1X team DQ'd by Score at SF 250 Race

63 replies to this topic
  • Ret09

Posted March 14, 2006 - 09:45 AM


I know there is a lot of chatter on this. I was at the finish line when 1X and 7X came thru. Both factory Hondas were running small Garmin GPS units on their handlebars. The 7X bike also had a 5" gap in his rear rim where the shoulder had come apart from the wheel. must have been a big rock. Robby said he hit every rock for the last 5 miles to the finish. :thumbsup:

  • rmhrc630

Posted March 14, 2006 - 12:51 PM


Honda has apparently broken the straw this time.

Not being from socal many on here has said for years that it is well known Honda cheats.

In fact i recall asking this and the consensus was exactly that.

Why do they cheat? Course cutting is course cutting. I was brought up to believe Honda owned the desert. (well only after Danny died in 95)

It would be great to see the datalogs of the 2 bikes from the SF race.

With 650R production winding down and JC moving on to "different engagements" is this the end of the Honda line in baja/desert?

  • pigryder

Posted March 14, 2006 - 01:08 PM


I might be wrong let me know if I am but I thought they had to meet check points, and not a particular course :thumbsup:

  • Ret09

Posted March 14, 2006 - 03:02 PM


Checkpoints yes. Score rules are you can't stray more than 50' off the race course. This was more than 50' I guess. Before these Rally Loggers,k there was really no way to tell unless it was witnessed personally and then protested.

  • XR4DEZ

Posted March 14, 2006 - 08:24 PM


Johnny on the beach in Dust to Glory was more than 50 ft. from the course.Some claim the fast cheater lines are the rewards of good prerunning.This may be the first year Honda has not been above the 50 ft. rule.Wonder why that happened or who was in the helocopter that turned them in.

  • Kritter

Posted March 14, 2006 - 08:33 PM


With 650R production winding down and JC moving on to "different engagements" is this the end of the Honda line in baja/desert?

JC is taking Ogilvie's spot I thought.

All American Honda Riders were on 450X's as well as several other racers...something I didnt think was coming so soon. If they race it in the 500 and the 1000 im buying an 07...

  • adam574

Posted March 14, 2006 - 09:53 PM


i love the baja but don't know much about the rules.. when you say 50ft do you mean 50ft from the trail there are sapost to follow. i would think alot of guys probably break that rule.

  • Ret09

Posted March 15, 2006 - 08:52 AM


American Honda fielded two bikes at SF. A XR 650 and a CRF 450X. It is said that the Honda Helicopter was following 1X after they missed a visual checkpoint earlier in the race. The 50' rule has been around for decades. Until the rally Logger was installed, there were very few ways to prove short coursing. The Dust to Glory scene was exciting, but Honda fought to have it taken out of the movie because of what it implies. The end result will be probably the Honda A team will have one less rider come the Baja 500. They dont sell bikes when it comes out there A team is DQ'd for short coursing. Too bad too. They would have had 2nd at least behind the B team on their CRF 450X at least. :thumbsup:

  • Kritter

Posted March 15, 2006 - 09:19 AM


The end result will be probably the Honda A team will have one less rider come the Baja 500.

Thats horseshit if there is any truth to that! They have been cheating for years so there is no need to make the new guy the scapegoat...and I never stick up for the new guy(Mike) due to his bad attitude.

  • rmhrc630

Posted March 15, 2006 - 12:11 PM


whats the latest?

Is Honda USA going to bury this story or is there more to come?

Kind of a big deal - the advertising down here in Oz is that Honda dominates baja - if that's through cheapting (and for years) then it really stinks.

someone should be blowing the top off this story

Visit the ThumperTalk Store for the lowest prices on motorcycle / ATV parts and accessories - Guaranteed
  • Mikie1

Posted March 16, 2006 - 11:00 AM


Even if they didn't get DQ'd, and even if they had come in second behind Kendall & Bell, you gotta remember, this is the 250, not the 500 or 1000. This course is very very tough- much more so than either the 500 or 1000 has been in the past. Favors lighter, more nimble bikes. Last year KTM won this race on a 525. Sure, Honda had a bonehead problem with their bike, but if I remember right the KTM was right on their butts or ahead of them most of the race.

The 650 will still rule in the 1000- especially this year, Ensenada-to-La Paz. Speeds are much higher which favors the 650. The 450s could give 'em fits in the 500 though, depending on the course.

  • motochris

Posted March 16, 2006 - 11:13 AM


The best thing to come of all this is that the B team should end up with the coveted 1X plate for 2006. As long as they just finish the 500 and 1000, it's theirs.

