XR600 lover, now a CRF450X guy


17 replies to this topic
  • Ranco

Posted July 17, 2006 - 11:42 AM

#1

Hi All,

I recently sold my beloved 1995 XR600R CA lc plated, 11 awesome years, never cracked open up the cases. A few oil changes, air cleaner, tires etc. NEVER, I mean never a problem. Why did I sell, well, let's say I am in an new zip code now. The CRF450X (a 2006) is flat awesome, it feels 100 pounds lighter, it's only 50 though. I did get a plate on the new bike, not as easy as was the XR. I know my old maintenance schedule (annual oil change) will change dramatically, but it's worth it! Oh and I did need to come up with 5 grand to cover the difference. If you get the chance to ride a CRF450X, DON'T DO IT, unless you can afford the upgrade. Thats what happened to me.

  • snaggleXR650

Posted July 17, 2006 - 01:58 PM

#2

Be VERY afraid of the valve and gearbox issues, especially when streeting it. They say to use a full qt of tranny oil which should help the tranny siezing that people are getting. The only way to solve the valves is to go with stainless steel valves I believe. Read about all the carnage in the 450X section of this site.

I've been really wanting to make myself like the 450X since it came out. The fact is, it is NOT an XR, it is a fragile, precision machine. Personally, I think Honda screwed up big time by getting rid of the XR's and replacing them with fragile machines.

I'm not bagging on your bike, just on Honda. I would kill to get my hands on a 450X. Enjoy the new bike, just treat it like a formula 1 race car, NOT a lawnmower like you did with your XR. Good luck.

  • crfmxer

Posted July 17, 2006 - 02:07 PM

#3

Be VERY afraid of the valve and gearbox issues, especially when streeting it. They say to use a full qt of tranny oil which should help the tranny siezing that people are getting. The only way to solve the valves is to go with stainless steel valves I believe. Read about all the carnage in the 450X section of this site.

I've been really wanting to make myself like the 450X since it came out. The fact is, it is NOT an XR, it is a fragile, precision machine. Personally, I think Honda screwed up big time by getting rid of the XR's and replacing them with fragile machines.

I'm not bagging on your bike, just on Honda. I would kill to get my hands on a 450X. Enjoy the new bike, just treat it like a formula 1 race car, NOT a lawnmower like you did with your XR. Good luck.

ANY bike will sieze up from lack of oil. the CRF was designed to have the gears sit above the oil and rely on the oil to splash up to lubricate them for less drag. dump a full quart in the tranny and be done with it. it just pisses me off to no end when people rant and rave about this bike and it's transmission problems.

my X has been beaten for hundreds of hours and not 1 single valve is out of spec. I constantly ride it on the road with stock gearing almost on the rev limiter and have had ZERO problems.

this is not a fragile machine, the only things that have needed replacing were regular wear and tear items.

yes you need to change the oil, oil filter and clean the air filter much more often but that is nothing compared to the fun you will have with this bike.

  • rmhrc630

Posted July 17, 2006 - 03:28 PM

#4

ANY bike will sieze up from lack of oil. the CRF was designed to have the gears sit above the oil and rely on the oil to splash up to lubricate them for less drag. dump a full quart in the tranny and be done with it. it just pisses me off to no end when people rant and rave about this bike and it's transmission problems.

my X has been beaten for hundreds of hours and not 1 single valve is out of spec. I constantly ride it on the road with stock gearing almost on the rev limiter and have had ZERO problems.

this is not a fragile machine, the only things that have needed replacing were regular wear and tear items.

yes you need to change the oil, oil filter and clean the air filter much more often but that is nothing compared to the fun you will have with this bike.



Your're wrong.

XR - massivley overbuilt and mega oil capacity. (reason for the 50kg motor v 29kg motor for the CRF450X)

RELATIVELY the CRF IS fragile. Snaggle is 100% correct.

Pretending the XR and CRF are similiar (which you imply by your lack of acceptance of their fragility) is silly.

I own both. I know. You should listen to Snaggle.

CRFs are great. XRs are too.

  • snaggleXR650

Posted July 17, 2006 - 05:34 PM

#5

I realize that you almost always hear more of the bad than the good on the 'net. This makes little problems seem like HUGE ones. I will admit I may have not been fair, especially since I don't have an X myself.

I will stick by my statement that the X's need to be treated more like a finely tuned racing machine than like a lawnmower.

