'99 WR400 - Suspension Help



50 replies to this topic
  • Brian_in_Long_Beach

Posted October 08, 2001 - 10:48 AM

#21

You guys that love your STOCK suspension - what year bike are you riding? My understanding is that there were significant changes starting with the '00 WRs.

Brian

  • Bill

Posted October 08, 2001 - 02:57 PM

#22

Brian,

I had my suspension (99) done by MX-Tech. The valving and springs are for a 225lb, mid pack "C" mx'er, who does ride rocky trails also. They revalved the bike front and rear, added the later year bottoming cones and went to a heavier rear spring.

The suspension works great and the compression stroke of the forks is much more linear and plush.

Have someone revalve the front and see if that is enough. Before spending on the rear.

Bill

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99 WR400f, YZ timed, MX-Tech suspension, Scotts steering damper, White Bros E-Series (12 discs), tapered header and a/f. Kouba T-handle for the fuel screw. Works Connection billet throttle tube and frame guards. Cycra Pro-Bend, triple clamp mount handguards. Thumper Racing rad guards, Renthal Jimmy Button highs, YZ Tank and IMS seat, YZ number plate, odo removed, de-octopussed (Thanks Clark) EKP #4, 50PJ, 175MJ, 100PAJ and 65 SJ at 500-1000' Thanks James Dean!

  • Jekel

Posted October 09, 2001 - 11:40 AM

#23

Try the Moto-Pro Max Valves in your forks. You can do the revalve yourself and the difference is like night and day. Also they will answer any questions you have during installation. Or you can send the forks to them.

  • Brian_in_Long_Beach

Posted October 09, 2001 - 01:02 PM

#24

Jekel,
Do you have contact info for Moto Pro?

Brian

  • WR_Jason

Posted October 09, 2001 - 01:29 PM

#25

You Americans, Always the same,, Just throw money at it. The problme cant just be that its a few clicks out, More, bigger, stiffer more expensive valeves and springs tuned up by someone else .,,,,,,!
Oh, wait, I AM an American,,, hehe Posted Image . No really guys listen to what he is saying, her rides on rocky trails. I can see if he is 200 lbs and wants to MX it up, then go stiff. He is saying the bike is bouncing him around, He needs to set the stock suspension soft, not revalve his aftermarket stiff springs.
BTW, my bike is a 99 WR 400. All the free mods (go figure) and stock except for bark busters and a remote hot start Posted Image .

  • MX_Tuner

Posted October 09, 2001 - 02:17 PM

#26

WR Jason, I get the impression you think revalving suspension involves stiffening it up. You can get better bottoming resistance AND much plusher damping over square edged bumps with a good revalve.

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MX Tuner

  • Jekel

Posted October 10, 2001 - 04:52 AM

#27

Moto-Pro is at www.moto-pro.com (I think) or look for their ad in the newer issues of Dirt Bike or the Rider. I installed the kit in my forks(220#without gear and .47 springs) and it made the bike SOOOOOO plush and soft for the rocks and roots. It also got rid of the harshness in the mid of the stock forks, also not blowing through the stroke as before. I had tried all the stock adjustments and different iol levels and weights of oil prior. I could either get the forks to respond on my track and beat me up in the woods and rocks, Or set it up for the woods and bottom going down ledgerock or on little jumps At around $120-130 for the kit, it was a good investment. Prior to it, adjusting the oil level to the extremes I blew a set of seals(not cheap in itself) and somehow damaged a outer fork leg(???0 which was $300. My oil level is 100mm from the top and 5wt now. I'm going to increase to 95 form the top for a little more bottoming resistance(per Moto-Pro), they still help after a year. Also it is great to revalve your own forks, easier than expected(they send excellent instructions) and you see the inner workings of the forks. Now to figure out the rear suspension;-)

  • YAMAKAZE

Posted October 10, 2001 - 07:38 AM

#28

MXTuner....I can't wait until Saturday evening....Da better half gave me the cash last night....bring on dem Gold Valves.....Let me know what time Saturday night and I'll be there. Gonna pull the Forks and the head Thurday night.

The Doctor grounded me yesterday afternoon during my annual physical. He didn't like something he saw during the stress test, now Ive got to see a Cardiologist next week for a possible blockage.....I guess I got to close to David.....Anyway gives me time to do some additional maintenance and an upgrade or two....

Bonzai Posted Image

  • Brian_in_Long_Beach

Posted October 10, 2001 - 07:49 AM

#29

WR Jason,
I agree with you about people just throwing money at the problem and hoping it goes away. My bike is probably one of most stock bikes you'll find performance wise. Only thing I've done is installed a Thumper Racing Quiet core in place of the factory pea shooter. I have spent money on the IMS tank/seat combo because I need every bit of help I can get - and besides, I needed taller/more comfortable seat foam anyways.

I have tried to find a sweet spot within the parameters of the factory valving and I have not been able to. Granted, I have not messed with oil wts or height - primarily because of everybody elses failed attempts on the '99 forks. I'll probably end up buying the parts and doing the work myself with the help of a friend who has done a couple of Gold Valve installs - haven't decided on what to do yet though.

Jason - what is your EXACT fork set-up? Since you seem to think its great maybe I could try it. I'm all for saving the money I'd spend on a revalve.

Brian

  • MX_Tuner

Posted October 10, 2001 - 01:16 PM

#30

Bill, the valving should be here tomorrow (Thursday). Lets plan on about 5:00 at my place.

