Need fluid tips for 24hrs of Glen Helen


8 replies to this topic
  • jeffboyd47m

Posted October 04, 2006 - 04:51 AM

#1

I am running my 06 in the 24hrs of Glen Helen in about a week and a half. My bike will be run for close to 12 hrs non stop. What will be my best choice for engine oil? I change oil constantly so I have not run synthetics in it before, plus I have always been nervous about my clutch slipping from synthetics. I am running Engine Ice for coolant but should I try to adapt some sort of catch bottle to keep from losing coolant during that hard of riding for that duration of time? If so what would work on my 06 YZ 450 and where could I get it? Any help or advice would be appreciated. Thanks!

  • CISCO

Posted October 04, 2006 - 05:23 AM

#2

Motul 5100 semi synthetic for the engine. I find watter wetter to work much better than engine ice.
Ive never run a cath tank. As long as your moving you shouldnt overheat.

Have fun and good luck :devil:

  • Vibeguy

Posted October 04, 2006 - 07:13 AM

#3

I would highly recommend a synthetic oil for this race, synthetics have a higher thermal stability and resistance to oxidation than conventional oils. I have run Mobil 15w-50 extended performance (gold cap) in my 426 and 450 for years with no clutch problems. Shell Rotella syn is also popular.

  • grayracer513

Posted October 04, 2006 - 08:09 AM

#4

There is no truth whatsoever to the notion that synthetic oils will cause clutch problems. Oils graded "EC II" (Energy Conserving, level 2) are capable of it, and almost all oils that qualify as EC II are in fact synthetic. But there are at least twice as many synthetics that are not EC II, and will not cause your clutch any trouble. In fact, many synthetics carry the JASO MA grade, which, among other things, specifically certifies that the oil is compatible with wet clutch systems.

Now to your question. Vibeguy is correct, as far as he went. Synthetic oils have all of the precise advantages he listed. There is one other issue to deal with, however, and that is shear stability. Running multigrade engine oils through transmissions is extremely hard on them because it beats up the polymers that keep the oil from thinning at high temps. If that happens, a 10w-40 becomes a 10w-30, and so on until it's just a 10wt. There are three approaches you can take with this. One would be to run the best single grade 40 wt you can get your hands on and just be sure the bike gets a thorough 15-minute warm up. Straight grade oils don't generally contain viscosity index improvers, and the high quality ones will stay in grade very well. But synthetic straight grades are difficult to find, and straight grades are so out of fashion that good dino oils in single grades can even be hard to locate. Real racing oils are still offered that way by some.

Another way is to use a synthetic that has demonstrated the ability to hold its viscosity in high shear situations. Mobil 1 MX4T and V-Twin have done so, as have Torco 45R, Motul 300V, Maxima M4, and Amsoil MCF and MCV. There may be more that have this ability, but I haven't seen tests that show that, and there are a surprising number that do not. The two Amsoil oils, labeled "Synthetic Motorcycle Oil", carry an API GL-1 grade, making them real gear oils, as well as engine oils, and hold up very well. They are what I use.

Thirdly, you can plan to change oil mid-race. This may be the best option even with the best oil you can get, given that there is only one quart in your system. Changing out only the oil in the reservoir (the drain on the left) would not take long, and would replace 80% or more of the oil in the system. Refill with preheated oil warmed up on an intake manifold or by heating the bottle in a pot of 150 degree water. You will want to determine what the correct refill amount would be by doing an oil change this way before hand. And be sure you trust whoever tightens the drain plug.

We ran that race last year. It's a lot of fun. Take it easy on the first lap, though, the course has a couple of surprises in it.
Can you say,
D
O
W
N
H
I
L
L
?
:devil:

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  • jeffboyd47m

Posted October 04, 2006 - 08:49 AM

#5

Lots of good info here, Thanks! I have some MOTOREX Fully synthetic oil that is 20w/60w that says KTM racing 4T on the bottle, will that work in my YZ? This stuff was like 60.00 a Gal. and it is something that I already have. This will be the 4th year that I have run this race and something always happens that keeps our team from winning our class. This will be the 1st time with a Yamaha 4-stroke. Maybe this will be the year that it all comes together for us. By the way Gray, how did your team end up last year? What class did you ride?

  • grayracer513

Posted October 04, 2006 - 02:20 PM

#6

60 wt seems too heavy to me.

We ran an XR650 in the 24, in the sportsman open, IIRC. We took two or three hours off and ended up something like 7th or 9th. Just for fun.

  • Ga426owner

Posted October 04, 2006 - 04:19 PM

#7

Just curious - how often do you change the oil for this race? Do you leave the filter in or swap it out everyother or every 3rd oil change....sounds like a lot of fun...I would use either Amsoil or 4R to be safe

oh and drink lots of fluids... :devil:

  • grayracer513

Posted October 04, 2006 - 04:28 PM

#8

If I were running my own 450 in the 24, I'd do 3 tank-only oil changes, and I might throw a clean filter in it with the second one, doing six hours on the oil, and 12 on the filter. Same routine by half on the 12 hour.

The guy that owned the XR would have run the whole 24 on the same oil, but I changed the oil in the reservoir while they were snoozing. :devil:

  • jeffboyd47m

Posted October 04, 2006 - 09:44 PM

#9

Last year we ran a 06 KTM 450XC for our day bike and a KTM 525EXC for our night bike. Our night bike broke about 2.5 hrs into the night ride while leading our class.We swapped back our day bike out of impound and put the light on it then hauled ass. We ran that poor bike for a total of 21.5 hrs with no oil change. We did change air filters 3 times though. We ended up 2nd in our class with only 3min 45sec between 1st and 2nd place. I hope my YZ will hold up.





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