KTM450exc or WR450?


15 replies to this topic
  • wrmotox

Posted February 21, 2006 - 10:25 PM

#1

I am looking for some straight advice concerning my latest obsession... EXC or WR. I have a Yamaha dealer that promises to plate a new '05 WR450 out the door for $6,400 and I just found this ad on Cycle Trader.com:

2006 KTM 450EXC 450 EXC, WWW.MOTORCYCLE-BROKERS.COM 2006 KTM 450EXC FACTORY DUAL SPORT $6799, Available Now!! Includes Signals, Indicators, High/Low Beam, Brake Switches, Horn, Two Sets of Gearing (15-45 & 14-50) & Chains, DOT Knobby Tires, CHECK OUR WEBSITE FOR ACTUAL PICTURES!!! Can be registered in California!! Can ship Anywhere in the USA Via Forward Air!!! Check our Website for more detail… :bonk:

My issue is that most of my buddies are now riding the 450exc and I'm not sure I want that much bike for just trail riding and have been considering purchasing a high speed dual purpose desert oriented bike that I can ride with another group of adrenalin junkies on 650r's and spanked out WR's. :thumbsup:

I currently own a dialed in but, plush '03 YZF250 that is set up for trail riding at a technically oriented club here in Marin County. I also have a bone stock '03 WR250 (my ex-wife's bike :bonk: ) and a '02 XR250 named "lug nut".

Any feedback for desert adventure riding/dual sport/touring requiring a plate on the KTM 450EXC, KTM factory dual sport(mentioned above) vs. the WR with the free mods, over sized tank, Scott dampener and suspension work?

Thanks for the advice in advance... :thumbsup:

  • pkcof

Posted February 21, 2006 - 11:53 PM

#2

Interesting ..... IMHO dealers like to sell new bikes and are usually eager to haggle down to an agreed $$$. They also (usually) can be relied upon in the event of any problems
I checked the website that you listed and i personally would have a few concerns in doing business that way ...
How is the bike prepared for pre-delivery?
What warranty are you entitled to? (and how do you claim from something that you bought in the 'post')
How do you return it to point of purchase for any problems?
How can you do deals from a local dealer in regards to discounted accessories or ongoing servicing at a competitive rate?
If i was buying a music CD or movie DVD then sure the online way of purchasing is as good as any but for something like what you are describing, well I'd prefer a real dealership that i could trust, rely upon ... and walk into!
...just my 2 cents worth

  • turbojedi

Posted February 22, 2006 - 06:04 AM

#3

concerning your wr vs exc question, that is a tuffy. This coming from a die hard blue guy. My buddy has a 450 exc and I have a wr450. We bought them at the same time and they are both 05s. It depends what you ride as to what bike to get. The KTM is more mellow power it comes on easier, therefore at the end of the day you are not as tired. Don't get me wrong, the bike rips, it just doesn't have the hard hit the wr has. The suspension is inherently plusher than the wr. The rear is kind of weird though i can't explain it. In the end I would say ride em both. If you like to go fast get the WR for more of an MX feel. If you Like tight single track get the KTM. My 2 cents having ridden them both back to back. Let the interforum flaming of my seditious comments begin!

  • wrmotox

Posted February 22, 2006 - 08:48 AM

#4

Thanks for the replies. I agree purchasing from a bike sight unseen, from Canada and having the bike show up in the original shipping container from KTM makes me a bit nervous. My dad took delivery of a KZ1300 ship from Honolulu back in 1980 and it was relatively easy to assemble. I'm not so concerned or attracted by the price but, the actual bike they offer. Has anyone else seen a "Factory Dual Sport 450EXC" or are they mocking them us for resale as DOT bikes. Their satisfied customer link seems to be filled with happy customers and I assume the bike has the standard warranty of any major brand. Great questions... thanks. I have e-mailed them for a response, specs and photos and will post them for anyone else that might be interested in this particular KTM.

About riding style, thanks for the hook up on the WRs punch. I've read a ton of postings hear about all the free mods, pipe dynos and performance upgrades to turn the bike up a few notches. I'm a True Blue guy as well and the potential of getting a completely set up Dual Sport from KTM (that might still be a great trail bike as well) for $600 is appealing. I am purchasing another bike to ride the open desert, BLM (like Death Valley, Moab, Black Rock) and National Forest around Tahoe. So, I don't need super technical handling but, would like to choose based on a bit more knowledge of the WR's performance, suspension set up and power delivery. Any other comments of mods that you had to do to get your bike dialed in? It seems that everyone that owns a WR loves it and is willing to modify the bike, dial it in and ride it hard.

Additionally, I have hear that the KTM's are much more finicky about maintenance, reliability issues (especially with the LC4 motor) and less access to parts when traveling is a consideration. One thing going for the KTM is that it seems to come with all the aftermarket equipment that would up grade the WR like electronic speedo, over sized bars, plush suspension set up and cushy seat. Any comments?

