Rear shock tuning questions 05 wr450


14 replies to this topic
  • minion

Posted April 17, 2006 - 07:17 PM

#1

I've looked all through my manual, but no where can I find the following:

a) Proper free sag (race sag is 90-100mm according to the book).

:thumbsup: Where the actual adjusters are for the rear shock.

c) What high speed compression dampening affects.

I've figured out by doing a search in this forum that the low speed compression dampening is the screw inside of the bolt, and that the bolt is the high speed compression dampening.

I haven't been able to find out where the rebound dampening is though. And I haven't the fogiest idea what types of terrain affect low speed or high speed compression. Can someone shed some light on this for me?

Thanks,
M.

  • tony1970

Posted April 17, 2006 - 08:31 PM

#2

Keep looking through your manual, there is a whole section on suspension tuning and setting your sag. As far as I know there is no high and low speed compression settings on the WR, but I may be wrong and would like to here if there is and how to set it also. Your comp. and rebound clickers are on the top side of your shock and bottom near the linkage point. Keep searching through your manual, you will find all the answers there. Good luck.

  • motojason

Posted April 17, 2006 - 10:02 PM

#3

It's in the manual. High speed compression adjuster is on the shock reservoir, 17 mm nut. The screw in the middle of it is the low speed compression adjuster. Rebound is at the bottom of the shock.

H.S.C. adjusts reaction to large wheel movements (impacts)

Static (free) sag should be about 20% of race sag if the spring is the correct rate for your weight.

  • pkcof

Posted April 18, 2006 - 01:45 AM

#4

just a note regarding the forks on the '05 450. I just serviced mine recently and if you haven't yet then i suggest that you do. The fork oil from the factory seems pretty crappy and there was a different oil level in each fork. I'm sure that the factory pumps these things out fairly quickly but in my opinion there is no excuse for incompetence - especially seeing as how we pay good money for these things. I refilled each fork to the correct level using Motul 2.5 weight fork oil and the difference is really noticeable - also the clickers now have more range to play in ...
just my 2c ...

  • minion

Posted April 18, 2006 - 07:43 AM

#5

just a note regarding the forks on the '05 450. I just serviced mine recently and if you haven't yet then i suggest that you do. The fork oil from the factory seems pretty crappy and there was a different oil level in each fork. I'm sure that the factory pumps these things out fairly quickly but in my opinion there is no excuse for incompetence - especially seeing as how we pay good money for these things. I refilled each fork to the correct level using Motul 2.5 weight fork oil and the difference is really noticeable - also the clickers now have more range to play in ...
just my 2c ...


From what I've heard, the factory ships them dry, and the shop is responsible for filling the forks. Mine were also out of spec - I had a "slide metal" go bad on me (the teflon tore inside of the fork), so I had to tear down the forks already. I added an additional 15ml of fluid to each one (from the stock setting), and adjusted the rebound damping two more clicks - that made a big difference in the way the front end handled. I don't wash out like I used to.

  • Bamster

Posted April 18, 2006 - 08:06 AM

#6

From what I've heard, the factory ships them dry, and the shop is responsible for filling the forks.



My friend picked his up at the shop still in the crate.
There was oil in the forks.

  • tmckeown

Posted April 18, 2006 - 10:03 AM

#7

Hi,

Biggest difference will come by re-valving that shock and front shocks too.
My shocks were re-valved 2 months a go and it is a complitely different bike :thumbsup:

Timo Mc

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  • bg10459

Posted April 18, 2006 - 10:37 AM

#8

H.S.C. adjusts reaction to large wheel movements (impacts)

This is not quite correct. H.S.C. adjusts reaction to fast wheel movements. HSC is for square edged bumps like a ledge up or down. LSC is for softer edges like jump faces and landings. You can bottom the suspension landing from a big jump, but this is still LSC. Just think of the vertical movement of the wheel in relation the the horizontal movement. HS and LS refer to the shock shaft speed.

  • Matty05

Posted April 18, 2006 - 05:10 PM

#9

Hi,

Biggest difference will come by re-valving that shock and front shocks too.
My shocks were re-valved 2 months a go and it is a complitely different bike :thumbsup:

Timo Mc

Yep, I wouldn't waste my time with stock suspension!
My bike feels way lighter, absolutely rails anything and is way easier to ride. :thumbsup:

  • minion

Posted April 18, 2006 - 05:44 PM

#10

Yep, I wouldn't waste my time with stock suspension!
My bike feels way lighter, absolutely rails anything and is way easier to ride. :thumbsup:


So what are they revalving it to? Similar specs to a stock YZ, or completely different? I've looked at the parts breakdown of the YZ forks vs the WR forks, and it appears that the only difference is the valving and spring rates - all the other internal componets are the same.

