vortex


22 replies to this topic
  • ncmountainman

Posted March 25, 2006 - 07:38 AM

#1

ordered up a vortex ign from M-T racing yesterday :thumbsup: i think i'm gonna love the dual map setup,one for go fast and one selectable from 9 others;6 traction control(which i was told is comparable to a couple oz of FWW up to 16 oz!) and then 3 go faster with even higher rev limits!(which doesn't sound like a good idea on a 450,the reg go fast default setting is already 200 rpms more) they state in the regular go fast mode its a 2hp dyno proven gain :thumbsup: gotta love technology,anyone have any real world experience with them?

  • ncmountainman

Posted March 31, 2006 - 04:44 PM

#2

well it turns out that the default setting #1 is the fastest and the other 9 build up to that(6 traction,torque,linear,and stock?,then the go fast,which is the default). just got it on and rode around the test loop,i removed the ICAT(its already sold) as the feller at MT racing said it had the same kind of circuitry built in,i know there is a race team that runs them both...but its already gone to help pay for the vortex :thumbsup: i'll tell ya what this thing is no joke! in the default mode(fastest) it gives up a little bottom end but when it goes you'd better be hanging on :confused: the only other setting i tried was the torque setting(#6) the thing just claws its way up a hill that before i had to spin alot to go up. i'll try the lower traction settings in some clay when its wet to see if it'll really make a difference,i'd have to say it will though judging from the difference in #1 to #6. is it worth $400? just the versatility is worth it,never mind the 2 extra HP's in #1 (take my word for it,they're there) this thing is almost like changing cam profiles with a flick of the thumb :thumbsup:

  • FFRacing79

Posted March 31, 2006 - 05:54 PM

#3

I am glad your happy...so I wont show the dyno graphs as to pop the bubble. Tdub

  • ncmountainman

Posted March 31, 2006 - 08:23 PM

#4

well it certainly runs a heck of alot better,the butt dyno shows my front wheel coming up in 4th the way it used to in 3rd, i'm overshooting the turns on my test loop and i can definately tell the difference between maps(1 and 6 anyway) seems like a quality product that does what it said it would :thumbsup: if it helps in the slick stuff(traction modes) i'll be more than happy in my bubble....step away from the bubble :thumbsup:

  • ncmountainman

Posted April 03, 2006 - 08:15 AM

#5

i raced the flatrock HS yesterday and the traction control even on the lightest setting of #5 was quite helpful on the slick root sections. i tried a lap without it on traction and it was alot harder to stay in my line and the rear was slipping off the roots like one would expect,so i went back to #5. one thing that really stands out in either mode is how much smoother the motor runs. FFR,even if it shows no gain on the dyno it definately gives back the "hit" and if you don't want it,flick your thumb :thumbsup:

  • Indy_WR450

Posted April 06, 2006 - 03:38 AM

#6

Revs are limited in each map. The Vortex product is awesome and for those that think you cant get a couple of HP from performance fuel & ignition timing have never seen a dyno session with a power commander and a sport bike. :thumbsup:

  • SCIENCE

Posted April 06, 2006 - 06:05 AM

#7

ordered up a vortex ign from M-T racing yesterday :thumbsup: i think i'm gonna love the dual map setup,one for go fast and one selectable from 9 others;6 traction control(which i was told is comparable to a couple oz of FWW up to 16 oz!) and then 3 go faster with even higher rev limits!(which doesn't sound like a good idea on a 450,the reg go fast default setting is already 200 rpms more) they state in the regular go fast mode its a 2hp dyno proven gain :thumbsup: gotta love technology,anyone have any real world experience with them?


The Vortex was absolutely the best mod I made on my 2003 YZ250F! Mike Toole(sp) is a great resource when it comes to the different settings. He tests regularly w/Factory Yamaha and their satellite teams. I think both DV an Reedy ran the Vortex on their factory 450F's last year. Not sure if Reed and Voss are running them on their '06's.

  • SurvivorMan

Posted April 06, 2006 - 06:55 AM

#8

I do mostly XC's and HS up here in the canadian rockies...lots of spinning shale climbs, roots and rock....i guess the same everywhere in the rockies. i have been thinking about getting a 12 - 16 oz flywheel weight. however, i know the flywheel weights really don't make that much of a difference but are nice in some circumstances. this 06 yz 450 is great but is a monster when it gets greasy and technical and riding a gear or 2 gears high usually solves this until i stall. is this the only option for gaining more traction? it really sounds great! i would rather spend money on an ignition than a flywheel weight? is there anyway i could change the ignition over to a wr or close too??

  • grayracer513

Posted April 06, 2006 - 08:37 AM

#9

for those that think you cant get a couple of HP from performance fuel & ignition timing have never seen a dyno session with a power commander and a sport bike. :thumbsup:

Everyone knows the '03 YZ450 was, "aggressive", to be polite, and that the '04 was a little milder, and that the '05 was so much milder that people complained about it. All three of these bikes have the same cams, the same flywheels, the same exhaust, and the same size carb. Care to guess what the difference was? It wasn't the revised air boot. Hints provided on request.

  • ncmountainman

Posted April 06, 2006 - 10:49 AM

#10

never thought of it like that gray,there was a bit of compression reduction for 05 though. i just wish i'd gotten this thing sooner. bigdog, if you run HS,all i've got to say is go for it :thumbsup: i wouldn't worry about the extra overrev unless you hang on the limiter,its actually so much smoother in the upper rev's i'd say its better for the motor :thumbsup:

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  • grayracer513

Posted April 06, 2006 - 10:56 AM

#11

never thought of it like that gray,there was a bit of compression reduction for 05 though.

