Is my oil being a little over full hurting my bike?



17 replies to this topic
  • BlueHondaEater

Posted April 30, 2000 - 04:47 PM

#1

The oil in my WR400F is about 3/16ths of an inch over the full mark, is this going to damage my bike or should I drain some out? Any advice would be greatly appreciated!

  • Kevin_in_New_Hampshire

Posted April 30, 2000 - 06:22 PM

#2

Here is a quick story for you. Is it fact, fiction or coincidence? I drove my bike on a Saturday after doing tons of winter maintenance and mods: YZ timing, de-octopus, airbox, greased all swingarm bearings, YZ gas tank and IMS seat, suspension tinkering, and valve adjustments. The bike ran fine. After that ride, I drained oil out of the engine drain plug ONLY, and NOT the frame drain. I have been racing/riding 2 strokes since Nixon was in office (He was one of our presidents) and well I just forgot. I started the bike and checked the oil, it was a little over. The next day I took it out. Within 15 minutes, the bike CHIRPPED twice both times stalling out the engine...hmmm...not real good. I re-fired the bike and slowly drove back to the van and home. I drained out the oil and found an extra 500 - 600 cc's of oil in it. I then tore down the entire top end. I found some scoring in the cylinder walls. However the piston was fine...I didn't expect that. I put it all back together and took it out yesterday. It chirped again resulting in the engine stalling. I re-started and the bike ran fine. Then I pulled off the entire end piece of the silencer and found the brutal low end torque I have read about but never experienced. The moral of this story is if you drained from both holes and put in the 1500 - 1600 cc's of oil, you should be OK. It would have been a lot cheaper and quicker if I drained all the oil and added the right amount, instead of dishing out $45.00 in gaskets and replacing the oil. But I did find out the hard way many new things about 4 strokes and cam chains


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99 WR w/ almost every mod known to man, 84 Kaw 900 Ninja, '82 Honda CB750F clothes hanger, '84 Honda Z50 "Berm Destroyer". Always thinkin' "Hell, this worked on my 2 stroke!!"

  • BlueHondaEater

Posted April 30, 2000 - 06:44 PM

#3

Originally posted by Kevin in New Hampshire:
Here is a quick story for you. Is it fact, fiction or coincidence? I drove my bike on a Saturday after doing tons of winter maintenance and mods: YZ timing, de-octopus, airbox, greased all swingarm bearings, YZ gas tank and IMS seat, suspension tinkering, and valve adjustments. The bike ran fine. After that ride, I drained oil out of the engine drain plug ONLY, and NOT the frame drain. I have been racing/riding 2 strokes since Nixon was in office (He was one of our presidents) and well I just forgot. I started the bike and checked the oil, it was a little over. The next day I took it out. Within 15 minutes, the bike CHIRPPED twice both times stalling out the engine...hmmm...not real good. I re-fired the bike and slowly drove back to the van and home. I drained out the oil and found an extra 500 - 600 cc's of oil in it. I then tore down the entire top end. I found some scoring in the cylinder walls. However the piston was fine...I didn't expect that. I put it all back together and took it out yesterday. It chirped again resulting in the engine stalling. I re-started and the bike ran fine. Then I pulled off the entire end piece of the silencer and found the brutal low end torque I have read about but never experienced. The moral of this story is if you drained from both holes and put in the 1500 - 1600 cc's of oil, you should be OK. It would have been a lot cheaper and quicker if I drained all the oil and added the right amount, instead of dishing out $45.00 in gaskets and replacing the oil. But I did find out the hard way many new things about 4 strokes and cam chains


So did your engine get damaged or almost damaged from being over filled or what I'm not sure I understand?

  • Bill

Posted May 01, 2000 - 02:38 AM

#4

Kevin,

Not sure I understand. What pipe do you have? What did you take off to get moe low end? and what does that have to do with the oil level?

Bill

  • Kevin_in_New_Hampshire

Posted May 01, 2000 - 08:16 AM

#5

The pipe part was just for the hell of it. It has nothing to do w/ the oil.

I do not know if the high oil level caused the damage. When I checked the dipstick, the oil level was barely over. I assume it was all in the engine. With the oil being that high in the engine, could it have caused the engine stalling as the crank rotated through all that oil? I do not know. I do know it seems to run OK now. Is this just a coincidence?

  • Bill

Posted May 01, 2000 - 08:23 AM

#6

Kevin,

Since the bike utilizes a dry sump oiling system. I would not think that overfilling would cause stalling. I would think it was coincidence.

  • GJ

Posted May 01, 2000 - 09:29 PM

#7

I somehow made a mistake and added too much oil after a compleate change. I found it out 3 rides later when I checked the oil level. The oil was about 3/4 of an inch over the "full" mark on the dip stick. I freaked and instantly change the oil again, being sure to add the proper ammount.
But- for those 3 rides the oil was way full and it didn't hurt my bike a bit......

