XL650 vs XR650 Differences, Are They That Much? Looking for info.


43 replies to this topic
  • XR650L_Dave

Posted August 04, 2007 - 06:13 PM

#21

Now guys, get your lineage right.

Its not an XL, its an XR600R with a detuned engine and 30-40lbs of street crap.

Don't forget, before the 650R was running baja, it was the 600R.

Should have called it an XR650T- T for trials...

Dave

  • elrontx

Posted August 04, 2007 - 07:50 PM

#22

the only thing the L is good for is riding 60 miles of street 1/2 highway and 1/2 backroads then riding 40 miles of tight hilly rocky terrain thats only accessable by d/s then riding home. i did that today and rode with a friend who lives by the trails.:ride:

  • BWB63

Posted August 04, 2007 - 08:13 PM

#23

Now guys, get your lineage right.

Its not an XL, its an XR600R with a detuned engine and 30-40lbs of street crap.

Don't forget, before the 650R was running baja, it was the 600R.

Should have called it an XR650T- T for trials...

Dave


I got it right......the XR500R was for dirt and the XL500 was street, then the same with the XL600 (Years Made: 1983 - 1988, I had one) and XR600. There were differences with swing arm and other things but "L" was street and "R" was dirt/race. The XR650L was the replacement for the XL600 and they kept the XR600R till they came out with the XR650R. I got it right Honda just thought it would sell better calling it the XR650L. It is not a XR600, like you said, it is de-tuned and much heavier, almost as heavy as the old XL600. I have had 90 XR50, 74 CL125, 82 XL250, 83 XR350, 83 XR500, 82 XL500, 84 XL600, 86 XR600, 92 XR600R, I know the difference, the XR650L is not a XR, it's an "L" I don't see the "R" in this picture at all.

  • motometal

Posted August 05, 2007 - 05:35 AM

#24

This horse has been beat but I enjoy the discussion so I'll keep it going.

I have a 2003 CR250 (two stroke), modified for woods but still works great on the track. Being 4 (going on 5) model years old, it's "old tech" too, but since this is my main "off road only" dirt bike, I can't help but compare the XRs to that bike, as far as the off roading ability. There's no comparison at all, naturally...in fact, the R and the L feel way closer to each other when it comes to trails and jumps, than the R compares to the CR. In other words, yes the R feels more like a "real" dirt bike but still feels very heavy, clumbsy and big. This is probably why I was disappointed in the R, because I was expecting it to feel closer to the CR after reading all the posts on here about how much better of a dirt bike it was.

Regarding jumps, I have now shortend up my forks so jumps are off limits but back when the suspension was "stock"...jumps were no problem on the L. The rear spring on the L is quite stiff, the forks are soft but if you hit the landing ramp properly I don't see a problem with a 60' table top. Honking the horn in the air and signaling for the corners earns you extra points. It doesn't take fancy suspension valving to handle jumps, just proper springs and some low speed compression damping.

Where I notice the L does suffer some, is whoops and braking bumps. It's low tech suspension gets a bit "busy" and I'm sure the R, assuming proper setup would handle these obstacles better.

Regarding the motor, maybe the R I rode was not running right for some reason. All the posts I had read about this had me expecting gigantor power and it ran good but honestly if I had bought the R just based on the increase of power, I would have been bummed out.

My L is modified, piston cam, but stock carb. I have way, way less than $1400 in engine mods. The aftermarket carb is stupidly expensive and I'm not convinced it's worth it, so I've held off on that, for now anyway.

As far as the mods, I suppose that depends alot on how much you enjoy modding. To some folks, this would be an advantage because it's fun to see it go from all corked up, to "greatly improved". I guess you can do this with either bike, although to varying degrees.

I have a box of about 15 pounds worth of "stuff" I've taken off the L.

This debate has way more relevance in some areas, than it does in others. I say this because here, it's tough to licence an R or any other dirt bike that wasn't originally designed street legal. The only reason I have even considered buying an R was to replace my L with a "new and improved" dual sport. So to me, if the R can't be street legal, you have just taken away the only reason to consider buying it. It's old tech (albeit not as old as the L), and one would be doing themselves a disservice to buy such a bike for dirt only, considering the other options (2 and 4 stroke) out there, some at very reasonable prices.

  • martinfan30

Posted August 05, 2007 - 12:33 PM

#25

i have that same box of excess pork i shaved off my L under my work bench! it is actually pretty amazing to ride my buddies 07 stock 650L then jump on my far from stock 05 650L! different bikes!:thumbsup:

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted August 06, 2007 - 07:58 AM

#26

I got it right......the XR500R was for dirt and the XL500 was street, then the same with the XL600 (Years Made: 1983 - 1988, I had one) and XR600. There were differences with swing arm and other things but "L" was street and "R" was dirt/race. The XR650L was the replacement for the XL600 and they kept the XR600R till they came out with the XR650R. I got it right Honda just thought it would sell better calling it the XR650L. It is not a XR600, like you said, it is de-tuned and much heavier, almost as heavy as the old XL600. I have had 90 XR50, 74 CL125, 82 XL250, 83 XR350, 83 XR500, 82 XL500, 84 XL600, 86 XR600, 92 XR600R, I know the difference, the XR650L is not a XR, it's an "L" I don't see the "R" in this picture at all.



