I used to think like you. Heck, I was running WFO on my 450 at my favorite GP MX track and wanted more. Well, get a streetbike. MX is won in the turns and I guess you can say jumps, but there aren't many old school tracks out there these days. Well GH is and maybe Pala...Ok, maybe there are, but that's not the point. You need to slow down. LOL.

I'm sure you are a Vet like myself so who cares about all those jumps and stuff, we don't ride that anyway, right?


Wrong actually...........I do care about all those jumps and stuff because I suck at jumps and I want to get better.

I agree, you cant do 5th gear, WFO on every track. The point I was trying to make is there are sections on some tracks you can and still want more. If these 450's were supposedly 'too much', that should never happen unless you were the fastest guy on two wheels, not an average amateur like me. The power and speed being there when you need it is great. When there are times that I feel there's not enough, it tells me I can't afford to lose any and a push by the powers that be to go that direction would be a step backwards. That's just my opinion on the whole 'they're too powerful' debate.


I have been riding a long time but only been racing a short time now. I still have a lot of things I need to work on and believe me, slowing down is not one of them. LOL

Right now I'm keeping up just fine in the amateur class, but there are still sections I need to pick up the pace. When I watch the experts and masters race, they are not going slower than me anywhere on the track.

  • phantom451

Posted September 13, 2014 - 05:46 PM

#67

this started in 07.  we are in the end of 2014 quite a long time and no yz350f????? im waiting yamaha!

 

let it roll! build a 350f. guys asking about it for 7 years. long enough 2016 yz350f id buy one so will others, get to it!



  • DBOBYZ450

Posted September 15, 2014 - 12:35 PM

#68

After reading through this, first i feel the whole ama controlling the field being total bull.  :banghead:  :smashpc:

 

second as anyone said no matter the bike the better rider prevails.  :facepalm:

 

another thing , i only weigh 130 pounds soaking wet, i rarely touch a track , and i ride single track all day in the woods on my 450 and ive road the 250s and hate them pesonally . I dont feel the bike is to much, no matter what a good rider should be able to control what they have under them, the bike doesnt make the rider the rider makes the bike, with that said why take away a market that is great for climbing, with  a heavier flywheel it becomes a woods machine in my eye and throw in some new lower powered bike, i just dont get it. :naughty:

 

if i had a vote , which it would be cool to see a pool on this thread, the vote would be keep the 450s and if they feel the need add another class between, they would just be pulling in more competitors and another step for them to advance ,in fact lets just bring the big bore 500s 2t back! :smashpc:



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  • 250premixer

Posted September 16, 2014 - 03:24 PM

#69

is yamaha putting out a production yz350f in the near future? thats what my stealer told me that they were trying to get yamaha to make a 350f cuz the 450 is too powerful, and the 250f is not powerful enough. dont know if its gonna happen yet, just wonder what u guys think about it. anyone who'd buy this 350f if it was a production bike? cheers

no

  • 250premixer

Posted September 16, 2014 - 03:43 PM

#70

As an off-road rider/racer I'd buy one in a heartbeat if it weighed the same as a 250F. The 250F didn't have enough umph and the 450F wears me out too fast. Right now my YZ250 2-stroke fits the bill on the tight nasty singletrack.

how would it weigh the same it's bigger -.-

  • 250premixer

Posted September 16, 2014 - 03:45 PM

#71

450 outdoors 250 2-stroke indoors...problem solved.

Make the bikes quieter not one or two dbs, but a big drop like 89 db and that will slow the 450 down plus your ears will not be ringing after an indoor race.


Designing a new model I doubt is cheap and who do you think the cost will be past on to...guess look in the mirror. The YZ400 was the perfect engine size like mentioned above. You can not tell me a factory Yamaha YZ350F will not be putting out as much HP as 450, but at the sake of reliability.

I can tell you. It's smaller so it won't make as much torque or horsepower.

