Chain Slap


32 replies to this topic
  • waynus

Posted July 18, 2006 - 12:06 AM

#21

Gray Racer, that's really well thought out and yet simple. I'll be doing it to mine shortly.
I see on your home page you have extended idle mixture screws. Are they bought ones or have you extended the original?

Wayne

  • grayracer513

Posted July 18, 2006 - 07:24 AM

#22

The fuel screws are over the counter stuff. Most are very similar to each other, although some, such as the Zip-Ty seem not to have enough friction on them to hold them in place. Cure that by stretching the spring slightly as you install it.

  • MountainMax

Posted July 18, 2006 - 08:08 AM

#23

Ok, WGP I disagree, if i put my chain to the spec listed in the book my chain will slap, put silicone under the guide and it disapeared and stayed gone for 1500km so far since then.

Secondly how dows lugging the engine hurt it? I am an automotive mechanic and can't understand how putting around will hurt anything other then build up some carbon inside the engine. If you think that chain slapping noise hurts the engine I beg to differ, it's just the way the engine fires and pulses, on the power stroke, three no power strokes, over and over i guess puts strain on and off the chain causing it to slap. Just my opinion......

  • WGP

Posted July 18, 2006 - 09:23 AM

#24

Nothin wrong with disagreeing....

Its ALL opinion.......one thing works for some and doesn't for others.. :thumbsup:

All we can do is say is what worked for us.....and hope it works for somebody else to keep us and our bikes happy.

Then there are the "EGO'S" :ride:

  • MountainMax

Posted July 18, 2006 - 10:48 AM

#25

no problem, but could you tell us why you think/know that lugging the engines are bad on them? I am curious if this is just an opinion or if you know of a sympton that this causes, thanks.

  • WGP

Posted July 18, 2006 - 11:01 AM

#26

I never mentioned that.. :thumbsup:

I think your thinkin of Greyracer513?

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  • Bamster

Posted July 18, 2006 - 05:28 PM

#27

no problem, WGP, but could you tell us why you think/know that lugging the engines are bad on them? I am curious if this is just an opinion or if you know of a sympton that this causes, thanks.



I was always told that over lugging an engine is harder on it the clutch and the transmission than keeping the rev's at a respectable level. it's like when hauling a trailer you should never haul in overdrive.
Could be an urban myth but it seems to make sense that the lugging would put more strain on everything.

  • MountainMax

Posted July 18, 2006 - 05:32 PM

#28

Well for automobiles you shouldn't haul in overdrive for many reasons, one is the final drive ratio is very low where the engine don't have much power and it could cause the clutch plates to slip. When you use the newer rigs with tow/haul mode, they increase the line pressure to prevent smooth shifts and better for towing. How this relates to bikes I really don't think it does........ IMHO

  • grayracer513

Posted July 18, 2006 - 05:54 PM

#29

At low RPM, under fairly heavy loads, the force delivered by the power stroke is applied to a rod bearing and main bearings which are rotating at much lower speeds. Because of that, the bearings are not planing as well, and the load is delivered as more of a point impact than if the revs were higher. This generally an understood truth in the automotive world as well, but it applies even more to single cylinder, ball bearing engines than it does to 6's and 8's with plain bearings, and short skirted slipper type pistons really would rather run at higher speeds than be slammed against the cylinder wall at 1200 RPM. Additionally, at low speeds, the transmission sees the power delivery more as a series of blows, rather than a flow of torque. This is particularly hard on things such as the cushion unit in the clutch. How slow is too slow depends on the load applied.

As far as pulling loads in high gears in trucks, etc., the admonition to avoid that has more to do with the automatic transmission's torque converter. At low rpm under a load, the converter is in the "rolling stall", torque multiplying mode of operation. Converters running in stall are the source of 90% of the heat generated by an AT, and pulling up a grade in OD can send your ATF temps over 290 in short order.

Most of the slap noise is just the result of the chain banging against the swing arm, and is not harmful to the engine in and of itself, but it is caused by pulling loads at low RPM, and it is generally true that the engine will more easily carry that load at a higher speed.

  • bluebike1999

Posted July 19, 2006 - 12:55 AM

#30

At low RPM, under fairly heavy loads, the force delivered by the power stroke is applied to a rod bearing and main bearings which are rotating at much lower speeds. Because of that, the bearings are not planing as well, and the load is delivered as more of a point impact than if the revs were higher. This generally an understood truth in the automotive world as well, but it applies even more to single cylinder, ball bearing engines than it does to 6's and 8's with plain bearings, and short skirted slipper type pistons really would rather run at higher speeds than be slammed against the cylinder wall at 1200 RPM. Additionally, at low speeds, the transmission sees the power delivery more as a series of blows, rather than a flow of torque. This is particularly hard on things such as the cushion unit in the clutch. How slow is too slow depends on the load applied.

As far as pulling loads in high gears in trucks, etc., the admonition to avoid that has more to do with the automatic transmission's torque converter. At low rpm under a load, the converter is in the "rolling stall", torque multiplying mode of operation. Converters running in stall are the source of 90% of the heat generated by an AT, and pulling up a grade in OD can send your ATF temps over 290 in short order.

Most of the slap noise is just the result of the chain banging against the swing arm, and is not harmful to the engine in and of itself, but it is caused by pulling loads at low RPM, and it is generally true that the engine will more easily carry that load at a higher speed.


i have to agree, due partly to my own experiences and from what i've read here.
coming from the farm, i would get a clip around the head for revving the shit out of an engine and all those slaps taught me to keep the revs low, BUT the wr is designed to be a high revving engine, as opposed to the farm vehicles.
having done nearly a million monos (wheelies) where i prefer to balance the bike on its lowest revs, i now am replacing big end rod piston etc and when its back together i intend to carry out my activities at far higher revs ( yes i know this goes against all my power versus wear ideals). the bike even sounds 'happier' at higher revs

so much for a chain slap thread

  • Premo

Posted July 19, 2006 - 02:21 AM

#31

Ok, WGP I disagree, if i put my chain to the spec listed in the book my chain will slap, put silicone under the guide and it disapeared and stayed gone for 1500km so far since then.

So because you can't hear it, is the problem really solved?

  • Bamster

Posted July 19, 2006 - 05:57 AM

#32

the power delivery more as a series of blows, rather than a flow of torque.



This is exactly what i was thinking.

  • enduro10

Posted July 20, 2006 - 12:38 PM

#33

My 2005 shows the same "problem" also wearing the sub-frame. I use a piece of nylon-like to protect the frame and change the chain (DID) and sprockets every 2.000 Km. And the slaping chain also bites my 120 rear tire increasing the tension and damage every time the chain is touched by the tire !




 
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