Chest protecter or not


86 replies to this topic
  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 01:43 PM

#41

[quote name='HC']Seems Mr Xray has a bit of a temper. :thumbsup:

not only have rode Southern AZ, I keep a bike there . well tough guy, want to see a much rougher, rockery Dez? go north, WA state.

On your baja trip? you'll do well to take some advice. get some hard parts under that "soft" jacket, wether a pressure suit or a C/B rotector. nah forget it, your a tough guy.


[quote name='ewbish.. For your purposes though, I'd wear a jacket. For long rides like that, I wear a Field Shear jacket, water proof, wind proof, zip out vents for overheating, and kevlar armor in the back, shoulders, elbow, and kidney area. Plus the heavy shell stops cactus, and mesquite thorns with no problem.[/QUOTE'][/QUOTE]


The Field Shear is armored, but I will be wearing a pressure suit as well, think I mentioned that.

WA state huh? I was in the Stumpjumpers in the early 80's, as a teenager. I still have family there. Yah, I've ridden in WA.

You know, you guys are pretty funny. I like the tough guy comments. Especially since my entire point is that a POS plastic chest protector is not enough protection.

  • kelleyseiler

Posted March 03, 2006 - 01:44 PM

#42

The son of one of the guys I work with took a minor spill on his trail bike when he was 17, and took the handlebars in his abdomon. He didnt even make it the 4 miles to the hospital. He had torn something internal and died from loss of blood in 10 mins. If he had a chest protector he probably would have lived.

  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 01:47 PM

#43

Supplicate's pressure suit works great in combination with a camelback-type setup.

I crashed into his back last week in Baja and it provided great protection!

:thumbsup:

Dan



I totally agree. Well worth the money and comfortable enough to wear even on long trips. Plus, it is no where near the PITA with my camelback than my hard shell CP was.

Posted Image

  • HC

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:07 PM

#44

Horrible. re the 17 olds death.

I agree re the cheap, little roost guards leave a lot to be improved. but the heavy duty c/b/p do work.

I crashed big at speed ( flying W ) in early eighties (mid twenties for me ) at Stumper jumpers Dez 100, the real one in Mattawa ( great race, did it for yrs) , the Fox C/B protector was very, very close in design to the compression suits out today, not the fabric but the close padding and the hard parts. it helped but still buggered me up for months. doubtful would anything would of got me out in one piece of the Mattawa crash.

What most compression suits are missing is CE foam.
here is one with CE 2, which is 2X as good as CE1. W/O CE its the same as my 25 yr old Fox protector.
http://www.highveloc...r.com/home.html
I'm not a fan of the breast plate though, why not thicker material? why the center seam? cant see it flexing for movement, so I'd design it solid.

too bad there isnt a MC hard lab testing on these with real data, its is an area that could stand some improvement.

The son of one of the guys I work with took a minor spill on his trail bike when he was 17, and took the handlebars in his abdomon. He didnt even make it the 4 miles to the hospital. He had torn something internal and died from loss of blood in 10 mins. If he had a chest protector he probably would have lived.



  • roadcam

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:25 PM

#45

Sure, go through the racks at your local bike shops. You'll notice that the cheaper plastic CP's have a small print notice on the tag that tells you that it is for protection from flying debris only and not intended for injury protection in the event of a crash. The wording various by brand.

When I played football, I wore a football helmet, not a batter's helmet. Why do you think that might have been? I mean, after all, they both prevent head injuries right?

(hint, one is intended only for "flying objects", the other is intended for heavy impacts.)




you cant go by what the product disclaimer says ... thats only a catch-all avoidance of liability ... if a chest protector saved a million lives a year, and was built out of titanium, the manufacturer would still deny its 'safety features' , just to avoid the inevitable lawsuit ... wake up ... :thumbsup:

  • ghoti

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:33 PM

#46

Sure, go through the racks at your local bike shops. You'll notice that the cheaper plastic CP's have a small print notice on the tag that tells you that it is for protection from flying debris only and not intended for injury protection in the event of a crash. The wording various by brand.

When I played football, I wore a football helmet, not a batter's helmet. Why do you think that might have been? I mean, after all, they both prevent head injuries right?

(hint, one is intended only for "flying objects", the other is intended for heavy impacts.)

So would that be a no, I cant back this up? You were talking about not buy Walmart oil, are you saying the cheap plastic Walmart chest protecter?

  • brichter

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:35 PM

#47

Real quick. Does a chest protector provide protection during a crash or is it just for roost protection? I am riding baja soon and with a backpack and chest protector the straps dont fit right so I am thinking about going without. What do you think


Thanks


You'll get /some/ crash protection from it. It's a lot better than going without, which is the other option you gave.