  • jeff leonard

Posted March 18, 2006 - 05:05 PM


You will not see a 450 in the winners circle for the 500 or the 1000, or a 525 for that matter. San Felipe is not an open bike race. 200 miles of whoops. As far as Childress intentionally cheating, no way, some of the washes are 100 yards wide and there are 20 lines through them, you change lines at the blink of an eye if it looks better to you. At the riders meeting, Sal made special mention to the fact of rally loggers and they would be looking at each one specifically for course cutting. I think Honda found a decent line and felt it was within the parameters of the race course and took it, I'm sure alot of other riders rode the same line but did not get DQ'd, it was raining and you could clearly see where the riders in front of you had gone., If the line looked decent you would take it, i dont care how much you pre-ran. I have no idea what section they were off course in, everyone just loves to jump on the they are cheating bandwagon. The reason they win so many races is that they haul ass on the 650, period.

  • XR4DEZ

Posted March 18, 2006 - 06:04 PM


I was told they were DQd for cutting out part of Zoo Rd not a wide wash.Was it Zoo or the pole line after it?

  • mikekay

Posted March 19, 2006 - 12:07 AM


Honda missed the visual check at Mile 14.
(cause for DQ)

Then they took the illegal cheater single track between Check 1 and the Dry Lake.(cause for DQ)

Then they where spotted riding on the access road between Chanote and Huatamote.(cause for DQ)

Finally they where spotted by the SCORE helicopter cutting the course at mile 225 by riding thru a fenced off area and gaining position over the 7x bike.
(cause for DQ)

1x was on a 650 and 7x was on a 450.

Immdeiately after the race 1x's rallytracker was reviewed and they where disqualified for cutting the course when they went off the race course, thru a fenced field, and rode parallel to the course.

Lots has been written over the years about Honda cheating. Everyone knows what they do--and most racers have their favorite Honda cheating story.
For over a decade the Honda effort in Baja has been one of the greatest scams in all of racing. If the general race fan really knew how far they over the line they have gone -- they would laugh whenever 1x rode past.
The weird thing to my mind is the way the motorcycle racer community participates in an ongoing and massive self censorship of the situation.
Several guys on TT know all about the cheating--yet to gain favor with Honda they actively deny and ridicule anyone who speaks up on the subject.

I personally found the 50 or so posts from racers over at race-dezert to be the most interesting. The viewpoints of the Trophy Trucks was this:
How many overall baja races has Honda stolen from multi-million dollar race effort TT teams?

The impact on everything from BFG tires to Ford Truck to Speedvision to many many many other companies is hard to fully comprehend.

How many marketing compaigns would have been very different if, say, Robbie Gordon had been the overall Baja 1000 winner? Or if KTM had done better--how would that have influenced their future racing plans (they have pulled out of baja racing)

How Honda can now go back to baja is beyond me. Everyone either hates them-or laughs at them. A small group of die-hard former Honda support riders will stay loyal and try to steer criticism away from Honda and just try to blame Mike Childress--but the shit has hit the fan and its everywhere.

  • Cactus Dave

Posted March 19, 2006 - 03:48 AM


well said

  • rmhrc630

Posted March 19, 2006 - 01:00 PM


bloody well said Mike!!!!!!

There is this lingering thought though

I agree with what you say about all the other companies being ripped off. But why havent they sued for the rights to the win?

Surely BFG or toyota could make Honda bleed with a lawsuit about cheating?

Honda's cheating does stink though.

I'm looking fwd to the day when KTM start smakcing them hard - at least we then might see some bike development occur.

  • XR4DEZ

Posted March 19, 2006 - 03:40 PM


Mikekay, what got you so involved in the Honda/cheating story? It seems you're real worked up about something other than just documenting Honda's course cutting. I'm not being disrespectful but what did Honda do to you personally or is that off base.

  • weskc35k

Posted March 19, 2006 - 04:39 PM


And of course nobody else has cut the course or cheated,it's only Team Honda right.
Anyone who has had the time to pre run,pre data logging may have "found a good line".

  • Kritter

Posted March 19, 2006 - 07:33 PM


Nice response Mike...

Related Content


Join Our Community!

Even if you don't want to post, registered members get access to tools that make finding & following the good stuff easier.

If you enjoyed reading about "" here in the ThumperTalk archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join ThumperTalk today!

The views and opinions expressed on this page are strictly those of the author, and have not been reviewed or approved by ThumperTalk.