PS I posted the same question in the KTM section and the only response was someone calling me a "spammer" and that someone should block this guy? Was it inappropriate to post the same question to two groups? Hey, just let me know... :thumbsup:

  • dbailey223

Posted February 22, 2006 - 09:22 AM

#5

I can't figure out why it would be improper to post in 2 forums. Don't feel bad about that at all.

  • pkcof

Posted February 22, 2006 - 06:46 PM

#6

Reliability issues on a new LC4 ?? - no, i don't think so - they'll probably outlast us !
Does the US or Canada version of the 450EXC come with an LC4 engine?? - cause they don't here in Australia - they have the 'newer' engine (LC4 really is getting 'old school').
I agree with turbojedi, in Australia the KTM450EXC is a single track weapon with no more maintenance than a WR450 and i advise you to have a test ride of one before making your decision on what to purchase - then again, this advice is from someone who purchased an '05WR450 and is pretty happy with it !!

  • JSanfilippo

Posted February 22, 2006 - 09:34 PM

#7

The only way to know for sure is to ride both of um

  • wrmotox

Posted February 22, 2006 - 11:04 PM

#8

Advice well taken!

Just an update, I finally got through to the company advertising the "factory dual sport" KTM and as I suspected that they have no more of that model but, have some really nice 450EXCs that are now available. I ask how many did you have from the posting on Jan 28, 2006 and got... "we don't have any left and are you interested in a 450EXC?" No, I replied. And when I asked, "when will you be getting more of the factory dual sports?" I got... "we don't have any left and are you interested in a 450EXC?" Thanks anyway and you can guess the rest of the story.

I called a San Francisco KTM dealer to ask about the "factory dual sport" and he mentioned that yes, he had heard of this dealer and that they were importing European models to the US. He said that I could wait a couple of weeks for a green sticker 450EXC for $8,100 OTD and try to plate it on my own. "What do you mean on my own?" I asked and he went on to say that his days of plating th 450EXC were over 3 months ago when DMV got wise to the KTMs. He did mentioned that there are a couple of people that will plate almost any bike with the Baja Designs for around $1,200 :thumbsup:

Now, I'm thinking worst case scenario is that I get the WR and I don't get the plate and I'll take the plate off my YZF250, remove the WR450 sticker off the new bike and hope they never check the vin numbers when I get stopped. And if I do I'll just say, "Oh my gosh, your right officer! I must have put the wrong plate on the wrong bike... there both blue and it's my mistake!"

So, I picked up the WR450 tonight and can't wait to start on the mods. :bonk:

I'm wondering if I should break the bike in before changing anything. Any comments? Any suggestion on oil to use during break in, frequency between changes and how many miles until I can romp on it? Any recommendations of what to do first or do it all at the same time? :thumbsup:

Here's the aftermarket stuff that is coming for the bike:

Scott Upper Triple Clamp, Dampener and Windham bars
Rally Pro Hand Guards
Over sized YZF Tank and Shrouds - 3.3 gal tank
YZF Throttle Stop
FMF Q2 pipe
Devon Skid Plate
5.6 Kg Rear Spring - Race Tech
4.8 Kg Front Springs - Race Tech
JD Jet Kit
Free Mods Check List

Thanks for the advice in advance!

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  • OneToGo

Posted February 23, 2006 - 01:28 AM

#9

Welcome to TT, what a good outcome to your story..Sort of reminds me of the folly I went thru - trying to get a crated KTM with a warranty...NOT, like you, I ended up with the WR. Similar story..

Advice well taken!

Just an update, I finally got through to the company advertising the "factory dual sport" KTM and as I suspected that they have no more of that model but.......(edited)

I'm wondering if I should break the bike in before changing anything. Any comments? Any suggestion on oil to use during break in, frequency between changes and how many miles until I can romp on it? Any recommendations of what to do first or do it all at the same time? :thumbsup:

Here's the aftermarket stuff that is coming for the bike:

Scott Upper Triple Clamp, Dampener and Windham bars
Rally Pro Hand Guards
Over sized YZF Tank and Shrouds - 3.3 gal tank
YZF Throttle Stop
FMF Q2 pipe
Devon Skid Plate
5.6 Kg Rear Spring - Race Tech
4.8 Kg Front Springs - Race Tech
JD Jet Kit
Free Mods Check List

Thanks for the advice in advance!


