I installed the hotcams cam in my 125L today, and took a few measurements while I was in there.
Automotive cams are my thing, and I would have ground up my own, but I didn't have any masters suitable for a low lift application like this.

The hot cams specs. are

Int
.324" lift (.240"lobe)
215.5 duration at 1mm
Exh
.315" lift (.240" lobe)
215.5 duration at 1mm

The stock cam specs
Int
.270 (.200" lobe)
200 duration at .050" lift (info from aftermarket supliers site)
.260 (.200" lobe lift)
200 duration at .050"

It looks like there is a slight difference between the intake side rocker ratio, and the exhaust rocker ratio. This is common with their 3, and 4 cylinder car motors, as is the actual ratio at approximately 1.35-1/1.31-1
There are a few aftermarket cams available such as...
Wwbcams DR 125 grind

Lift .340" (.252" lobe I'm assuming)
241 duration at .050"

This, in my opinion, would be a nice race cam, good for midrange, and upper RPM power


Crowerpower lists the 125 G1 grind as

.224" - Lobe 214 - Duration @ .050"

Lift would be approx.
Int .302" / Exh. .293" (at the valve)
214 Duration at .050"

This cam would be between the stock, and hotcams, as far as lift, and almost the same as far as duration. A decent lowend/midrange cam.

I emailed crowerpower, and asked if they had something with a little more duration, as I thought the G1/hotcams was a little on the mild side for me, and he offered .237" lift and 228 duration
Lift similar to the hotcams, with an extra 14 degrees duration. This is also listed as a DR-Z 110 cam, so the lobes must be similar. This, I think would make a good midrange cam, with power from just above idle, to about as high as you'd care to rev it.
They also list (110 G2 cam)
.257" - Lobe Lift 236 deg - Duration @ .050".
.347" int. lift/ .336 exh. lift (at the valve
This looks to be about ideal, with good lift, and good duration. It would be a very strong mid to upper RPM cam suitable for a modified motor, with pipe/carb, etc.
I will check for possible interference, and likely use this one for my motor next.
Any questions? please ask.
More to come...

how did you feel that the hotcams cam worked in improvements over stock?

I wasn't too crazy about the Hotcams specs, but after looking at what else is available, I guess it really is a pretty decent cam. Good lift increase, but pretty mild duration.
I'm quite happy with it. I haven't ridden very much in the last couple of days, but its definitely what the bike needed. Before, it seemed to either run out of steam real early in the powerband, or just rev and not go anywhere in a real hurry. Now, it pulls hard all the way up. On the 1-2 shift, the rear wheel either breaks loose, or the front wheel comes up.
Another 10 degrees duration would be nice, to fatten up the midrange a bit, but I'd have to say it was definitely needed with the pipe, and carb.
For the money, its a great improvement over the (very mild) stock cam
I would recomend it to anybody, but do a pipe first.

oh thats good to hear

Here's Procycle's dyno chart of the drz125 with stock cam and hot cam.

http://www.procycle....o_klxdrz125.jpg

Theres something wrong with your link,but I've seen that before. Its as useless a dyno chart as I've ever seen.
Theres no hp numbers.

Yeah, I don't know what happend to the link. It looks like it should be right. Anyways, now that you mention it, it really should spell out what each bar means in terms of hp. I was thinking each horizontal line represented 2 hp. Does that sound right? I don't know. I think it does show clearly where the extra power comes in, mid to high rpms. I'm sure Jeff could give you more specifics. He's pretty knowlegable. You should check with him.

Thats funny, the link looks good, but re-directs
Here you go

thats not too bad of a gain

The dyno chart is one from the Hot Cams old web site. They didn't put numbers
on them back then.
Actual numbers on a dyno chart don't mean very much. What you want to see
are the gains (or losses) from whatever modification you have made.
For example a stock DRZ125 will post a peak of about 5.5 HP on my own dyno.
The graph in a previous post shows about 8.2 stock on whatever dyno it was run on.
The latest version of our DRZ test mule makes a hair over 11 on my dyno now.
I suppose that means it would show almost 17 on whatever dyno Hot Cams used
for their charts. The numbers themselves are meaningless.

Quote

Which you need the numbers to determine.
I know what you're saying, though.
Each dyno will be different, its the before/after thats important.

I dont understand why some dynos come out different than others..you would think they should be the same.

Back to back tests with the same bike, on the same dyno will sometimes give different numbers, too.
For these reasons, I'm not a big fan of dyno number comparison, and I don't put much weight in these comparisons. Even then, they are great tuning tools, and probably better than anything else available.

Great thread Zomby! Do you have any info on the cam used in the xr100.com 'engines only' 190 kit?

