Flooding/Hard to start after a fall or stall



13 replies to this topic
  • Harold_in_So_Cal

Posted January 03, 2001 - 10:19 PM

#1

I have been having a big problem starting my WR after I fall or occasionally after a stall. A few weeks ago I went on a really hard ride up a mountian with a lot of rutted out switch backs. Dropped the bike at least 3 times going up. Each time I would pick it up, open the hot start, find TDC and try to kick it over, it wouldn't start. Then I would pull in the compression release, kick it through about 10 to 20 times and then find TDC and still it wouldn't start. I was very carefull not to touch the throttle. I would kick wait kick wait. Never any hint of starting. Then 10 to 15 minutes later it would fire. This even happened a couple of times when I stalled.

Any help is appreciated. This set me back about an hour or more and I was almost dead by the time the thing started. Other than that no starting problems (for those of you who remember my Moab difficulties) however, still backfires when I kill the engine.

Thanks- Harold

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Harold
2000 WR

  • ande749

Posted January 04, 2001 - 12:34 AM

#2

Originally posted by Harold in So Cal:
...Each time I would pick it up, open the hot start, find TDC and try to kick it over, it wouldn't start. Then I would pull in the compression release, kick it through about 10 to 20 times and then find TDC and still it wouldn't start. I was very carefull not to touch the throttle.


Did you try without using the hot start knob? I hardly ever use it. My bike starts fine without the hot start when stalled hot. Have fallen only twice in 12000 km, so don't remember how I started after a fall...

I have understood, that when you kick the bike with the compression release held, you should have the throttle wide open. I believe this is used to dry the plug.

Ande

  • MN_Kevin

Posted January 04, 2001 - 06:19 AM

#3

Harold,
Did you ever have that bike checked out at the shop?

Did you check out the TPS? Grab yourself a multi-meter and follow the book.

How about your float level?

One thing you can try is removing that vent check valve off of your tank's vent line. I do know several of us have removed it, including the Guru Clark. It is one less variable to screw with.

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'99 WZ with all YZ mods, FMF PowerBomb header, Stroker SX-1 silencer, SS front brake line, forked over by Pro-Action, OEM YZ tank and IMS seat.

  • Guest_Guest_*

Posted January 04, 2001 - 07:06 AM

#4

Try puting a new plug in.

  • tripm

Posted January 04, 2001 - 07:08 AM

#5

I need to use the hot start when I crash. It usually seems to work. And I crash a lot.

Mark

  • Ol'89r

Posted January 04, 2001 - 07:58 AM

#6

Harold. I use the proceedure suggested by ande749. When you flood the bike, hold the throttle wide open and kick with the compression release pulled. Kick it several times 5-10 times then close the throttle and use the regular starting drill. This will clean out a flooded engine. Works for me.

Ol'89r

  • Harold_in_So_Cal

Posted January 04, 2001 - 08:00 AM

#7

Kevin- when you say you remove the vent valve tube what exactly is that. My Ty davis tank came with a gas cap that was different than my stock cap and I run a small tube that goes straight up with a metal cap. I also tried a long tube with no cap but no difference. Have you taken your tube off completely? I haven't yet had my TPS or float level checked. I wanted to get a few ideas before approaching the problem. Will probably check those things out very soon.

[This message has been edited by Harold in So Cal (edited 01-04-2001).]

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  • Brian_in_Long_Beach

Posted January 04, 2001 - 08:21 AM

#8

Harold,
sounds like you had some trouble on Snowy.....

Kevin & the others have the right ideas - float level & TPS. I'm going to add that you check the throttle shaft adjustment - on the technical page. Just an idea.

Additional info - my '88 XR600 had the same symptoms as your bike. I couldn't start that thing for 15 minutes after a fall. The older XRs had a problem with the exciter coil on the stator assembly. I replaced the stator with a '91 or newer version and it really helped. My point? Check ALL the electrical specs for out of range values.

Your bike seems to be the anomaly on the board. I routinely stall my bike and it never takes more than 2 kicks (ok, 3 if I'm tired) to fire up with the hot start button open.

More additional info:
the steering damper pin that fits into the tower on my bike will rise due to the expansion of the air in the cavity below the pin. The grease provides a good enough seal so that I have small piston & cylinder....
Just think of the pressure that can build up in the tank if your gas cap isn't venting properly.

Brian

  • MN_Kevin

Posted January 04, 2001 - 08:27 AM

#9

Harold, the vent check is that little inline valve you have in your vent line. I recall you have that short line with the check valve on it. Just use a longer straight tube and stuff the end in the steering stem hole beneath your handlebars. This is the way it was always done "in the old days". Newer is not always better!

Take Care, Harold!

Kevin

  • Ron_in_SoCal

Posted January 04, 2001 - 09:47 AM

#10

A not-so-clean air filter can make 'em hard to start. With the lack of rain here in Cal, my filter gets wasted far too quickly these days.

Just a thought…

So where was it - Snowy or Ridgeroute?

  • James_Dean

Posted January 04, 2001 - 10:06 PM

#11

Harold,

I know your pain.

Here are some suggestions:

1) Remove vent check valve on the tank (same as others stated above)
2) Keep a slightly fast idle setting
3) Make sure the pilot circiut is not too rich - what pilot and screw setting are you at?
4) Lower the float level 1mm
5) Do your starting procedure EXACTLY as you described.
6) Don't fall down, don't stall. :)

James

  • Clark_Mason

Posted January 04, 2001 - 07:58 PM

#12

I have not yet once stalled my XR650R which is a different experience from that of my WZ 420. Harold get a bike with more low end torque or add a 7.5oz flywheel weight to your scoot.

Clark

  • Brian_in_Long_Beach

Posted January 05, 2001 - 08:47 AM

#13

hmmm,
cost effective solution - XR650R or flywheel? decisions, decisions :)

Would the CARB vent tubes - NOT the tank vent - cause these kind of problems?

Harold - So which trail was it?

Brian

  • Harold_in_So_Cal

Posted January 05, 2001 - 12:48 PM

#14

Brian- it was Snowy trail. We went up a road for about 10 miles to the top of the mountian then dropped in the trail. It was fantastic. Reminded me of riding back in Alabama. Trees with leaves. Trails with Dirt not too whooped out. We went down the mountian single track. Awesome. Then the trail got steeper and I was thinking "Boy I'm glad were going down instead of comming up- some of these places would be kind of hard with big drop offs to the side. Got to the bottom- cool little stream crossing. Then I realize the trail had to go up another mountian. So we are going up these narrow switchbacks that had big deep ruts in them. Some were to tight to turn so I would use the little turnaround area. Even when I fell (which was 3 or 4 times) it was no big deal and I was laughing. The problem was getting the bike started. Like I said it would take 10 to 15 min per fall and take all my energy kick. Literally I would kick 50+ plus times with no results. If the bike would fire up I wouldn't care if I fell and I would be a lot more likely to try the hard stuff. I was with a buddy and it even makes it hard to help someone because unless I can use my kickstand I don't want to lean the bike over.

These answers (and the ones on the YZ site- yes I double dipped) have been good. I'm going to make a list and print the postings off and take my bike to Montclair Yamaha tomorrow morning. Before the supercross.

Live the dream,

Harold




 
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