  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:49 PM

#48

you cant go by what the product disclaimer says ... thats only a catch-all avoidance of liability ... if a chest protector saved a million lives a year, and was built out of titanium, the manufacturer would still deny its 'safety features' , just to avoid the inevitable lawsuit ... wake up ... :thumbsup:


Like I said, the gear intended to provide that protection doesn't carry the disclaimer. The disclaimer is there so that people won't think a cheap plastic chest protector provides injury protection it wasnt' designed to provide.

My pressure suit does not have the disclaimer. My Field Shear does not. My old Fox Hard Shell chest protector does, my kids previous chest protectors did as well. As I became more aware of the improvements in technology and the safety equipment available, I bought them better equipment.

There are degrees of protection available. Why do you folks promote something that isn't intended for that protection? Now, if you have a quality hard shell CP that does offer crash injury protection, and they usually make it quite clear that their product does, then no worries. But if you have some cheap POS that says it's not intended to prevent injury in a crash, and provides only protection against flying debris, then why would you expect it to protect your spine in a crash? Seriously? I mean, would you wear a BMX helmet in a desert race? I mean, why take the chance? Spend the dough on the gear made to provide the protection instead of hoping your roost guard will do enough.

  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 02:55 PM

#49

So would that be a no, I cant back this up? You were talking about not buy Walmart oil, are you saying the cheap plastic Walmart chest protecter?



Not really sure what your saying above, but again, the information you are looking for is on the products. Look.

The walmart ATF was what is known as an analogy. In other words, I was saying since Walmart ATF is like .90 a quart, and it might work just as well, why not use that in your 2-stroke tranny instead of the right oil that you know works? That is comparable to using a cheap plastic CP that has a disclaimer clearly stating that it is not intended to provide injury protection in a crash instead of spending a few extra dollars on one that does.

Main Entry: anal·o·gy
Pronunciation: &-'na-l&-jE
Function: noun
Inflected Form(s): plural -gies
1 : inference that if two or more things agree with one another in some respects they will prob. agree in others
2 a : resemblance in some particulars between things otherwise unlike : SIMILARITY b : comparison based on such resemblance

  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 03:03 PM

#50

Horrible. re the 17 olds death.

I agree re the cheap, little roost guards leave a lot to be improved. but the heavy duty c/b/p do work.

I crashed big at speed ( flying W ) in early eighties (mid twenties for me ) at Stumper jumpers Dez 100, the real one in Mattawa ( great race, did it for yrs) , the Fox C/B protector was very, very close in design to the compression suits out today, not the fabric but the close padding and the hard parts. it helped but still buggered me up for months. doubtful would anything would of got me out in one piece of the Mattawa crash.

What most compression suits are missing is CE foam.
here is one with CE 2, which is 2X as good as CE1. W/O CE its the same as my 25 yr old Fox protector.
http://www.highveloc...r.com/home.html
I'm not a fan of the breast plate though, why not thicker material? why the center seam? cant see it flexing for movement, so I'd design it solid.

too bad there isnt a MC hard lab testing on these with real data, its is an area that could stand some improvement.


That is some very nice looking gear. I totally agree that it would be nice is there was some sort of testing and standards for offroad MC's. I've had similar discussions with lots of folk regarding offroad helmets, which are subjected to far different impacts than street helmets, yet they are built to the same standard. It would be nice to see some type of lab based unbiased testing of different gear, and some type of impact standard for chest and spine protection.

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  • needsprayer

Posted March 03, 2006 - 03:41 PM

#51

I like this chest/rib protector. Been wearing it for years.


Posted Image
The ALL NEW HRP Hydro Jak XT Introducing the first chest protector ever developed exclusively for the off road rider/racer. We took our basic Flak Jak design, added a built in drink system and a revolutionary body wrap rib shield system, that holds the pads close to the body so they stay where they belong.

* Last Jak Lifetime Guarantee
* Removable Padding System
* Body Wrap Rib Shields
* Built In Removable Bladder with Mouth Piece
* Water Tube Channel
* 1.5 Airloc Buckle
* Flex Form Padded Biceps
* Plastic Sleeved Metal Rivet
* Our Original Nitrolyte Padding with Net Suspend Floating Shoulders
* 1.5 Adjustible Woven Elastic With Logo


I also wear the Bohn Proracer back protector underneath it.
http://www.bohnarmor...php?prod=KC28BK
Posted Image

My back is covered.
:thumbsup:

  • exaresix

Posted March 03, 2006 - 03:48 PM

#52

I am a physician, and I have been in a crash in Baja while using a chest protector. I made impact on solid rock with my right shoulder, fracturing my clavicle in several places as well as having a grade three AC tear. Without the shoulder protector, which is much more than "3mm of cheap plastic," but rather thick Lexan, I would have had several bony areas come through the skin (very bad). Chest protectors work. It doesn't take a brain surgeon (which I am not) to realize that the ch. protector will prevent many puncture injuries leading to pneumothorax or worse.

