06' Bad front end wash... Tired of crashing


16 replies to this topic
  • XRYoda

Posted October 14, 2006 - 11:28 PM

#1

Hey guys, I don't really know what to do. I have had a bit of a problem getting the front end of my 06' WR450 to stick. I have played with the rear ride hight, front rebound, front ride hight, front compresion. I use a M12 front. I fianally got it to work marginally well in hard pack, but I just spent a day in a relativly sandy bermed area(China Hat, in Oregon) and could not get the front to stick in the (dense)sandy berms. I could ride up to a point, but pushing just a tiny bit to keep up with my buddies put me on my head a couple of times.(I actually busted a rib today). The front just washes. It is like the rear tire just pushes the front tire forward in the middle of the berm. I want to make it stop. Is it an inharent problem of the Yami's to have a crappy front end? is it me or is it the M12? The stock739 front was even worse. I weigh #190 and have the stock springs. I have raised the front forks in the clamps and have the rear ride high up a little.

Thanks
Yoda

  • OneToGo

Posted October 15, 2006 - 05:25 AM

#2

WR = which rut?
You have done what you can with tyres - try 15psi in the front, 15-18 rear.
Lower the forks 10mm min.
Get plenty of weight over the front.
See sand techniques in the riding technique Forum.
Normally front end wash can be helped a bit by increasing the rebound damping, sand requires a special set-up though.
The WR gometry is best for stability high speed, not for turning (compared to say a KTM)
:devil:

  • pjriss

Posted October 15, 2006 - 06:14 AM

#3

WR = which rut?
You have done what you can with tyres - try 15psi in the front, 15-18 rear.
Lower the forks 10mm min.
Get plenty of weight over the front.
See sand techniques in the riding technique Forum.
Normally front end wash can be helped a bit by increasing the rebound damping, sand requires a special set-up though.
The WR gometry is best for stability high speed, not for turning (compared to say a KTM)
:devil:


I'll second that. Lowering the forks (which you've done) helps a lot with turning in general. For me the hardest thing is keeping my butt on the tank, the WR is a real nut buster.

  • Bamster

Posted October 15, 2006 - 06:50 AM

#4

Get plenty of weight over the front.



:devil:

  • NYMXer

Posted October 15, 2006 - 07:00 AM

#5

Proper rear sag height is very critical for getting your Yamaha front end to stick, as is fork height. Make sure your rear (you in full gear and bouncing the bike a bit) get the sag to settle at about 4". The forks should be a bout 1/4 - 3/8's of an inch above the triple clamps. Sometimes more!

Rider position is also key here. Get up on the tank and have you inside leg over the axle. Basic stuff, like proper tire selection for the terrain you ride on.

Sand riding goes against most dirt riding rules. Getting the front end to stick in sand is more about the throttle than it is about most anything else. Ease into the gas rather than lay it on and lofting the front end. Stay neutral on the bike and roll the gas or get aggressive w/ the throttle and sit on the tank. There is a lot of traction in sand for both the front and rear tires. Position yourself accordingly. Most people tend to sit too far back on the bike when riding sand for fear of going over the bars.:devil:

  • XRYoda

Posted October 15, 2006 - 07:09 AM

#6

Thanks guys, That is all good info. I am Pretty tall and do tend to sit back a bit away from the front of the tank. The throttle tip is also a good one. Now I just need this damn rib to heal up to try it. I'll check out"Sand techniques" also. Thanks.

Yoda'

  • farkawi

Posted October 15, 2006 - 08:00 AM

#7

Sand riding takes some practice. The hardest thing for me to get used to was the bikes tendency to "wander" about in the ruts. Body positioning becomes more important as well. Try and find some open dunes somewhere and just practice getting in and out of turns for a day. Worked for me.

  • ISBB

Posted October 15, 2006 - 01:09 PM

#8

My technique in the sand is get as much weight off that front wheel as possible.. .If you plan on riding in the sand dont use 20PSI in the front either drop it to about 8-10 and it will track MUCH better. :devil:

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  • mattfree99

Posted October 15, 2006 - 04:21 PM

#9

I have seen people say the exact opposite while trying to solve this.
Some will say raise the fork tubes in the triple clamp which will make the bike turn faster as I see it.
Others say to drop the fork tubes which would actual raise the bike a little.
This to me sounds like the right way.
My WR450 has about a 1/2 inch over the top of the upper triple clamp.
I think I should lower the tubes.
I was riding at East Fort Rock Saturday and there was so much loose dirt I could actual flip the handlebars back and forth at 45-50 and the bike just kept going straight.