I just mean (and this is important from a parts-swap POV) is that honda didn't take an XL600 and say 'lets make a new DS out of it", they took the XR600 and based the L on that.

Dave

  • hill5150

Posted August 06, 2007 - 11:25 AM

#27

I suppose in the desert or on open ground the performance difference might matter but be honest with yourself: how good a rider are you?

( Good enough rider to know the "L" is by no means a comparable or remotely similar to the "R", and will never own one)

I'm willing to bet that 90% of the riders on this board couldn't go faster on the 650R then the 650L because their abilities as a rider lag behind the advantages built into the R model.

( How much you want to bet? We can go faster on the "R" because it is faster and that's why we ride them......)

I run my XR 650L with the stock can, (slight re-jetting as it comes way too lean) running single track, powerlines and logging trails and logging roads. I went for a 3 hour ride today and was at max throttle less then 5% of the time. This included some nasty hill climbs. I don't need more hp.

(If your only at max WFO under 5%, you are lugging around way too much weight and bike then, buy a DRZ..or a 2 fiddy.....)

Maybe Johnny Campbell needs an extra 10hp but you probably don't.

( Got the extra HP, and love it.........)

To me it's laughable that guys worry about a pipe. Why?????

( Because they work better, and provide a wider powerband maybe? And look cool, and we like to waste money........ )

The thing is a fat pig no matter what you do, so if you want lighter buy a 400.

( The 400 is for girls, and it is not a 650 and has no balls, that's why they have a 450 r and x now)


A good pipe might pick up maybe 5hp, piss off every hiker you come across and we wonder why the eco-weenies are out to shut us out of the back country. Take your money by tires, gas, insurance and ride the thing.

( I have no comment regarding hikers, never see them at 80 MPH plus...)

It's as silly as the Harley guys. People we're talking about an air-cooled single cylinder motorcyle!!! :banghead: Lastly aren't you running on the street? Even off-road you have to hold back somewhat due to ATV riders, logging trucks, hikers what have you.

(That's what the extra HP is for, to pass them.....you could probably pass an ATV on an "L" actually and a hiker..........)

There's only so fast you can go safely anywhere.

Your a big guy the L would fit you, no problems with the DMV or cops, seems like a no-brainer to me.


.............................

  • XR650L_Dave

Posted August 06, 2007 - 11:51 AM

#28

Seeing as how 'hill' is weighing in on his riding preference, I'm going to weigh in on mine-

In tight and snotty northeast stuff, or in open desert, you have to make a decision regarding what speed you want to ride vs what risk-of-injury you're willing to tolerate. I almost always ride alone, and so draw that line pretty low.

I can easily exceed the XRLs limits with my riding abilities, but that's a fair bit beyond how fast I'm willing to go, alone. If I wanted to ride much faster, I'd ride something faster! (Mind you, there are places I ride where an XRR would not be any faster, hence my 1/2-jokes on the XRL as a trials bike. Nothing more fun than hilly, trackless tight woods)

Sheeeit, I said it all in the 1st post of that monster thread- The XRL is the right bike for the riding I like to do now, and if the riding I want to do changes, I'll get the right bike for that kind of riding.

The only thing I see here that gets me is how both groups are talkin' smack about the other- The "you can't use all that power, anyway" group, and the "well, its a nice bike, but its not a REAL dirt bike" group.

Jeesh, leave that purist crap to the KTM riders. Some folks are terrain whores that want to find the nastiest thing to conquer (and do it on 'whatever'), some folks like to go real fast, some folks like to buzz down dirt roads.

Me, I'd love to take a trip out to cali and see what blasting around on a 650R is like, and I'd like to get some of the open-terrain clan into some nasty stuff where the extra power wouldn't do squat for 'em.

Dave

  • motometal

Posted August 06, 2007 - 02:16 PM

#29

I agree with the point made on pipes, and it appears someone responding to it is a memeber of the "part of the problem" group rather than the "part of the solution" group when it comes to loud pipes. Also might be one of the guys sitting around a few years from now wondering where all the riding areas went.

  • Kyron

Posted August 06, 2007 - 02:47 PM

#30

Aint these topics greeat :bonk:


When the XR650L was a brand new model it was the GREATEST ds bike to hit the trail.
The XR600 had been winning Baja and Scott Summers was kickin butt in the GNCC races on one.

Sure the XR650R is an improvment in every way BUT its impossable to improve on the FUN factor of the XR650L.


Isnt ridding all about the fun factor?:excuseme:

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  • hill5150

Posted August 06, 2007 - 06:08 PM

#31

Me, I'd love to take a trip out to cali and see what blasting around on a 650R is like, and I'd like to get some of the open-terrain clan into some nasty stuff where the extra power wouldn't do squat for 'em.

