Quiet XR650R exhaust?


118 replies to this topic
  • XRR-kat

Posted March 20, 2007 - 06:13 PM

#81

Thump,
Got the video....that's what I'm talking about !!!
I can dream, I'll have to dream...
Loved the throaty (you say XRs Only header & White E series silencer) roar and roosting through the sand in a State vehicle park ??!! Only in California!

You know, Thump, getting your tip from abby would be a "pass-around". I would appreciate it !

BTW, just got word from the British Moriwaki distributor, revolutionracing that I won't have to find another 48 (of 50) buyers to group buy (http://www.advrider....ad.php?t=210530 )
a Moriwaki exhaust for the XR650. Moriwaki just decided today to resume production of the XR exhaust !
So I called back to Big Valley Honda (800.311.4284) and asked Justin to re-order the exhaust for me. He's checking on pricing and schedule.

Cpt Ron on the linked site described his Moriwaki as not as loud as the HRC tip....not saying much but its the right direction.

  • Thumpage

Posted March 21, 2007 - 07:35 AM

#82

Thump,
Got the video....that's what I'm talking about !!!
I can dream, I'll have to dream...
Loved the throaty (you say XRs Only header & White E series silencer) roar and roosting through the sand in a State vehicle park ??!! Only in California!

You know, Thump, getting your tip from abby would be a "pass-around". I would appreciate it !


I am glad you liked the video. The other bike with the full exhaust had a White Bros R4 muffler though, not the E- series. But to mention the old E-Series 'Promeg' mufflers, they can give quite a roar themselves also if not used with less than 12 disks or silent insert. I currently run the Old E-series Promeg muffler on a FMF Hi-Flo header and it is a great exhaust combo setup. The original E-series Promeg or s-bend mufflers are no longer available though.
The Moriwaki system is nicely made. Hopefully they will keep making them again so that the guys running their system can have replacements if needed. I don't know whether other mufflers will work on their header.
I would have to say that Pismo Beach is a borderline park to have a louder exhaust. It has a fairly large surrounding mass somewhat away from the general population, so that is what makes it a park where it appears informally allowed. It is at other dune areas in the middle of nowhere in the desert where it can be much more of an accepted thing where rangers would most likely never check sound levels. I think they are more concerned with registration itself at those areas.

  • drop

Posted March 21, 2007 - 09:48 AM

#83

Can you post the video for all to see/hear?

  • Thumpage

Posted March 21, 2007 - 02:15 PM

#84

Can you post the video for all to see/hear?


I can do that. I will give a link to the one I sent to XRR-kat of two XR650Rs at Pismo beach. You will notice another video there at Dumont's Competition Hill.
Now remember, in the Pismo video the white tanked bike of a riding buddy's, had the full exhaust consisting of a XRs Only header and a White Bros R4 muffler. My red tanked bike had a stock header & muffler with what I term the 'Stage 3' modification as dicussed earlier in this thread. You can hear them side by side and seperately in the 2 scene video.
In the second Dumont vid, it is my bike again with the stock header but at that later time it had the White Bros E-Series Promeg muffler. I was running no backplate but had 12 disks and the endcap/tip still in place, so it was loud.
If one of you find them entertaining enough to want to share them in a main thread for the XR650R guys, be my guest. The XR650Rs are great in the dunes, :applause: . Maybe the video camera man/producer will catch a peak of his work and make note of it. He roams these parts....:lol: A few guys might have seen these two short vids elsewhere already, some time ago. :eek:
http://www.putfile.com/docapoc/media

  • drop

Posted March 21, 2007 - 02:25 PM

#85

Cool. Thanks.You eat those quads for breakfast in the second video.

  • Hondathumper450

Posted March 21, 2007 - 05:52 PM

#86

Did both bikes have stock gearing? I have the stock headers but a XR's Only competion exhaust with the complete 12 disc system.
I was going to put a 53 tooth sprocket on back and am wondering how much top end I would lose. Were both bikes in 5th topped out? In the first video that is

  • crfklxrider

Posted March 22, 2007 - 02:46 PM

#87

in my experience, loud pipes make very little of adifference, keep the stock pipe

  • rdsrf

Posted March 22, 2007 - 08:03 PM

#88

How much was the Jardine can?