  • XRYoda

Posted October 15, 2006 - 08:22 PM

#10

Hey matt, It was worse than I remember being in the past at China Hat. Very dry, no moist soil under the loose top stuff.

You wern't staging out of camp 2510, were you? Or were you on Ricky's insane 250 mile day?

I will just have to try to get out there and try a few things. I am entered in the Fall Classic and want to be able to fairly well. I couldnt do very well now with my current set up. Thanks for your input.

Yoda'

  • WR Bob

Posted October 16, 2006 - 03:43 AM

#11

Yoda

I have an '06 450, weigh 185 and found it impossible to set my fork to my liking, regardless of what I did with oil viscosity, level or 'clicker' adjustments. Believe me when I say I tried everything. I finally bit the bullet and had them re-valved as a last resort. What a difference - I should have had them done the first day I had the bike! The tech said that the low speed compression shim pack was set way too soft right from the factory, and the stroke would blow right past it into the high speed compression, making the fork feel harsh and stiff.
It is money well spent to get the fork set-up properly-dratically improves the bikes handling and let's you go way faster :devil:

  • Seabass

Posted October 16, 2006 - 01:11 PM

#12

Everyone has given good advice. One of the traits of the WR is a sloppy front end. I can't tell you how many people tole me to avoid this bike for this reason alone. Sag heigth is important to get dialed in before you try anything else. Get that set and go from there. I'm 6'3" and 230 lbs so I re-sprung the front and rear, a big, big help. I've been usung the Maxxis SI tire in front and it works well, but doesn't last as long as the Maxxis Desert IT I run in the rear. The IT front tire doesn't turn nearly as well but it lasts forever. The Wr's can be a bit piggish when compared to the YZ's when comparing cornering. But I came from an XR 650 so I think the WR turns like an F1 car.

  • Mike_socal

Posted October 16, 2006 - 01:30 PM

#13

I'm no expert but here's what I've found with my crf. If I run the front rebound a little loose the front will wash out in sandy corners. If I let off the throttle in mid corner the compression braking causes the front end to load then if I get back on the throttle the front end unloads loses traction and washes out. I would try a little more rebound in the front, try to sit back a little to lighten the front, and push down on the outside peg almost to the point of standing on that peg. Of course a good front tire helps as well.

  • XRYoda

Posted October 16, 2006 - 05:25 PM

#14

Thanks guys. I might take my forks up this weekend to have them revalved. I can't ride for a couple of weeks now anyways due to my rib. Now might be a good time.

  • MAC 450

Posted October 16, 2006 - 06:44 PM

#15

I just bought my 06 2 weeks ago..I rode one stock when it first came out, HATED the FORKS!! So first thing I was going to do is change fork springs and get it revalved..(6'4 @ 230#)
Well I just couldn't NOT ride MY NEW BIKE!!! So I took it out for a 50 mile ride!!
I rode it a little too hard and the forks tucked and sent me sailing...
Now the bike is where it should of been in the first place..APART GETTING REVALVED..
I've ridden one spung for my weight...MUCH BETTER!!!
LESSON LEARNED....

  • Team_Oatmeal_Pie

Posted October 16, 2006 - 08:39 PM

#16

Proper rear sag settings is very important, it make an incredible difference in how the bike reacts. Second I would reccomend changing only 1 setting at a time, i.e. set the rear sag first - ride it then change the fork height and compare what each change does.
Lastly technique is equally important to ride set up. I purchased the Gary Semics Mx techniques book sometime ago. The whole thing is really good and really gets into body positioning, once you learn the right and wrong ways it makes such a huge difference, especially in turns. You can also get them on DVD.
Good Luck

  • ckulzer

Posted October 18, 2006 - 06:27 AM

#17

Proper rear sag settings is very important, it make an incredible difference in how the bike reacts. Second I would reccomend changing only 1 setting at a time, i.e. set the rear sag first - ride it then change the fork height and compare what each change does.
Lastly technique is equally important to ride set up. I purchased the Gary Semics Mx techniques book sometime ago. The whole thing is really good and really gets into body positioning, once you learn the right and wrong ways it makes such a huge difference, especially in turns. You can also get them on DVD.
Good Luck

Please don't overlook high speed compression damping either. If you don't have enough h-s damping, you blow through the stroke and the rear will ride low, effectively changing the rake.

Chad

'03 WR450f




 
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