I really don't think my stock suspension is all that bad. I've been riding my WR on a motocross track, and haven't bottomed out, or felt anything extremely harsh. I've changed the clickers on my front forks, as well as the fluid level from stock, and I've set my sag on the rear and that is it.

The last bike I had before my WR was a 1980 XR500, and I've never ridden a YZ, so to me, the suspension is awesome. Ignorance is bliss, maybe, but from what I'm used to, its good enough.

M.

  • tmckeown

Posted April 18, 2006 - 10:38 PM

#11

Hi,

In those valves there are very thin metal plates inside which are called shims.
So re-valving in actually re-shimming. By that you can control how much oil flows thru those valves and with what resistance. Those metal shims comes with several different thickness. So what does that guru needs to know before he/she can shim you shocks ? how much you weight with driving gear on, how much does your bike weight and which type of driving are shocks coming to. They usually have good advices how to setup your bike too. Guy I use always preset those for customer. My rear shock rebound was 2 clicks off everything else is like he set them up :thumbsup:
They also do maintenance to those shock at the same time (oil, seals, check up), remember shocks do gather condensed water and that will spoil shock oil.

Timo Mc

  • Matty05

Posted April 19, 2006 - 05:42 AM

#12

[B]

So what are they revalving it to? Similar specs to a stock YZ, or completely different? I've looked at the parts breakdown of the YZ forks vs the WR forks, and it appears that the only difference is the valving and spring rates - all the other internal componets are the same.

There is lots of factors at play like oil weights and height. This all effects how the suspension performs. Yes the components are similar between the YZ and WR. They are basically Showa forks off the honda's. Mine are firm but supple. Something I thought wouldn't be possible. It isn't rock hard supercross suspension, but yes, it is firm. I can hit tree roots flat out and the wheel won't deflect, I can fly down a rocky hill and not bounce everywhere and still pick and change lanes as I choose.

I really don't think my stock suspension is all that bad. I've been riding my WR on a motocross track, and haven't bottomed out, or felt anything extremely harsh. I've changed the clickers on my front forks, as well as the fluid level from stock, and I've set my sag on the rear and that is it.

They do say, the best suspension you know is what you have ridden. Ride someone elses bike that has had the suspension tweaked, you will hate your bike. It will feel slow, heavy and won't go where you want it to go in comparison.

The last bike I had before my WR was a 1980 XR500, and I've never ridden a YZ, so to me, the suspension is awesome. Ignorance is bliss, maybe, but from what I'm used to, its good enough.

M.

Good tuners have their gift for setting up the suspension to what you wouldn't believe was possible. A revalve and respring if you need it is money very well spent.

I keep on asking my self all the time, do I really need this for my bike? Should I really buy that? Regarding the suspension, the answer is definately yes!!!


BTW, the stock settings are usually very close if not the best settings for the bike to work properly.

  • WGP

Posted April 19, 2006 - 06:25 AM

#13

"BTW, the stock settings are usually very close if not the best settings for the bike to work properly"

This is not true.....I have tweaked the settings on both front and rear and it makes a huge difference for the better.
Basically I have increased the rebound and softened the compression each about 2-4 clicks. (away from stock)
Before spending lots of money on suspension it is worth the time to play with your clickers.

  • tmckeown

Posted April 19, 2006 - 06:43 AM

#14

Hi,

You should take first a close look to your bikes manual and there they say which riders weight rate suspension is designed for. With spring rates you can set-up for the weight or them difference in enduro to for example supermoto. I use stock spring for enduro 0.428kg/mm and for supermoto 0.49kg/mm in front. Also in enduro I use 5W shock oil and supermoto 10W shock oil. In the rear in enduro again stock 4.9kg/mm and supermoto 5.7kg/mm. Re-shimming will give you clickers reasonable effect on that set-up. Just like mine when I'm very light weight with original shimming and springs I have to turn clickers all the way open and it is still too stiff fully open but also too loose when compressed. You can also effect front shocks with oil level. These gurus who do these shocks for living can give you vital information how to set it up.

Timo Mc

  • Matty05

Posted April 19, 2006 - 07:06 AM

#15

"BTW, the stock settings are usually very close if not the best settings for the bike to work properly"

This is not true.....I have tweaked the settings on both front and rear and it makes a huge difference for the better.
Basically I have increased the rebound and softened the compression each about 2-4 clicks. (away from stock)
Before spending lots of money on suspension it is worth the time to play with your clickers.

2 clicks is very close. :thumbsup:

Try some ohlins suspension, with 60 clicks of adjustment. The shock will be about 30 clicks out from what they recommend! :thumbsup:




 
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