  • 250premixer

Posted September 16, 2014 - 03:54 PM

#72

I second the stock bike idea.

yeah cuz stock suspension can handle supercross tripples

  • 250premixer

Posted September 16, 2014 - 04:01 PM

#73

this started in 07. we are in the end of 2014 quite a long time and no yz350f????? im waiting yamaha!

let it roll! build a 350f. guys asking about it for 7 years. long enough 2016 yz350f id buy one so will others, get to it!

If 350s were better than 450s why did AS29 stop riding one? Exactly a 450 is superior. Unless they added a 350 class which I don't see happening. What they need to do is add a 250 2 stroke outdoor class with 6 races like the old 500 class

  • phantom451

Posted September 16, 2014 - 05:13 PM

#74

If 350s were better than 450s why did AS29 stop riding one? Exactly a 450 is superior. Unless they added a 350 class which I don't see happening. What they need to do is add a 250 2 stroke outdoor class with 6 races like the old 500 class

isnt about better its about what i want to ride. i race yz250 2 stroke, i race 450f kx i know what good is,i run best on the kxf but i also had to put more money in the 450 to get the suspension up to par for my riding where the yz250 was stock and felt better than kxf after i set it up like all the other yz's i owned. a 350f is what i want and i want a yz. 

 

I would just like to see 2 strokes out in the nationals in both classes no matter what the size. i dont care if its 250,300,325,350 if 2 strokes can be out there than lets see them run against the other bikes. i would be more interested in top 20 riders then, instead of just worrying about the top 10.



  • ah665

Posted September 16, 2014 - 06:05 PM

#75

I liked reading everyone's opinions. It is certainly an interesting debate. I am one of the people that would really give a 350 a hard look. I run open/vet classes, for one and I constantly debate on whether or not to get another 450, stick with a 250f etc. If Yamaha were able to make a 350 in it's current platform, with a weigh that was somewhere in the middle of the 250/450, chances are I would by it. I personally love 250fs and the 14+ yz250f is super-fast, for a stock bike. So even if a 350 had more of a revvy, 250f-type powerband than a typical 450 power spread, I'd be ok with it. It would just be nice to have a little more power than the 250f puts out w/o having to feel like I'm lugging a bigger bike around in 3rd gear all of the time. It truly would be the perfect bike, for what I would want. As it is right now, I am pretty set on getting a 15 250f when the year is up and that will have to do, for now. 



  • 250premixer

Posted September 17, 2014 - 07:25 AM

#76

I liked reading everyone's opinions. It is certainly an interesting debate. I am one of the people that would really give a 350 a hard look. I run open/vet classes, for one and I constantly debate on whether or not to get another 450, stick with a 250f etc. If Yamaha were able to make a 350 in it's current platform, with a weigh that was somewhere in the middle of the 250/450, chances are I would by it. I personally love 250fs and the 14+ yz250f is super-fast, for a stock bike. So even if a 350 had more of a revvy, 250f-type powerband than a typical 450 power spread, I'd be ok with it. It would just be nice to have a little more power than the 250f puts out w/o having to feel like I'm lugging a bigger bike around in 3rd gear all of the time. It truly would be the perfect bike, for what I would want. As it is right now, I am pretty set on getting a 15 250f when the year is up and that will have to do, for now.

Get a big bore kit for your 250 then. All a 350 is, is a 350 motor in a 250 chassis.

  • ah665

Posted September 17, 2014 - 08:02 AM

#77

Get a big bore kit for your 250 then. All a 350 is, is a 350 motor in a 250 chassis.

Ya that is a good point. I briefly thought of going that route on my current 250f but then decided to get the GYTR complete head instead. It was a nice upgrade but certainly not the power that a 350 would put out (especially since now the stock 14+ 250f is just about as fast as my mod 10). But I was just saying if a 350 was in dealerships as an option, whenever new bike time rolled around, it would be nice to buy that bike and run pretty much stock. That was the allure of the 450, for me. Buy it, ride it. Motor is good as-is. A 350 would maybe be the same thing but lighter weight and I can ride how I am used to riding a 250f. 







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