I would love to have a new X, but I'm waiting on Honda to come out with a CRF600/650X that has XR reliability. However, until then, I'll have my 650R.

Ride on!

  • captb

Posted July 17, 2006 - 05:58 PM

#6

I was going to buy a late model CRF450 used and everyone I called about in the Cycle trader said fresh top end, same with some of the Yamaha's, that changed my mind, I would have to go back to 2 smokes if I will be freshening the top end on a regular bases :thumbsup:

  • Ranco

Posted July 17, 2006 - 07:08 PM

#7

Gee, Look what I started. Having owned both, doing some serious research to quality issues from Honda Racing here's my take. ABSOLUTELY the XR is a tank, beat it long and hard, was if desired and put her away. Not so with the CRF, wile in by means is it a F1 car, measurable more maintenance, BUT, shit what a blast to ride. A good friend rode his bone stock CRF450X in the Mammoth Mountain MX, did very well. He would have died on an XR and been half a lap back after one. Really different bikes. A ride the length of Baja, hands down the XR, other than that?

Ranco
2006 CRF450X CA LC plated

  • huntmaster

Posted July 19, 2006 - 10:45 AM

#8

A good friend rode his bone stock CRF450X in the Mammoth Mountain MX, did very well. He would have died on an XR and been half a lap back after one.

I don't think anyone here disputes the performance advantage here over an XR600. To be fair, the XR is a twenty+ year old design that has received a few updates over the years and doesn't compare to the CRF or other modern bikes for this. Of course where the XR's are much better is at still being ridden around when 20 years old...something I don't think were going to see much of from the new RFS generation!

  • goodhands

Posted July 19, 2006 - 08:34 PM

#9

Of course where the XR's are much better is at still being ridden around when 20 years old...something I don't think were going to see much of from the new RFS generation!


Good point! It would be hard for me to imagine a 20 year F1 bike screaming through Baja.

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  • Ranco

Posted July 19, 2006 - 11:09 PM

#10

I don't think anyone here disputes the performance advantage here over an XR600. To be fair, the XR is a twenty+ year old design that has received a few updates over the years and doesn't compare to the CRF or other modern bikes for this. Of course where the XR's are much better is at still being ridden around when 20 years old...something I don't think were going to see much of from the new RFS generation!


No one in their right mind could disagree with that! Like I said before, my XR gave 11 years on perfect performance, I have no allusion the CRF will do the same. All the guys I ride with were on newer bikes, on the top of Miller's Jeep Trail or the like they would say, wow Ranco, how do you get that sled up here. Now I have no excuses.

  • goodhands

Posted July 20, 2006 - 06:39 AM

#11

No one in their right mind could disagree with that! Like I said before, my XR gave 11 years on perfect performance, I have no allusion the CRF will do the same. All the guys I ride with were on newer bikes, on the top of Miller's Jeep Trail or the like they would say, wow Ranco, how do you get that sled up here. Now I have no excuses.


You have waited a long time. Enjoy your new ride :thumbsup:

  • xr600Lynch

Posted July 20, 2006 - 08:03 AM

#12

http://i85.photobuck...r600/xrxrxr.jpg

  • ProMed

Posted July 20, 2006 - 08:16 AM

#13

Congrats on the new bike Ranco, you will love it! I have both a tagged XRR and a CRF450R and love both. The extra maintenance is totally worth it IMO for the CRF, as you already know! Stay on top of it, including checking the valves and it will run strong for a long time.
My buddy installed an hourmeter before his first ride on an 03 CRF450, changes his oil every 3 rides, air filter after every ride, and checks his valves every three months. He now has well over 200+ hours and has only had to shim once.

  • 52wheelz

Posted July 25, 2006 - 04:32 PM

#14

Be VERY afraid of the valve and gearbox issues, especially when streeting it. They say to use a full qt of tranny oil which should help the tranny siezing that people are getting. The only way to solve the valves is to go with stainless steel valves I believe. Read about all the carnage in the 450X section of this site.

I've been really wanting to make myself like the 450X since it came out. The fact is, it is NOT an XR, it is a fragile, precision machine. Personally, I think Honda screwed up big time by getting rid of the XR's and replacing them with fragile machines.

I'm not bagging on your bike, just on Honda. I would kill to get my hands on a 450X. Enjoy the new bike, just treat it like a formula 1 race car, NOT a lawnmower like you did with your XR. Good luck.