  • Thumpage

Posted March 23, 2007 - 07:37 AM

#89

Did both bikes have stock gearing? I have the stock headers but a XR's Only competion exhaust with the complete 12 disc system.
I was going to put a 53 tooth sprocket on back and am wondering how much top end I would lose. Were both bikes in 5th topped out? In the first video that is


First, drop, yeah if all else is pretty equal of the quads not being fully modded alcohal burning monsters you can smoke them. That was a TRX 450R and 660 raptor I took off after when I was sitting a little ways behind them when they took off.
Thumper, you can't run stock gearing with a paddle. There is not enough clearance.
I can't remember what gearing my buddy was using but I will find out. He did have a 8 paddle though while I had a 10 paddle. A good gear choice is 14/46 for the dunes as it sets the wheel back for clearance and is a good gear choice to boot. 14/47 should give enough clearance too if you want to keep the gearing closer to stock.
I actually use a 112 link chain and was running 15/48 gearing. It alows me to use 15/49 gearing for general offroad riding. I have also used the stock 14/48 gearing and tried14/49 gearing since the extra chain length allows it. I think the 14/49 gearing was too low though.
You can't use a 53 tooth rear with a stock 110 length chain. I think a 51 is the absolute max. Besides, a low gear choice will really close up the gears. You will be shifting much more. I've tried up to 14/50 and I didn't like it, :eek: . First gear is just a crawler gear with 14/50. There are some guys out there that use low gearing though. I saw your other thread. Actually one tooth changed on the front will equal 3 to 4 teeth on the back, depending on how the ratio falls. It varies. Example 14/45 is 3.21 & 15/48 is 3.2. Same basic ratio. While going to 13/48 proves to be a smidge closer to a 4 tooth difference of a ratio of 3.69 compared with a similar 14/52 gear ratio of 3.71. The three tooth difference from stock of a 14/51 ratio is 3.64.
14/50 is the lowest gearing to be had before getting much too forward of a position in the swingarm.

As for the bikes being tapped out, yes, I was pretty much full on the gas in the first scene in the Pismo vid. I am sure my buddy would tell you he was only half gas, :lol: . I outweighed him by about 40-45lbs. I think my 10 paddle helped make up some difference compared to his 8 paddle and full exhaust.

Too crfklx rider: while there are times that some exhausts don't give a power benefit by simply gutting them and making them louder, there are others to the contrary with thought out modification or by way of design. Some of the older mufflers especially reverse megaphone piped mufflers are well known for creating more power than newer quiet mufflers. I have no problem at all with someone wanting to promote quiet pipes. Especially for use in areas that have sound restrictions. That is why we are testing and finding out how far we can go with modifying the stock tip to give the most flow and power while still coming under 94-95db. But the remaining fact is many standard mufflers give better power than the newer quiet versions. And likewise when you put in a quiet insert in a muffler that can take one, the power gets a little stifled also.
For example, I am sure there will be no desert racer that will willingly use a Pro Circuit 496 muffler over the T4 muffler, especially the special reverse cone megaphone made versions Team Honda had used.
We just have to take a little power loss with the current trend and technology of quiet mufflers and for our riding areas that have sound restrictions. I can quiet down my Promeg muffler for areas that have sounds restrictions and then open it up more for riding in the middle of the desert where there is nobody around and get more power out of it, (with this particular muffler). As it also happens, the stock muffler gives nice performance gains from modifying the stock tip also. :applause: The only drawback is that it is heavy.

  • osbo

Posted April 02, 2007 - 07:46 AM

#90

Keep the HRC tip,
buy a Baja Designs Tip, it goes directly into the HRC's 40mm tip.
It looks like a down spout. I installed one on mine. It quieted down the
bike and I noticed no decrease in power.