You better make sure you're healthy. If I have to give you mouth to mouth..... you're gonna die.

What are you pulling the head for? I have a couple spare cylinders. Wanna do a 420 motor?

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MX Tuner

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  • MS

Posted October 10, 2001 - 01:35 PM

#31

MX Tuner:

I to am doing front suspension revalve. I have purchased Race Tech's Delta Valves, instead of the Gold valves... I have one question though... the instructions call for removing some items from the Mid Valve. this apparently is attached to the damping rod assembley. Any ideas on how to hold the rod so I can loosen the nut on the Mid Valve stack.. or does the rod come out of the assembley and if it does how does it get removed... screws out or what... Or can I skip the Mid Valve step and just install the Delta Valves... My goal is to get more compliance and sensitivity over rocks and roots as I am getting bounced off and deflected off with the stock suspension.. I am currently running Race tech springs .43'
s with one preload washer.. 2.5 wt oil at 135 mm height and compression at soft.. still getting deflection on my enduros... any advice would be appreciated.

Thanks
MS
98 WR400 SETRA S1085

  • MN_Kevin

Posted October 10, 2001 - 01:50 PM

#32

I thought the Delta valves were specifically for Supercross applications, i.e. major impacts from the 60 foot jumps...???

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'99 WZ/YR (you choose!) with ALL YZ mods, de-octopused, DSP Doug Henry airbox w/ velocity stack, FMF PowerBomb header, Stroker SX-1 silencer, SS front brake line, OEM YZ tank, IMS YZ seat, Mobil 1 15W-50.

  • MS

Posted October 10, 2001 - 01:56 PM

#33

I hope not... I logged on to the Race tech page and they recommended the Gold Valves and at the very bottom of the Product selection for my weight and bike, they suggested the Delta Valves that will replace the gold Valves... The Delta valves have high and low speed compression settings and the product package says that I can adjust to track conditions and woods with the turn of a screw driver... Hum.... did I get suckered in.... or what.. the product loooks trick... looks like it will flow a higher amount of oil... will definitely let all know the results... Still not sure about the Mid Valve modification though.

MS

  • YAMAKAZE

Posted October 11, 2001 - 03:40 AM

#34

I Too was going to go with the Delta Valves until I discussed the application with MXTuner and another respected Suspension technician here in Atlanta. Both warned of the same problem of having to dial in both forks individually and the associated hassles with doing this. The bottom line I got from everyone I spoke with was, It takes considerable time and effort to adjust for different types of terrain and it is easy to have a mis-matched setting that can cause more problems than they fix. Additionally the Gold Valves are cheaper and the mid valve can be blocked off providing a much firmer compression ratio, which is what I need since I have been bottoming out on a few big table tops and step up jumps with flat landing zones. I can't wait to see how it handles in the woods.

Bonzai Posted Image

  • Scott_F

Posted October 11, 2001 - 04:31 AM

#35

MS, accessing the mid-valve requires major surgery, not to be attempted unless very well experienced with the technique. However, I do recommend disabling the mid-valve for tight trail riding and maximum plushness.

I would also recommend skipping the Delta valve and try the Gold valves instead.

  • MX_Tuner

Posted October 11, 2001 - 01:29 PM

#36

The Delta Valves sound good in theory. The fact is they are very difficult to get adjusted the same from one fork to the other. One turn out doesn't equal one turn out on the other adjsuter. When RT first came out with them, I tried to make them work. I finally got them to work for one type of riding but then after adjusting the valves, I'd encounter a huge number of problems that would require more R&D time to dial in properly. They just aren't worth the trouble since the Gold Valves work so well.

When (or *if*) you get the Gold Valves (get Type One GV's), e-mail me and I'll recommend a valve stack. RT's stacks are virtually always too stiff on the high speed stack and sometimes too soft on the low speed stack.

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MX Tuner

  • MX_Tuner

Posted October 11, 2001 - 01:31 PM

#37

MS, where do you live. I see you ride SE&TRA events. I'm just north of Atlanta.

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MX Tuner

  • MS

Posted October 13, 2001 - 05:16 PM

#38

MX tuner:

Thanks for the heads up on the Delta Valves. Strange, but when I got my Delta Kit, I disassembled the forks, less seals of course. and low and behold, the Mid Valve parts in the kit were missing.. I called Race Tech, this was a mistake... they either did not believe I bought the product or were to lazy to secure a kit to tell me what I needed.. anyway... installation is on hold. My dealer has ordered me a new kit. but with the information you indicate.. I will go with the Gold Valves... Im currently running the Gold Valve in my Rear Shock... Works great... just need to balance the bike and get the front end working..

MX.. I live in Gadsden, AL and ride in the Vet C Class.... I will let you know when my GV kit arrives... and check back with you on the stack configuration... and thanks..

MS

  • MS

Posted October 13, 2001 - 05:22 PM

#39

MX Tuner:

Can the Mid Valve be disabled and still be used with the base valve with good results?? If so.. what is the steps needed to disable...

thanks for the help..

MS

  • MX_Tuner

Posted October 14, 2001 - 04:08 AM

#40

The mid-valve is nothing but a couple of shims that are located on the check plate side of the rebound piston. To disable the mid-valve, the shims need to be removed and an appropriate sized washer/plate has to be installed to return the operation to a normal check plate design.

This requires the cartridge being disassembled fully to expose the rebound piston.

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MX Tuner




 
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