Dave


You should ride out here in the Cali-Dez, it's truly amazing, you can actually get past 2nd gear...................Both bikes have their merits, but they simply cannot be categorized the same..............

  • desert4seat

Posted August 06, 2007 - 06:18 PM

#32

I agree with the point made on pipes, and it appears someone responding to it is a memeber of the "part of the problem" group rather than the "part of the solution" group when it comes to loud pipes. Also might be one of the guys sitting around a few years from now wondering where all the riding areas went.



So… are aggressive knobby tires and high horsepower motors ok as long as you're running a stock pipe???

Where do you draw the line?

Don’t know if you noticed, but our ENTIRE sport as a whole clashes with the enviros agenda…
Absolutely nothing about an offroad motorcycle will EVER be ok…(unless it’s confined to a closed course…and even that’s a stretch)

so before you point fingers...
make absolutly sure that you're on the "part of the solution" group.


All this talk of loud pipes is making me jones for my six-fifty… :ride:
p.s. sorry bout the hi-jack

  • eastreich

Posted August 06, 2007 - 06:34 PM

#33

Maybe I am wrong with this line of thought, but I believe that the XR650L was not even based on the XR600R. The 650L is based off of the NX650 that was disco'd in the States, but still sold in Europe as the 650 Dominator for many more years. Honda just slapped the 600R plastic and single pipe on the Dominator, misnamed it by calling it the XR650L (as opposed to XL650), and let us have it.

For the record, I still think all of the Yamaha WR four-strokes should be called TTs too.

  • motometal

Posted August 06, 2007 - 06:50 PM

#34

So… are aggressive knobby tires and high horsepower motors ok as long as you're running a stock pipe???

Where do you draw the line?

Don’t know if you noticed, but our ENTIRE sport as a whole clashes with the enviros agenda…
Absolutely nothing about an offroad motorcycle will EVER be ok…(unless it’s confined to a closed course…and even that’s a stretch)

so before you point fingers...
make absolutly sure that you're on the "part of the solution" group.


All this talk of loud pipes is making me jones for my six-fifty… :ride:
p.s. sorry bout the hi-jack


well, the trend around here is losing riding areas because of loud bikes. everyone has their problems, but I haven't seen too many cases of loud bikes opening up more land and convincing politicians and enviro groups to give us a break. Part of the solution, well depends how you are judging me. I am the guy that walks around in the parking lot and politely has a conversation with folks sporting the full race pipes, suggesting they get a quieter muffler to help support keeping our place to ride. That extra two horsepower at 10,000 rpm doesn't do any good when there is no place to ride. But then, half the loud pipes out there are just for the "hey look at me" aspect anyway. What's the use in going fast if no one sees you?

The mentally of "we'll never make them happy anyway" is rediculous, you could use this logic to rationalize anything you want, and it's bogus. Why put in any effort at work, you will never satisfy your boss? Why try to be nice to your spouse, nothing you ever do is good enough, right?:excuseme:

  • martinfan30

Posted August 06, 2007 - 07:52 PM

#35

Maybe I am wrong with this line of thought, but I believe that the XR650L was not even based on the XR600R. The 650L is based off of the NX650 that was disco'd in the States, but still sold in Europe as the 650 Dominator for many more years. Honda just slapped the 600R plastic and single pipe on the Dominator, misnamed it by calling it the XR650L (as opposed to XL650), and let us have it.

For the record, I still think all of the Yamaha WR four-strokes should be called TTs too.


actually the xr650L was based off of the xr600R. they just share a lot of commonalities.

  • martinfan30

Posted August 06, 2007 - 07:53 PM

#36

you are right about the yamaha's. they should be called TT's!

  • xr650l bum

Posted August 06, 2007 - 09:44 PM

#37

The xr650l is actually a hybrid of both the xr600r and the nx650! They wanted to make a hardier and cheaper Dualsport/Enduro bike. They took the electric start 650 motor out of the nx650 and put it into the xr600r. Losing a lot of the fairings and luxury of the nx, but making the off road king (xr600r) much more apealing to the masses. Creating the best dual sport/ enduro bike ever made!

  • eastreich

Posted August 06, 2007 - 09:58 PM

#38

The xr650l is actually a hybrid of both the xr600r and the nx650! They wanted to make a hardier and cheaper Dualsport/Enduro bike. They took the electric start 650 motor out of the nx650 and put it into the xr600r. Losing a lot of the fairings and luxury of the nx, but making the off road king (xr600r) much more apealing to the masses. Creating the best dual sport/ enduro bike ever made!


I thought that they also used the NX frame, as it had a stouter subframe section to support the battery hanging off the back of it...

But I am no expert on this family tree!:worthy:

  • jetfuel

Posted August 07, 2007 - 04:58 AM

#39

you are right about the yamaha's. they should be called TT's!


and the little CRF's should still be called XR's ( 150 exempt )

  • Huffa 2

Posted August 07, 2007 - 05:14 AM

#40

and the little CRF's should still be called XR's ( 150 exempt )


Yea, I thought so too but then got to thinking, if I was a small kid it's cooler to say you have a CRF, just like daddies bike.





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