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  • abby

Posted April 11, 2007 - 06:26 PM

#91

Just want to let you guys (Thumpage, XRR-Kat) that I haven't forgotten about the testing - if the weather cooperates, I hope to get to it this weekend.

I'll be testing the unmodified stock tip, stock tip drilled 2 inches removing the exit baffle/pipe with the first baffle intact but drilled to 1.25 inches (hoping this configuration stays below 94 DB), and Thumpages modified tip (first baffle removed and second baffle drilled out). And I'll retest the Q2 so the test conditions are the same.

Then I will sell Thumpage's tip on Ebay - er, I mean send it to XRR-Kat if he still wants to try it. :thumbsup:

  • XRR-kat

Posted April 12, 2007 - 08:21 AM

#92

abby,
No, please send me the tip (I'll PM), I'm next door - MD.
And let me sell it on eBay ;-)

We're getting rain this weekend and I'm expecting the Moriwaki I located; so sometime (no worries!) I'll be doing same for stock tip, HRC tip, and Moriwaki full exhaust (with and without spark arrestor). and hopefully rich's tip to establish common baseline

laters,

  • Thumpage

Posted April 12, 2007 - 10:51 PM

#93

Just want to let you guys (Thumpage, XRR-Kat) that I haven't forgotten about the testing - if the weather cooperates, I hope to get to it this weekend.

I'll be testing the unmodified stock tip, stock tip drilled 2 inches removing the exit baffle/pipe with the first baffle intact but drilled to 1.25 inches (hoping this configuration stays below 94 DB), and Thumpages modified tip (first baffle removed and second baffle drilled out). And I'll retest the Q2 so the test conditions are the same.

Then I will sell Thumpage's tip on Ebay - er, I mean send it to XRR-Kat if he still wants to try it. :thumbsup:



No worries about the extra timeline. As for selling my tip, :ride: :ride: :p
XRR-Kat can certainly try it for his evaluation. I had originally meant for it to changed hands from you to him before getting back to me. Not a problem. :worthy:

  • XRR-kat

Posted April 13, 2007 - 05:17 AM

#94

Alllrrightty then,
We have a "pass-around" !!!
cool...

BTW, I got the Moriwaki from Big Valley Honda yesterday.
It is gorgeous. All SS except the muffler and yes it does have packing (about 2" diam. perforated pipe in exhaust), and not a resonator.
But !!!! they packed the wrong spark arrestor !!!
Until then, looked pretty convincing that it would be streetable and quieter than HRC tip as "Cpt Ron" observed...:thumbsup: .:ride:
I know its the wrong tip cause there's about a 1/8" gap with the exhaust tip and shape/construction is not same as the "other" Mori I was offered (the one that got away)....:worthy:

Okay, talked to gen mgr Rich and he found it and is sending today....
Got it!

  • drop

Posted April 13, 2007 - 02:20 PM

#95

sanjoh,
Can you tell me if the Jardine logo on the muffler looks like a removable sticker? I like this system but I'd like to take that logo off.


Answer: Yes it can. It's just a sticker and when it's off you have a very OEM looking exhaust system with less weight than the original, larger diameter pipes, and better (deeper/quieter) sound. I got mine for $350 shipped from ebay. This was for a full system not just a muffler. I'm very happy with it. The seller is named mx113.

+1 for the Jardine!

  • gonridn

Posted April 13, 2007 - 02:23 PM

#96

in regards to the Moriwaki system for the XR650R, we have been in contact with Moriwaki Japan. they have indicated that they will build another run of systems, but ask for a 50 unit order. we are trying to gauge how much interest there is before we commit to another order. please post your comments or you can pm me.
thanks!

gonridn

Big Valley Honda

  • 415ZR1

Posted April 15, 2007 - 09:46 AM

#97

I would definitely be interested. Been looking for a Moriwaki system for quite sometime.

in regards to the Moriwaki system for the XR650R, we have been in contact with Moriwaki Japan. they have indicated that they will build another run of systems, but ask for a 50 unit order. we are trying to gauge how much interest there is before we commit to another order. please post your comments or you can pm me.
thanks!

gonridn

Big Valley Honda



  • abby

Posted April 18, 2007 - 04:46 PM

#98

Well I tell ya - now I understand why the ranger numbers on the CA OHV site are all over the map. Obviously, there are lots of things that affect the measured noise....but wow.