It is probably not fair to compare the XR's to the CRFX's since they are completely different bikes. XR's are rock solid. I had an XR250, XR400, XR650R and XR650L. All were problem free.

I have also owned a CRF250R and CRF250X. Both of these bikes used oil because they only have two rings on the piston, no third oil sweep ring like the WR450F and WR250F. The lack of the third ring didn't cause anything to break but I did have to add oil to both bikes every 100 miles of riding and it was always on my mind. I could smell the oil burning when I would follow either bike and the same was true for my friends with CRF450R's. Another friend who rides his CRF450X in Baja, has to carry quarts of oil with him while the other riders on WR450F's never add oil on five day rides in Baja.

I have since switched to Yamaha WR450's and they have been trouble free for two years and I only add oil when it is changed. These WR's are giving me the same reliability I enjoyed with the XR's I owned but are allot more fun to ride. For 200+ mile days dual sporting when you are both on and off road, you can't beat the comfort of the XR650L even though it is much heavier than the CRFX's and WR's. I am thinking about getting another XR650L for dual sporting because of its comfortable seat, and still keep the WR's for more aggressive off roading.

  • Few

Posted July 26, 2006 - 08:09 AM

#15

I have since switched to Yamaha WR450's and they have been trouble free for two years and I only add oil when it is changed. These WR's are giving me the same reliability I enjoyed with the XR's I owned but are allot more fun to ride. For 200+ mile days dual sporting when you are both on and off road, you can't beat the comfort of the XR650L even though it is much heavier than the CRFX's and WR's. I am thinking about getting another XR650L for dual sporting because of its comfortable seat, and still keep the WR's for more aggressive off roading.


Wow, It never amazes me how Great Minds think alike! :thumbsup:
Are you my long lost brother?

  • exaresix

Posted July 26, 2006 - 03:33 PM

#16

I agree that riding the CRF450 is intoxicating compared to the XR600 (which I have). I rode with a guy two years ago on his brand new CRF. I ran into him last week and asked if he had been riding much. Nope...the CRF engine is fully disassembled, awaiting a rebuild.

  • 52wheelz

Posted July 26, 2006 - 05:23 PM

#17

I agree that riding the CRF450 is intoxicating compared to the XR600 (which I have). I rode with a guy two years ago on his brand new CRF. I ran into him last week and asked if he had been riding much. Nope...the CRF engine is fully disassembled, awaiting a rebuild.

What really fry's me is that Honda will not admit to anything regarding the CRF's. Yamaha doesn't put down Honda and the only way I learned the details about what was going on with the CRF's I owned at the time I owned them, was to search for info on thumpertalk and I actually reviewed the engine parts list of the WR's and CRF's at the parts counter of my local dealer who sells both.

In 2005, this dealer stocked CRF pistons, rings, valves, valve springs etc. but never needed to stock these same parts for the WR's or YZF's. This was the most telling information I ever got. The parts guy I know said they sell a boat load of engine parts for the CRF's but rarely sold parts for the Yamaha motors. This was in 2005 so things may have changed since then but since I have been riding blue, these things never cross my mind.

To be fair, the 2006 Yamaha YZ250F has had some engine problems. But guess what!!!!! Yamaha has announced a recall on these bikes and is taking care of their customers, something Honda did not do in 2005. Sorry for ragging on Honda as overall, I like their products and have owned many of them over the years including cars and generators. But this is one area of their business where they have a severe blind spot and have not taken care of their loyal customers.

  • rmhrc630

Posted July 26, 2006 - 06:49 PM

#18

I agree that riding the CRF450 is intoxicating compared to the XR600 (which I have). I rode with a guy two years ago on his brand new CRF. I ran into him last week and asked if he had been riding much. Nope...the CRF engine is fully disassembled, awaiting a rebuild.


Umm why is this surprising?

The CRF engine weighs 29kg

The XR engine weighs 51kg

That is the CRF engine is only 56% of the XR. That means everything is heavier and probably for a reason - mostly more durable.

There will be tech advances which will result in lighter parts being somewhat more durable but really we're getting near the limit with CRFs as to longevity.

My XR is literally a tank - I love it but I also love the CRF I built.
I own both.

Dont rag on CRFs without also explaining their benefits over the XR. It aint apples and apples





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