I don't, but I'll email them, and ask for specs.
I contacted Powroll yesterday for specs on their cams, so I'm waiting for that, too.
Some companies won't give you the lift, and duration of their cams.
When this happens, you know right away that they either have no idea what they are (getting them from somebody else), don't understand the camshaft business, or they are just plain retarded.
Its a myth that you can just send your cam to a grinder, and have them grind one up, based on the numbers you provide.
A cam grinder is a type of copy machine, and you must have a master template in order to do a specific profile.
Master plates can be generated from existing cams(copied directly from the lobe), though.
I don't have any masters sutable for the DR-Z (its a low lift aplication), and likely won't be making any.
Its not a big market, and there are no shortage of existing suppliers.

Thanks for that. I look forward to hearing your views on the 'engines only' cam. I'm planning to install one of their 190 kits which I've heard very good things about.

I contacted Engines only, as well as Powroll.
Engines only got right back to me with exactly the info I was looking for, even telling me that they get them from megacycle cams (and to contact them directly as they did not ship to Canada)

Part no. 330-x2 (Int)Lift.358"/234 dur @.040"/(Exh).252" ex 236 @ .040"

Part no. 393-00 (int) .400" 236 @.040" /(exh) .400" 240 @ .040"

If you'll notice, the exh. lift for the first one seems wrong. I asked about it, and he corected, saying it was actually .352". I'd want to check with Megacycle first, just to be sure.
Both seem like excellent cams. The best I've seen yet, for this motor.
Megacycle recomends springs with both, but based on my experiences with Suzuki motors, I'd be willing to bet that the stock ones are fine. I would want to check interference, first, though.

Powroll was another story.
I got this response

Quote

I responded saying that, as a machinist, and engine builder for many years, I know its not possible to copy a cam from numbers.
You need tha actual cam to do so.
Their response was to apologize, and offer to answer any questions I still had.
I asked for lift and duration again.
They told me they didn't have those numbers at their disposal, and tried again to sell me an ignition.
I don't mean to shit on them, but they should be truthful to their prospective customers.
I suspect they also get their cams from Megacycle.
For reference, Jeff at Procycle (who seemed very honest, and helpful over the phone) told me that in all his (dyno) testing, he has been unable to find this rev limiter, and not to worry about it.
Hope that helps.

This is a great thread. Thanks Zomby! Nice to see there are several options.

I've got a question for you now. How would they regrind the stock cam to make it meet those specs. If the lift is higher on these aftermarket cams, how do they modify the stock cam to the specs of the aftermarket cam? I don't get it.

Thanks.
Camshafts, cam grinding, what the numbers mean, and all that other cam related business has always been a kind of black magic to most people.
The manufacturers, custom grinders, and suppliers (who don't understand them either) don't exactly go out of their way to help people understand wht they're buying, and why.
Its something thats always fascinated me.
Most people have a hard time figuring out just how you can get more lift, by grinding material off the lobe.
If you look at the lobe, you will see the high point, and the bottom(low point).
The lift, is the difference between the base circle (low point), and lobe (high point).
On our stock cams, the base circle is 28mm.
The lobe height is 33mm
The net lift is 5mm
Take the rocker ratio (1.35-1) multiply it by the net lift (lobe lift), and you have gross lift.
What if you took material off the bottom of the lobe?
Then the difference would be greater, and you would have a higher lift.
Its a simplification, but thats how it works.
When a new lobe is being ground, the whole shape is altered, not just one part.
The other thing that is done (especially on bike cams) is to weld some hard material on the top, and sides of the lobe, so that the base circle diameter is not substantailly reduced. This allows them to remove mostly weld from the top, and less from the bottom. Bike cams are so small, that sunstantial base circle reduction is often required to put a new lobe shape on. This affects rocker ratios, and valvetrain geometry. Bikes rev high, and this can become a problem in the long term.
After looking through my list of master profiles, it looks like I might be able to use the same profile on my bikem, that I use in my land speed race car.
It would give a lift/duration of (int).388"/226 (exh).378/226
I'll keep you posted.
My part time biz is here, my land speed racer on the bottom, one of my daily drivers on the top.

www.teamswift.net/3tech

Hi Zoomby - This continues to be a great thread. I agree with you that Frank Nye at 'Engines Only' is a good guy to deal with. He seems a no nonsense guy who really knows his engine tuning rather than a flash marketing outfit who only want sell the bolt ons. Interestingly I asked him specifically about the PVL ignition in combination with a big bore kit and this was his answer:

pvl not so good ,no kick starting bump only and hard to ride no
flywheel. what comes on quick is over quick,its cool if you ride in a
bathtub

So there is a man who says it how it is. Conversley Powroll make a big thing about the PVL kit and say the removal of the rev limit is what it is all about. 'Engines Only' reckon that their 190 kit is best with the std igniton.

I have a friend who went down the full blown Powroll route bored and stroked 170 kit with the PVL ignition and then changed over to the 'Engines Only' 190 kit which he much prefers.

The 'Engines Only' is a much simpler conversion. No need to split the engine etc and it is good to know that the cam is a good one!

I'm hoping to do the 190 conversion and will keep you posted.