One other thing to clarify. The aortic tear is deceleration injury. No chest protector or special suit will stop this from happening. An airbag "may" prevent it because it slows the deceleration impact, but no airbags for dirtbikes yet.

  • HC

Posted March 03, 2006 - 04:02 PM

#53

good info, I need to make an upgrade for under jacket wear.
exarsix, how did you get out of baja? I would guess it would help to figure out some kind of plan in advance, just in case.

all right, now can we get back to hurling insults? :thumbsup:

  • CranK_Case

Posted March 03, 2006 - 04:22 PM

#54

they have helped me out alot.
saved alot of what could have been broken bones.

  • SPROUT250X

Posted March 03, 2006 - 04:38 PM

#55

i always wear one. i was running single track with a few buds and got in a little over my head, got a little to front brake happy and nailed my chest square into a pillow sized rock, bruised my chest and spraigned by right wrist.
without it i probably would have broken something in my chest :thumbsup:

  • ewbish

Posted March 03, 2006 - 06:13 PM

#56

I am a physician, and I have been in a crash in Baja while using a chest protector. I made impact on solid rock with my right shoulder, fracturing my clavicle in several places as well as having a grade three AC tear. Without the shoulder protector, which is much more than "3mm of cheap plastic," but rather thick Lexan, I would have had several bony areas come through the skin (very bad). Chest protectors work. It doesn't take a brain surgeon (which I am not) to realize that the ch. protector will prevent many puncture injuries leading to pneumothorax or worse.

One other thing to clarify. The aortic tear is deceleration injury. No chest protector or special suit will stop this from happening. An airbag "may" prevent it because it slows the deceleration impact, but no airbags for dirtbikes yet.


Was your chest protector designed to prevent injury in a crash?

As a Doc, do you think that it is appropriate to make statements that a particular piece of gear be used for a purpose it was not designed for?

Bottom line for all of you. Would you rather put your kid in gear designed to protect the spine, ribs, and chest from crash related injuries? Or is a roost deflector good enough?


You're call, 'nuff said I think.

  • JackAttack

Posted March 03, 2006 - 06:35 PM

#57

Was your chest protector designed to prevent injury in a crash?

As a Doc, do you think that it is appropriate to make statements that a particular piece of gear be used for a purpose it was not designed for?

Bottom line for all of you. Would you rather put your kid in gear designed to protect the spine, ribs, and chest from crash related injuries? Or is a roost deflector good enough?


You're call, 'nuff said I think.


Ewby,

Here is a copy of the original question to start this thread:

Real quick. Does a chest protector provide protection during a crash or is it just for roost protection?


Does a chest protector provide protection during a crash or not....real simple answer. Even a consumer products liability lawyer like yourself cannot get this answer wrong.

:thumbsup:

  • exaresix

Posted March 03, 2006 - 07:06 PM

#58

good info, I need to make an upgrade for under jacket wear.
exarsix, how did you get out of baja? I would guess it would help to figure out some kind of plan in advance, just in case.

all right, now can we get back to hurling insults? :thumbsup:


It was our last day, and I was six miles from the end. I rode out to the end. I could feel the pieces of bone jangling everytime I hit a bump. I took four Ibuprofen tabs, which helped, but the next day I was bruised all the way to my navel. Was operated on four days later (in the US).

  • Supplicate

Posted March 03, 2006 - 07:08 PM

#59

so what do you guys think it would take to build one yourself?

assuming you can get your hands on an injection molding machine that is.

  • exaresix

Posted March 03, 2006 - 07:11 PM

#60

Was your chest protector designed to prevent injury in a crash?

As a Doc, do you think that it is appropriate to make statements that a particular piece of gear be used for a purpose it was not designed for?

Bottom line for all of you. Would you rather put your kid in gear designed to protect the spine, ribs, and chest from crash related injuries? Or is a roost deflector good enough?


You're call, 'nuff said I think.


Because of liability, chest protector manufacturers generally do not call their products "chest protectors." For sure they can not fully protect someone under all circumstances. Just like seat belt manufacturers do not call their products "life savers" even though that is just what they do. I'm quite comfortable stating that chest protectors do a pretty good job of protecting the chest, just as a seatbeat does well at saving lives.





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