GJ

  • Kevin_in_New_Hampshire

Posted May 01, 2000 - 09:32 PM

#8

Maybe I have something floating around inside my engine...???

  • monarch

Posted May 02, 2000 - 04:25 AM

#9

to much oil is worse than low oil. i'm not sure what damage it can cause. call your dealer

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  • JamesD

Posted May 02, 2000 - 11:50 AM

#10

Depending on how much too much, too much oil can cause serious problems.

If it's too high in a car it can foam from contact with the crank. Bubbles are sucked into the oil pump and oil delivery to other parts of the motor is limited. That's just one way it can cause damage.

  • mcarp

Posted May 02, 2000 - 02:57 PM

#11

3/16th of an inch is probably OK for a short time. This is only a few ounces. By now I'm sure you have drained, checked, and re-checked.

Too much oil is a bad thing. I am not quite sure what parts may be damaged, but the extra load the crank has to turn through may eat some power and maybe the crank itself.

You'll be fine, don't worry

  • MotoGreg

Posted May 02, 2000 - 05:42 PM

#12

I don't think the crank would be spinning in the oil as it would in a normal engine. This is a dry sump system so the extra oil would probably be in the sump (frame).

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'99 WR400
'92 GSXR 7/11
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  • Matt_Porritt

Posted May 05, 2000 - 02:15 AM

#13

to much oil is worse than low oil. i'm not sure what damage it can cause


No to be rude but.. BOLLOX!!
The oil is stored in the frame right..
If the oil is only 1/2 full in the frame (resivior) then it gets cycled through the quicker and 'wears-out' quicker.
Overfull will just cycle the full amount of oil slower.
Being a dry sump its doesn't matter.. its not like there is a pressure change in the sump like a wetsump engine.

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--
**Ride it like you Stole it!**
Matt Porritt
99 YZ400F
Rubber Chicken Racing

[This message has been edited by Matt Porritt (edited 05-05-2000).]

  • Guest_Guest_*

Posted May 05, 2000 - 05:54 AM

#14

In addition to my WR400 I have a 1999 XR400. I rode it for the first 200Km with the oil that the dealer prepped it with. It takes two litres, they put in four! I couldn't believe it when I did my first oil change. The bike runs fine, in fact is stronger than other XR400's I have ridden. The oil came out completely clean - no shavings etc. I hope double the oil didn't do anything bad; it sure seems ok.

  • Kevin_in_New_Hampshire

Posted May 05, 2000 - 01:52 PM

#15

When my engine was .5 liter overfilled, the dipstick showed a hair over the full mark. Is the frame I.D. large enough to show a minimal overfilled condition? I guessed it was in the engine, because I didn't see it in the frame. This was after the warmup to distribute the oil throughout the engine.

Also, if the bike sits long enough, doesn't the level in the frame drop?

If the frame is too full, does the head effect of the oil affect the pump in any way? I recall the supply pump to be a gear type pump which is a positive displacement pump. This shouldn't affect the suction or discharge head of the pump. Obviously the volumetric flow rate of the pump is such that a level is maintained in the frame while the engine (oil paths) are full. Is this a dual acting pump, where the oil is physically pumped from the engine back into the frame? If this is the case, if there is too much oil in the engine or frame, how is the happy medium created, where there is not excessive oil in the frame or engine?

When I drained the oil out of my engine (after it screeched and stalled out twice), the oil was dark. This oil had maybe 15 minutes on it. When I drained the frame, this oil was still gold...&%$#@!???


[This message has been edited by Kevin in New Hampshire (edited 05-05-2000).]

  • Guest_Guest_*

Posted May 05, 2000 - 04:34 PM

#16

It;s done sell it.
just kidding i ran my bike over full for 100 miles and i was half a qt. over all it did is oil the chain by way of the berther tube no smoke no noise.Still running geart.
monty

  • Matt_Porritt

Posted May 05, 2000 - 11:31 PM

#17

When I drained the oil out of my engine (after it screeched and stalled out twice), the oil was dark. This oil had maybe 15 minutes on it. When I drained the frame, this oil was still gold...&%$#@!???


&%$#@! is right! :eek
Sounds like you have a little problem. (r big prob)
If the engine oil was dark but the frame oil was still clean then there is a problem with the return from the oil pump.
Either the line is blocked, pump is not working properly or the oil filter may have been installed backwards possibly.
I always crack the fitting the goes into the head and the return pipe fitting up the top of the frame.

Let us know if you have pressure at the return and the head.

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--
**Ride it like you Stole it!**
Matt Porritt
99 YZ400F
Rubber Chicken Racing

  • Kevin_in_New_Hampshire

Posted May 06, 2000 - 06:51 AM

#18

Excellent point Matt. Checking the return and supply oil supply paths makes much more sense than just the supply.
I kick myself for not "thinking outside the box".




 
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