I measured my Q2 and the stock unmodified tip tonight. I got rather different (better as far as numbers go) values for the FMF Q2. But a few things were different from the initial measurement I made.

1) I was farther away from my house (I believe there was some MAJOR echoing going on before). I was slightly closer than 30 feet before. This time about 60 feet and facing a different direction.
2) I was sitting on the bike during the measurement rather than standing beside it. Not sure, maybe quiets the engine noise a bit.
3) My better half was exact about the measurement distance. She informed me before she was kinda guessing at 22 inches (even though I gave her a tape the first time.) But I love her anyway....

Stock tip at idle (1400 RPM): 78 DB
Stock Tip at 3250 RPM: 87 DB

FMF Q2 at idle (1400 RPM): 83 DB
FMF Q2 at 3250 RPM: 90 DB

Repeated both measurements twice.

Yes, if you've been following the thread, that is 5 DB lower than what I measured before for the Q2. 5 DB! Before I measured 86 and 95 DB. I think item 1 above was the biggest factor. I figured it was a factor before, but not that big of a factor. I will try and repeat that 95 DB measurement again in the same spot in my driveway when I move my trailer (I measured it on two different occasions from that spot and got 95 db, so I suspect I can repeat it).

Way under my 94 DB requirement. Still sounds a bit loud to me though, especially under heavy throttle, I'll just have to watch that.

My attempt at a semi-corked tip failed. I drilled the outer tip to 2 inches, and the second baffle plate out to 1.25 inches, left the first plate intact. The sound it made was hidious. Embarassing. Not necessarily hidiously loud, I mean hidiously awful. I didn't even bother to measure it. Even my 7 year old son made a weird face. I am going to clip the second baffle completely and measure that when I measure the other tip if that helps anyone but that is reported to be 96 DB.

Unfortunately, when I went to put in Thumpages "HRC like" tip, my neighbor started humming around her 100 db lawnmower. Now it's dark.

That stock tip is QUIET! I forgot how quiet it was. I was surprised that the bike ran so well with the bike uncorked with the stock tip. Suppose it's running a bit rich in that condition - but would it hurt it?

  • XRR-kat

Posted April 19, 2007 - 08:29 AM

#99

abby,
Great info. Interesting about effect of distance from surrounding objects/structures and measuring while stradling....so if you wear sound-absorbtive material you get lower dbs ? Are we ready for combo body-armor/sound-absorptive suit ? :worthy:

What about Rich's tip? Sold before the test? :thumbsup:

BTW, I think only downside of running rich is fuel consumption and fouled plugs.

Laters,

  • XRR-kat

Posted April 29, 2007 - 06:48 PM


Thumpage, abby,
I did a very informal (no tach) db meter and got:
stock tip - 79db at about 1,000 rpm, and 87 db at about 3,000 rpm.
The HRC tip was 87db at 1,000 rpm and 103 db (I told you so!!!...actually, I told me so!!!) at about 3,000. 3,200, 3,500, 2,800.....it's loud !

Metered in an open field with grass just mowed to 3.75", but I was not stradling the bike .. my wife doesn't do db meter tests :applause:

While the db metering was unscientific, the comparison between stock tip and HRC tip at the "approx 3,000 rpm" was informative cause I just took off the stock tip and installed the HRC tip with the carb set at the same rpm.

Next up the Mori, but it's going to take a while. Did you know that you need to remove the radiators to install new pipes? Did you know I need to replace my right radiator which is bent into a parallelogram? Two birds with one stone.
Laters,





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