Sub-Frame lower bolt side plate, right side-XR650R


9 replies to this topic
  • philipstjohn

Posted July 18, 2007 - 09:31 PM

#1

Anyone have a problem with a "sub frame fixed nut? My right side "lower sub frame nut", which is the lower bolt connection to the right side number plate, is spinning? Any ideas on where to go from here? :thumbsup:

  • Billahjack

Posted July 19, 2007 - 08:03 AM

#2

I believe that is a Riv-Nut (Rivet Nut). There are a few fixes on the internet if you do a search for fixing them.

  • jayrider2003

Posted July 19, 2007 - 08:04 AM

#3

When the Nut Cert is installed, the inserted end is compressed toward the head by tightening the associated bolt. The center of the Nut Cert expands and wedges against the insertion hole.

If you place a nut on the bolt before you screw it into the Nut Cert (and use two wrenches), it provides a surface to prevent the Nut Cert from turning while tightening the bolt. It should re-wedge. Your current Nut Cert could already be fully compressed, then you would need to purchase a new one. I bought a pak from our local ACE Hardware.

  • philipstjohn

Posted July 19, 2007 - 08:32 AM

#4

When the Nut Cert is installed, the inserted end is compressed toward the head by tightening the associated bolt. The center of the Nut Cert expands and wedges against the insertion hole.

If you place a nut on the bolt before you screw it into the Nut Cert (and use two wrenches), it provides a surface to prevent the Nut Cert from turning while tightening the bolt. It should re-wedge. Your current Nut Cert could already be fully compressed, then you would need to purchase a new one. I bought a pak from our local ACE Hardware.


As Billahjack stated, I did find info on replacing the nut, but how do I get it out? When I bought the bike the bolt and nut were spinning, and I have never been able to get the side cover off yet. I am trying get the bolt out to replace the Nut Cert without trashing the side plate? Any ideas? :confused:

  • philipstjohn

Posted July 19, 2007 - 08:45 AM

#5

When the Nut Cert is installed, the inserted end is compressed toward the head by tightening the associated bolt. The center of the Nut Cert expands and wedges against the insertion hole.

If you place a nut on the bolt before you screw it into the Nut Cert (and use two wrenches), it provides a surface to prevent the Nut Cert from turning while tightening the bolt. It should re-wedge. Your current Nut Cert could already be fully compressed, then you would need to purchase a new one. I bought a pak from our local ACE Hardware.


Is this what I am looking at once I get the bolt out? Sounds like what you you mentioned above?

http://www.fjr1300.i...ivnut-tool.html

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  • BWB63

Posted July 19, 2007 - 10:20 AM

#6

If you can't make the nut seat enough to stop spinning, I have done sevral different ways of stopping the spinning nut, some worked and some didn't depending on why it is spinning. I have drilled a hole and JB weld to stop it from spinning but, if the bolt is siezed to spinning nut I tool for compressing lugs onto big wire and compressed the sub frame around the nut enough to hold it the worked the bolt out of the nut in the frame.

  • jayrider2003

Posted July 19, 2007 - 11:54 AM

#7

The fjr1300 article is what they look like, but the walls of the aluminum subframe are thicker, and in the case of my failure, the Nut Cert had expanded against the sides rather than lipping over like it should have.

Since you have an '06, I would think it was never fully seated. Try prying outward from behind your number plate, and see if the lip of the Nut Cert/Riv Nut will come outward enough to get a small blade under that, or that it catches a little and the bolt be removed. The whole thing may just pull through the hole, and not alter the hole at all, if the original install was marginal.

  • philipstjohn

Posted July 19, 2007 - 02:11 PM

#8

The fjr1300 article is what they look like, but the walls of the aluminum subframe are thicker, and in the case of my failure, the Nut Cert had expanded against the sides rather than lipping over like it should have.

Since you have an '06, I would think it was never fully seated. Try prying outward from behind your number plate, and see if the lip of the Nut Cert/Riv Nut will come outward enough to get a small blade under that, or that it catches a little and the bolt be removed. The whole thing may just pull through the hole, and not alter the hole at all, if the original install was marginal.


I finally got it off! I could not pry it, tweak it, jam it, etc. to get it to lock up so I could back out the bolt, but I was able to get the tip of a hand hack saw blade in there to cut it off, saving the side plate. The only glitch in removing it was the other half of what was cut off inside the frame fell down into the sub frame. Hope it does not rattle around! :mad: However, there seems to be no damage to the hole or sub frame. Do you have the info on the size of the Riv nut/Nut Cert I need, as well as the bolt size I cut off? Please let me know if you can. Thanks...:applause:
I was told along the way a possible fix to this problem is a high speed impact wrench- the theory is you spin the bolt and nut at high speed until there is enough heat to expand the nut to lock up to be able to back out the bolt... but this did not work in my case...

  • jayrider2003

Posted July 19, 2007 - 04:56 PM

#9

Honda number for that bolt is 90106-MM9-000, a 6mm flange shoulder bolt.
Double check that, I just looked on Service Honda.

Honda doesn't show these inserts as separate from the subframe.

They have various names; the ones I have are Marson Klik Rivet-Nuts.
Stock No. 47387

These are slightly longer than the tubing is deep, and I started mushrooming it out while still placing it in a final position, to have the most gripping surface. Worked so far.

  • philipstjohn

Posted July 19, 2007 - 06:21 PM

#10

Honda number for that bolt is 90106-MM9-000, a 6mm flange shoulder bolt.
Double check that, I just looked on Service Honda.

Honda doesn't show these inserts as separate from the subframe.

They have various names; the ones I have are Marson Klik Rivet-Nuts.
Stock No. 47387

These are slightly longer than the tubing is deep, and I started mushrooming it out while still placing it in a final position, to have the most gripping surface. Worked so far.


I looked it up as well...many times it lists the bolt size, in this case just the part #:banghead: . I am sure there is a "standard size" with the riv-nut, for this application. I will continue to search for info...I will keep you informed
Thanks guys for all the help!:thumbsup:





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