Not anywhere near enough to account for the difference, though.

Wes, if you're looking for power, a Vortex or other multi-map CDI is a good idea. Not as necessary on the '03 or '04, but it still helps. The harnesses and stators changed through the years. Get one specific to yours.

  • ncmountainman

Posted April 06, 2006 - 11:05 AM

#12

it sure beats the crap outa the ICAT,the vortex are also warranted for a yr too:thumbsup: gray,i would think they'd be just as beneficial to the 03-04 for the traction control,just maybe not as much HP gain.

  • Indy_WR450

Posted April 06, 2006 - 03:27 PM

#13

Plus you get 10% off of list if you tell them NCMountainman sent you! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :confused:

  • ncmountainman

Posted April 07, 2006 - 07:09 AM

#14

who do i tell them sent me to get my 10% :thumbsup:

  • Indy_WR450

Posted April 07, 2006 - 06:00 PM

#15

Pioneers have to pay their price!!!! :thumbsup:
I dont buy any mod until it is full tested and stamped approved my NCMountainman!! :thumbsup:

  • treehopper

Posted April 08, 2006 - 03:02 PM

#16

The harnesses and stators changed through the years. Get one specific to yours.

To install an '06 CDI in an '03 450 I would need harness, stator and CDI from an '06? Thanks.

  • motobark

Posted April 08, 2006 - 05:39 PM

#17

To install an '06 CDI in an '03 450 I would need harness, stator and CDI from an '06? Thanks.



Here's another question, has anyone tried the '03 ignition in an '06? 50hp at the rear wheel AND that quick '03 hit, now that would be fun! I will admit that the '06 is WAY easier to ride faster longer, but that '03 hit sure is a lot of fun. I need a switch on the bar for two ign curves- I could label one of them "fast" and the other "fun"! Maybe I should be looking into one of these Vortex boxes for myself?

I am glad your happy...so I wont show the dyno graphs as to pop the bubble. Tdub


Tdub, I use a dyno just about everyday, but for emission testing cars, not squeezing more hp out of bikes. I have pretty much no experience with bikes and dynos. That said, I do know a little about tuning cars and bikes. Can any of the newer dynos compare how responsive the motor is? I know you can have a motor that puts out lots of hp, but it takes forever to get to the power. Like small carbs vs. big carbs in cars, for the most part, the bigger carb will get you more hp, but the smaller carb will have much quicker response. Same idea with 4 stroke bike headpipes, bigger will get you more top end power, but if it's too big it won't want to rev out of the bottom end to get to that top end power. On the dyno the bigger headpipe might show more peak hp, but riding the bike it wouldn't have the quick response of the smaller headpipe.

I believe the dyno charts on the '06 YZ450, I know it's making more power than my '03 was. I also know that it builds that power much slower than the '03 did. (Which in a lot of situations makes it easier to go faster on, which is why they did it.) I believe grayracer's theory of it all being in the timing map, that makes perfect sense. If I could adjust the timing curve like in a car, I'd give it more timing advance through the bottom half of it's total rpm, and I'm betting I'd get back a lot of that "hit". I'm also betting on a dyno it wouldn't show much of a difference in hp. Unless like I was asking, can you graph acceleration TIME as well as rpm, torque and hp on any of these dynos?

  • grayracer513

Posted April 08, 2006 - 06:21 PM

#18

To install an '06 CDI in an '03 450 I would need harness, stator and CDI from an '06? Thanks.

That's not at all what I said. The '06 uses an Inverted flywheel like the WR models ( but not interchangeable with them), so it will not back fit to any earlier models. I'd go with a Vortex if you're unhappy with your '03. Bob (NC) makes a point regarding the usefulness of the traction control maps on the earlier models. And the cool part is that you can switch back to fiercely aggresive much more easily than by swapping flywheels around.

  • FFRacing79

Posted April 08, 2006 - 06:22 PM

#19

First off Moto, the '06 ignition won't fit on the earlier models.
There is a way to graph acceleration time on the dyno. This is why I adamantly disagree with people when they say I can't duplicate track conditions on the dyno. With the latest software and brake systems you can duplicate just about any condition. The '06 does not dyno anywhere near the earlier models. The head really restricts the HP and TQ. The '06 is so soft in its delivery, not only on the dyno but on the track as well.
The '03 ignition was flawed, proved by the disconnection of the TPS. It gained 2 hp and lost the "hit" when disconnected. This mod does not benefit as much with the newer models. Basically what it does is it throws full advance at the motor sooner.
The dyno can be used for much more than just finding peak numbers. You can test if the "powernow" works at any given rpm(it DON'T), you can test different pipes for different rpm ranges.
Not kidding, but I probably have as many if not more dyno pulls on a YZF450/500 than anyone. I can tell you anything from which pipe, which cam, which piston, which crank, which ignition, which carb, which head, which porter, which valve combo, etc etc will work the best.
It's all on how it is put to the ground...and that CAN be determined on the dyno, IF you know how to operate it. Tdub

  • motobark

Posted April 08, 2006 - 09:15 PM

#20

The '06 does not dyno anywhere near the earlier models. The head really restricts the HP and TQ. The '06 is so soft in its delivery, not only on the dyno but on the track as well.



Thread about '06 hp compared to earlier 450's...

the pre 06 yzf 450 were 46-48 hp.


Ok, I'm confused, does the '06 dyno lower hp numbers than the earlier 450's or not? :thumbsup: (I'm talking about comparing stock motors.) If so, what are you doing to the '06's to get more out of them?





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