You have been doing some shopping, lucky you and what great fun you'll have.
I recommend you read these break-in links and digest the info:

http://www.ntnoa.org/enginebreakin.htm
New Engine Break-in Procedure

http://mototuneusa.c..._in_secrets.htm
Break In Secrets--How To Break In New Motorcycle and Car Engines For More Power
Bottom line for breakin:
Use mineral oil for first 500+km and allow the motor to spin relatively unloaded as per procedures above. Change oil at least every hour or so and filters as required. You want to flush out all the crud that is shed from gears and clutch, also bed in the piston and rings. Switch to synthetics or blends after breakin, some say after 800 to 1500km.
Regarding Mods: I dont know if you have a warranty on the bike but normally any mods will void it. Once you start modding the airbox and exhaust you may have to fiddle with the jetting, the standard needle is non-adjustable. Check INDY's Jetting Dbase for start point with the JD kit.
The free mods will allow the motor to breathe better and achieve (IMHO) a better break-in: grey wire, throttle stop, deplug stock exhaust and airbox snorkle required for this.
All your bolt on bits are right from the start.
Once you are happy with the motor and unconcerned with warranty then its open slather...pipe, fine tune the jetting and let rip.
Enjoy
Colin :thumbsup:

  • wrmotox

Posted February 23, 2006 - 12:08 PM

#10

Thanks for the links and I'll check them out this evening. :thumbsup:

  • SJMC_DON

Posted February 23, 2006 - 12:31 PM

#11

Interesting ..... IMHO dealers like to sell new bikes and are usually eager to haggle down to an agreed $$$. They also (usually) can be relied upon in the event of any problems
I checked the website that you listed and i personally would have a few concerns in doing business that way ...
How is the bike prepared for pre-delivery?
What warranty are you entitled to? (and how do you claim from something that you bought in the 'post')
How do you return it to point of purchase for any problems?
How can you do deals from a local dealer in regards to discounted accessories or ongoing servicing at a competitive rate?
If i was buying a music CD or movie DVD then sure the online way of purchasing is as good as any but for something like what you are describing, well I'd prefer a real dealership that i could trust, rely upon ... and walk into!
...just my 2 cents worth


I bought my 04' WR450 from Int'l M/C Brokers, paid $5,300 in Feb of 04'. I leave north of Seattle so it was real easy for me to drive to the border and make the deal there, so no shipping charges were involved. The bike came in a crate just as it would to the dealer, you the buyer pay no set up fees and you get to put on your bars of choice without having to disassemble the bike :thumbsup: Set up was easy and it gives you the opportunity to go thru the bike entirely.

I bought a bike that was manufactured to be imported by Canada, this meant no throttle stop, no grey wire and the stock exhaust actually bratehed a "little bit", I replaced it with a Q. They gave me a blank, canadian title for me to fill in by hand, I did and took it to my local DOL and just about fell over when they handed me a license plate :thumbsup:

All in all my experience buying a motorcycle this way was good :bonk:

  • pkcof

Posted February 23, 2006 - 08:56 PM

#12

Ahhh .. SJMC DON ... that makes sense cause you actually did walk into the dealer to purchase it.
Don't get me wrong, i like to save a $$ or two like everyone else but the thought of parting with my hard earned cash for a postal delivery makes me a bit nervous ... just my opinion and good luck to the guys that do it successfully !!

  • wrmotox

Posted February 23, 2006 - 10:43 PM

#13

Thanks for the feedback on the Motorcycle-Brokers.com comment. If they had had the KTM bike that was advertised in stock I would have taken the shot. The way their reps handle my two phone conversations made me feel that I would want to see photos of the exact bike I would be taking delivery of and I would just cross my fingers on the KTM being able to plate in CA.

Anyway, I ran the numbers on my WR vs. the KTM and for $1,600 less OTD I can upgrade all I want and still poach the CA plate off my YZF if I need to and give it a dual sport run without getting the bike impounded for the wrong brand all together. Plus I'm not a big tinkerer, I have all blue gear and I just like to wash, gas and go... repeat!

Keep it simple, Go blue...

  • Sleeperdrz

Posted February 24, 2006 - 03:14 PM

#14

Go with the exc if you want a nimble light feeling sweet bike. Go with the wr if you want a heavy , brutish pig. There both fast, wr a little faster.

  • jerryls

Posted February 24, 2006 - 08:11 PM

#15

Thanks for the feedback on the Motorcycle-Brokers.com comment. If they had had the KTM bike that was advertised in stock I would have taken the shot.


I bought my bike from these guys. Don't want anyone to get scared off by some of the above posts.

They aren't a dealership, just a warehouser that provides cheaper grey market bikes. They only sell what they have in stock, and usually won't promise something they can't get (unlike a couple low price internet dealerships here in the US that will promise you anything to get your money, and then tell you the bike is "coming in a couple weeks").

You get a crated bike straight from the factory, and don't have to worry about what some dillweed at the dealership did or didn't do in prepping it.

The only reasons not to order a grey market bike would be if the model your buying has known problems that will require warranty work (valves on certain makes), or if you live in Californistan and have green/red licensing crap to worry about. Other than that, it a great deal.

Jerry
PS: Zach-I expect little discount on my next bike for defending your business!

  • MJScore

Posted February 26, 2006 - 08:03 PM

#16

Would it be hard to register a 06 WR450 bought from this palce here in California? Would it still be a green sticker bike? That would make my decision.




 
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